Car (or bike) Chat!

[AJSki2fly]

he seemed to try and change lanes when it happened which may have made things worse as the traffic in other lane wasnt following his speed, but again if it was the computer then it is likely another nail in its coffin... and musks.. tesla and his new toy are burning down

Looking at the report, the videos and the traffic report there is no factual evidence I can see to confirm why the car came to a halt in the inside lane. The driver claimed it was in FSD, but I believe that is all at present and blamed that for the car stopping. Tesla will be able to access the cars data store which records exactly what the car was doing before the car came to a stop. It may be possible that the drive actually over road the car and hit the brake for some reason, that will show in the car data. I believe similar incidents with Tesla vehicles have been shown to have been caused by human intervention(the driver) doing things they should not have.

[Macca]

After selling my triumph speed triple a few months back I'm looking forward to collecting my first KTM at the weekend. It's a 1090 adventure. Given my slight hip discomfort from an old back injury this slim v twin engine and an upright riding position it should be a good fit for me. I can't wait to put some miles on it! 3076630767

Sent from my Redmi Note 9 Pro using Tapatalk

Cool bike - your going to have fun on that - well at least when the weather gets a bit better.

[dave2010]

Looking at the report, the videos and the traffic report there is no factual evidence I can see to confirm why the car came to a halt in the inside lane. The driver claimed it was in FSD, but I believe that is all at present and blamed that for the car stopping. Tesla will be able to access the cars data store which records exactly what the car was doing before the car came to a stop. It may be possible that the drive actually over road the car and hit the brake for some reason, that will show in the car data. I believe similar incidents with Tesla vehicles have been shown to have been caused by human intervention(the driver) doing things they should not have.I don't have FSD, but the Tesla cruise control definitely puts the brakes on sometimes when I wish it wouldn't. Tesla probably has a legal let out in the UK in that it's arguably only supposed to be used on motorways, rather than A or other roads. That plus the lane swerve thing is a pain too - though I don't think Teslas are the only cars to do that. For example moving towards or "even worse" crossing a white line to avoid a large puddle by the gutter, or an ice patch, can cause all sorts of unwanted mayhem. That's not in itself normally a major problem, but it just adds (unncecessarily ...) to the stress of driving - something which these features are really supposed to avoid or reduce.

[AJSki2fly]

Hi Dave, I am not sure that full FSD is available on UK registered Teslas? We have Autopilot on ours which is one stepaway, primarily no auto overtaking on motorways and no auto turn at junction and so on.

The braking you talk about is is part of the safety features of a Tesla, I agree it can be a surprise some times, but we have found that there is usually a obstruction/reason for it, a lot of modern cars do the same. You can lessen the sensitivity for parked cars in town driving.

All I can say it probably saved a cyclists life who put his front wheel three foot out into the main road from a side side just to see around a car he was next to, we were on the main road at 50mph, we would have likely hit it if the Tesla had not emergency braked.

[dave2010]

One other possible snag with EVs relates to tariffs. A couple of days ago I plugged the T3 in. I usually set this up to come on at the start of the off peak period, and set the charge level so that it should finish by the end of that time.
I may have made a mistake, so that looking at the Octopus chart for that day there was a substantial amount of energy consumed in the peak period - probably £10 or more.

Still it's only the first time in a few years that I'm aware of this kind of error, but with a factor of over 5:1 between the cheap rate and the peak rate I certainly don't want to do this too often.

If it wasn't my error, then something must have gone wrong with the control in the car.

It would be good to have a timer on the charging unit too, so that possible mistakes could be reduced in number.

[struth]

One other possible snag with EVs relates to tariffs. A couple of days ago I plugged the T3 in. I usually set this up to come on at the start of the off peak period, and set the charge level so that it should finish by the end of that time.
I may have made a mistake, so that looking at the Octopus chart for that day there was a substantial amount of energy consumed in the peak period - probably £10 or more.

Still it's only the first time in a few years that I'm aware of this kind of error, but with a factor of over 5:1 between the cheap rate and the peak rate I certainly don't want to do this too often.

If it wasn't my error, then something must have gone wrong with the control in the car.

It would be good to have a timer on the charging unit too, so that possible mistakes could be reduced in number.

my charger can be set to charge if and when, as can car.

[dave2010]

my charger can be set to charge if and when, as can car.Not sure if our charger can do that. It may have features which we didn't know about, as did the one it replaced which was faulty. In that case we complained when it developed a fault, but the interesting thing was a comment from the support staff "We knew it had a problem as we could check it remotely". We can turn the charger off with a key - but for the most part we leave it on, and don't bother to unplug the cable. If there's another way to control the charger (BP) it would be useful to know. Apart from cutting the power, that is - which we can do - but that may reset the whole caboodle. We used to have to regularly reset the previous model, or cut the power, but we haven't needed to do that for some time.

Clawing some of the overcharged (!!) electricity costs back now in the payback hour which Octopus indulge in occasionally. Basically if we minimise our use of electricity during the designated hour we get a payback related to the difference between an estimated cost of what "we" normally use minus what we actually use, and apparently that might be quite considerable and worth having.

[struth]

Not sure if our charger can do that. It may have features which we didn't know about, as did the one it replaced which was faulty. In that case we complained when it developed a fault, but the interesting thing was a comment from the support staff "We knew it had a problem as we could check it remotely". We can turn the charger off with a key - but for the most part we leave it on, and don't bother to unplug the cable. If there's another way to control the charger (BP) it would be useful to know. Apart from cutting the power, that is - which we can do - but that may reset the whole caboodle. We used to have to regularly reset the previous model, or cut the power, but we haven't needed to do that for some time.

mine has an app with it so there is a few things it can do. its a captive cable tho so if you want it off, say when say for a while i'd have to flip switch i guess. its an ohme charger, but its currently still set at half power as ive not had the cables replaced.

[AJSki2fly]

Not sure if our charger can do that. It may have features which we didn't know about, as did the one it replaced which was faulty. In that case we complained when it developed a fault, but the interesting thing was a comment from the support staff "We knew it had a problem as we could check it remotely". We can turn the charger off with a key - but for the most part we leave it on, and don't bother to unplug the cable. If there's another way to control the charger (BP) it would be useful to know. Apart from cutting the power, that is - which we can do - but that may reset the whole caboodle. We used to have to regularly reset the previous model, or cut the power, but we haven't needed to do that for some time.

Clawing some of the overcharged (!!) electricity costs back now in the payback hour which Octopus indulge in occasionally. Basically if we minimise our use of electricity during the designated hour we get a payback related to the difference between an estimated cost of what "we" normally use minus what we actually use, and apparently that might be quite considerable and worth having.

Dave if you have one of these below BP then there is a app to download and you can schedule charge times from your phone

See https://www.bppulse.co.uk/charging-at-home/bp-pulse-home-smart

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230124/8931d96640832ab450f61df6e9d09550.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230124/5490f0ac7df39ae9e0cc77dfa8bf2c5d.jpg

[dave2010]

No - not got one of those, and at that price I’ll just suffer the modest “loss” due probably to a minor mistake. It’ll be cheaper that way. More concerning now is the water which seems to have got into the back of the T3. I continue to be extremely disappointed with the T3, and am now waiting for a reply from Mr Musk - from Deer Creek Road, Palo Alto. I may have to accept that there may never be one, and sell the wretched thing at a massive loss.

[AJSki2fly]

No - not got one of those, and at that price I’ll just suffer the modest “loss” due probably to a minor mistake. It’ll be cheaper that way. More concerning now is the water which seems to have got into the back of the T3. I continue to be extremely disappointed with the T3, and am now waiting for a reply from Mr Musk - from Deer Creek Road, Palo Alto. I may have to accept that there may never be one, and sell the wretched thing at a massive loss.

Dave have you checked the boot rubbers are not damaged in some way, I know from previous cars water finds it way in easily. Jaguar RFs are notorious for the same, my friends would end up with 2 inches of water in the boot. I fixed it with some sealant where the rubbers allowed water to get in. Our old Honda Jazz had a water issue in the boot, I removed the boot seal, and one boot hinge at a time, after carefully cleaning everything off with alcohol and drying off I sealed under the hinges and bolts with the sealant and refitted the rubber seal with sealant, the boot has been bone dry for over 2 years. This is known issue on a Jazz as well.

[dave2010]

I guess I’ll have to look into the water ingress issue soon. This has been a problem with previous cars, but I didn’t expect it for a car less than 3 years old. It’s a real pain, and I only just noticed it. At this stage I’m not sure whether the water is coming in from above or below.

[AJSki2fly]

I guess I’ll have to look into the water ingress issue soon. This has been a problem with previous cars, but I didn’t expect it for a car less than 3 years old. It’s a real pain, and I only just noticed it. At this stage I’m not sure whether the water is coming in from above or below.

Lots of info on this thread https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/water-ingress-into-sub-boot.196597/ it may help you identify the issue, personally I would get Tesla service to resolve the issue it should be under warranty.

[struth]

I guess I’ll have to look into the water ingress issue soon. This has been a problem with previous cars, but I didn’t expect it for a car less than 3 years old. It’s a real pain, and I only just noticed it. At this stage I’m not sure whether the water is coming in from above or below.

build quality is certainly suspect in the teslas, and after sales service is too or so im told. a lot of chinese cars will be heading to our market soon i think and this may become more prevalent.

[Barry]

I have never had a problem with water leaking into the boot on any of the cars I have owned (including a Daimler 'Double Six'). The build quality of new cars must be lower than it once was - I know car manufacturer's are doing all they can to cut costs: no longer providing a proper spare wheel for example.

[Pigmy Pony]

With modern cars the emphasis seems to be on technology and styling, with solid engineering taking a back seat.

[Barry]

Well said that Man!

[Firebottle]

With modern cars the emphasis seems to be on technology and styling, with solid engineering taking a back seat.

They come without a back seat as well!?

[Barry]

They come without a back seat as well!?

Yes - they're called "Smart" cars. :D

[Pigmy Pony]

You can get Smart cars with four seats. But I wouldn't want to be in the back.


https://youtu.be/POS8YVHC1zM

[walpurgis]

Yes - they're callrd "Smart" cars. :D

Which I call 'wheelie bins'.

[walpurgis]

You can get Smart cars with four seats.

It's just a Mitsubishi Colt under the skin, the body panels are 'posher'. Not a bad little motor.

[dave2010]

Lots of info on this thread https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/water-ingress-into-sub-boot.196597/ it may help you identify the issue, personally I would get Tesla service :lol::doh::eyebrows:to resolve the issue it should be under warranty.Thanks for the link. Re the suggestion: That has to be a sick joke! My letter to EM was signed for at Deer Creek Road last Tuesday. "Wot service"!

[Pigmy Pony]

Thanks for the link. Re the suggestion: That has to be a sick joke! My letter to EM was signed for at Deer Creek Road last Tuesday. "Wot service"!

Tesla will come to regret their complacency, plenty of other EV manufacturers doing what they do, and probably doing it better.

[struth]

Tesla will come to regret their complacency, plenty of other EV manufacturers doing what they do, and probably doing it better.

share price has been dropping, although its still a long way from screwed... it shows how much they make per unit when they can discout them by 7k and still make a profit tho.. chinese parts and labour i guess helps a lot.

[AJSki2fly]

Tesla will come to regret their complacency, plenty of other EV manufacturers doing what they do, and probably doing it better.

XPeng and another manufacturer in China I can't remember who are the only ones that come close to proper battery management to max out range and usability, Xpeng FSD is better, there is a video of one driving itself across a major city in busy traffic for 30 minutes, amazing stuff.

[struth]

nio and byd are supposedly entering uk market this year.. interesting times

[dave2010]

I have never had a problem with water leaking into the boot on any of the cars I have owned (including a Daimler 'Double Six'). The build quality of new cars must be lower than it once was - I know car manufacturer's are doing all they can to cut costs: no longer providing a proper spare wheel for example.Many of the newer cars don't come with any sort of spare wheel. If you're lucky they'll give a you a can of something to squirt into the tyre which it's claimed will fix most tyres until they're taken to a tyre repair shop. Won't help against more serious problems, or vandals slashing tyres though.

[dave2010]

A recent quote for replacement disk pads (and what else?) from a local Halfords for a Hyundai i10 is not too much under £400 - around £370 I think.

Reason for asking - unexplained noise - seemed to be road related, rather than engine related.

Not my car, and probably will need to be done anyway, but explanation of what the issue is, and whether a proper inspection has been carried out, seems to be lacking.

Simply saying "we couldn't hear any noise" doesn't seem like a good diagnostic test. In these wild parts probably no sensible alternatives, but in a town or city with more providers I'd be looking at others.

[struth]

seems a bit high david unless they are doing discs too and all 4... pads should give you 45k mileage...

here is a checker page (once i find it in my saved stuff i will add it in) lol

edit... https://www.checkatrade.com/blog/cost-guides/brake-pad-replacement-cost/

[dave2010]

seems a bit high david unless they are doing discs too and all 4... pads should give you 45k mileage...

here is a checker page (once i find it in my saved stuff i will add it in) lol

edit... https://www.checkatrade.com/blog/cost-guides/brake-pad-replacement-cost/Thanks for that. I suppose there might also be a "justifiable" increase over last year's prices.
Not perhaps really so justifiable, but some prices have gone up by 20-40% since last year.

Interesting article that. The suggestion not to do any work on brakes yourself makes sense, though I have done work on brakes in the past - when I was younger and even more stupid than now!

[struth]

Thanks for that. I suppose there might also be a "justifiable" increase over last year's prices.
Not perhaps really so justifiable, but some prices have gone up by 20-40% since last year.

Interesting article that. The suggestion not to do any work on brakes yourself makes sense, though I have done work on brakes in the past - when I was younger and even more stupid than now!I used to do my own too when younger. As long as you know what your doing and are careful it was safe.
Modern cars may be different tho.
Mind you I stripped a Landover gearbox and put it back so I was fairly good at mechanics

[CageyH]

I would prefer to change the brakes myself rather than have some monkey at Halfords do it.
At least you know it will be done properly.

[CageyH]

Many of the newer cars don't come with any sort of spare wheel. If you're lucky they'll give a you a can of something to squirt into the tyre which it's claimed will fix most tyres until they're taken to a tyre repair shop. Won't help against more serious problems, or vandals slashing tyres though.

They have started to realise that when the wheels are poorly fitted after a service or tyre change the average motorist cannot undo the wheel nuts, so why bother with a spare?

[struth]

They have started to realise that when the wheels are poorly fitted after a service or tyre change the average motorist cannot undo the wheel nuts, so why bother with a spare?

i dont think i got even a tin of spray with mine. so a puncture and car is u.s. its a heavy motor so maybe the spray doesn't work well.....or there is a tin and i don't know about it

[walpurgis]

They have started to realise that when the wheels are poorly fitted after a service or tyre change the average motorist cannot undo the wheel nuts, so why bother with a spare?

First thing I do after buying a car or having work done that involves having the wheels off, is to slacken the wheelnuts with my big breaker bar and re-tighten using the car's wheelbrace. That way I won't be stuck if I get a puncture. (my car carries a spare, not had a puncture for many years though :))

[CageyH]

The funniest things you see is the wheel nuts being tightened with an air impact wrench, and checked with a torque wrench afterwards.
What a complete waste of time….

[struth]

The funniest things you see is the wheel nuts being tightened with an air impact wrench, and checked with a torque wrench afterwards.
What a complete waste of time….

get the thread off and your in deep doodoos with those things.. use a big bar to take out seal then they come off fine if you keep the two clean. alway tighten with a smaller bar. always recheck after a few miles

[dave2010]

Had a couple of issues re home charging in the last month or so. Once was when it looks as though the M3 managed to extract electrical power from the grid during the daytime - ouch. There is a substantial difference between paying 7p per kWh and over 40p for the same units.
Have been more careful since.

The other issue relates to Zoe. Renault have a pretty duff charging setup. It's possible to set the start time, and the end time, but sometimes this doesn't work, so that the (a) the car overcharges, and (b) some charging is carried out at peak rates, rather than cheap rates.

Aha I thought - "can I maybe program the home charger so that it's not active outside of off peak periods?". I suspect the answer is "maybe", but I looked at the details for the BP chargers, and it's hard to find anything about programming them. I also noted the 75% approval rating for the chargers, but a significant number of users suggest that BP's customer service is utterly the pits, and that many of the apps to control the on/off times and charging just don't work. The units are probably too costly, so really not good news. If home chargers were somewhat cheaper I'd consider replacing it, or having a new one, but right now that would cost more than the occasional mishap re getting the charging times wrong or the software in the car not doing the job properly.

Anyone thinking of getting a new EV should really check out the home chargers carefully. Renault made a big thing of the fact that they were providing a "free" home charger with the new car - probably not the only car distributor to do this - but it's not so good if one ends up with chargers which et the scheduling all wrong and as a consequence run up user's electricity bills to levels they didn't expect, or want.

I don't know that I can face trying to deal with BP customer service to find out if our unit can be set to work reliably with its own time schedule. The related website seems only concerned with telling us all how marvellous and easy to use these things are, but nothing at all about how to actually use them or get them set up or maintained in real life.

[struth]

Had a couple of issues re home charging in the last month or so. Once was when it looks as though the M3 managed to extract electrical power from the grid during the daytime - ouch. There is a substantial difference between paying 7p per kWh and over 40p for the same units.
Have been more careful since.

The other issue relates to Zoe. Renault have a pretty duff charging setup. It's possible to set the start time, and the end time, but sometimes this doesn't work, so that the (a) the car overcharges, and (b) some charging is carried out at peak rates, rather than cheap rates.

Aha I thought - "can I maybe program the home charger so that it's not active outside of off peak periods?". I suspect the answer is "maybe", but I looked at the details for the BP chargers, and it's hard to find anything about programming them. I also noted the 75% approval rating for the chargers, but a significant number of users suggest that BP's customer service is utterly the pits, and that many of the apps to control the on/off times and charging just don't work. The units are probably too costly, so really not good news. If home chargers were somewhat cheaper I'd consider replacing it, or having a new one, but right now that would cost more than the occasional mishap re getting the charging times wrong or the software in the car not doing the job properly.

Anyone thinking of getting a new EV should really check out the home chargers carefully. Renault made a big thing of the fact that they were providing a "free" home charger with the new car - probably not the only car distributor to do this - but it's not so good if one ends up with chargers which et the scheduling all wrong and as a consequence run up user's electricity bills to levels they didn't expect, or want.

I don't know that I can face trying to deal with BP customer service to find out if our unit can be set to work reliably with its own time schedule. The related website seems only concerned with telling us all how marvellous and easy to use these things are, but nothing at all about how to actually use them or get them set up or maintained in real life.

mine is an Ohme charger. it can be set to times etc and to follow the cheapest rate etc. i dont have a cheap rate tho so i just plug it in and let it charge. it was plugged in yesterday and took about 3 hrs for what was only 20% charge. its still plugged in but it wont charge anymore as car is full. i can set it to whatever % i want in both the ohme charger and the car's ap, which is the one i mostly use..hyundai ap is quite good.

[CageyH]

My charger plugs into to a standard socket, so I have a suitably rated smart plug that controls the charger, as a back up solution.
I don't want to overcharge the battery.

My electricity costs the same during off peaks hours, as there are no interesting tariffs available here. I did the calculation for peak/off peak, and we were better staying on a standard rate.

[dave2010]

My charger plugs into to a standard socket, so I have a suitably rated smart plug that controls the charger, as a back up solution.
I don't want to overcharge the battery.

My electricity costs the same during off peaks hours, as there are no interesting tariffs available here. I did the calculation for peak/off peak, and we were better staying on a standard rate.Yes, but aren't you using a plug-in hybrid - IIRC? They probably don't store as much energy, or take as long to charge, so can (perhaps) run off a simple plug-in charger. We do have a plug-in charger for the M3 - but hardly ever use it - and the recommendation is to never use it on a extension cable or other accessary. Perhaps it's OK with some very low power, low rate chargers.

I guess if I was "forced" (by circumstances) to use one on an extension cable I would, but otherwise I'm not trying that. In the UK the ratio between some off-peak tariffs and max rate is over 6:1. Definitely worth keeping control over the timing. Even 5 minutes on a 7 kW charger daily can mount up considerably, so I always try to avoid having any accidental overlaps.

If we ever fit a storage battery system [possible, but quite expensive] then we might adopt slightly different approaches. My guess then is that a few minutes leeway with tarriffs would be less critical, as the battery system would already have saved quite a lot of energy for use with cars, though note that most battery systems for home use are typically between 1/4-1/8 the size of a large car battery.

[AJSki2fly]

Yes, but aren't you using a plug-in hybrid - IIRC? They probably don't store as much energy, or take as long to charge, so can (perhaps) run off a simple plug-in charger. We do have a plug-in charger for the M3 - but hardly ever use it - and the recommendation is to never use it on a extension cable or other accessary. Perhaps it's OK with some very low power, low rate chargers.

I guess if I was "forced" (by circumstances) to use one on an extension cable I would, but otherwise I'm not trying that. In the UK the ratio between some off-peak tariffs and max rate is over 6:1. Definitely worth keeping control over the timing. Even 5 minutes on a 7 kW charger daily can mount up considerably, so I always try to avoid having any accidental overlaps.

If we ever fit a storage battery system [possible, but quite expensive] then we might adopt slightly different approaches. My guess then is that a few minutes leeway with tarriffs would be less critical, as the battery system would already have saved quite a lot of energy for use with cars, though note that most battery systems for home use are typically between 1/4-1/8 the size of a large car battery.

We have a Tesla M3, a myenergi Zappi charger for it, 2 SolarEdge 9.7Kwh batteries hooked to a SolarEdge 8Kwh hybrid inverter, the Inverter is also fed with 22 Trina 390Kw solar panels.

Electricity supplier is Octopus on the Intelligent Octopus tariff, 41p outside cheap rate and 7.5p from 23:30 to 05:30, and 51p/day standing charge, we switched to Octopus 2 weeks before they put up the EV/off peak rate to the current 10p/Kwh. We only get the SEG payment for export power at 4.3p/Kwh.

So this is how we use our system.

Winter mid Oct to mid March

The Solaredge batteries charge to full every night during off peak, and so does the Tesla if it is below 90%. The 19.4Kwh from the batteries on most winter days Dec, Jan and March gets us through the peak charging period, without out any grid import for the house. Beer in mind our house is totally electric, NO gas supply, we have a 9Kw Air Source Heat Pump for heating and hot water and all cooking is electric. In days when it goes down to 0- 5C then we can expect to import during peak charge rate around 0-5Kwh, and if down below 0c the 5-10Kwh.

Summer mid March to mis Oct

As we get more sunshine, and it does not mean blue skies days, but brighter days, so for example today, last night we only imported 10.54 kWh at cheap rate to charge the Solaredge batteries to full, today is overcast but we have so far generated 6.02 kWh and exported 450 Wh, so this is either being use by the house or topping up the batteries, the batteries at 9:15 had dropped to 64.5% capacity and now are at 68.8%. Based on yesterdays electricity usage(and current temperatures) by 23:30 I would expect the batteries to drop no lower than 50%.

For those interested, our daily heating profile is 5:45 to 9:00 - 20.5C, 9:00 to 16:00 21:30 - 21C and 21:30 to 5:45 - 17.5C. if the temperature drops 0.5C below the lowest setting at any time it will cut in and return it to the temperature set. For example yesterday our heating was on for 7hrs 44mins, with two pre-heats period one at 4:02 slowly raising the temperature from 19C to 20C and the second pre-heat from 15:00 to 16:00 raise the temperature to the 2C set at 16:00. The pre-heat is down by the system and it determines the necessary power on time based on outside and indoor temperatures for it to see the set requirements. it can be modified as you wish, but it self learns and optimises the systems to minimise power usage.

I recently found a very useful software modelling tool from the National Renewable Energy Laboratory(NREL in USA) called System Advisor Model(SAM), and it is FREE. SAM is very sophisticated you can select the actual inverter(s), solar panels, batteries that is in your system, or planned, enter the exact electricity rates for export and import down to half hourly, and import the actual solar radiance figures captured for where you live. I used the SOLCAST data which is an EU solar monitoring organisation, and downloaded the data for the our grid reference for the past 20 years into SAM. You can also enter costs for the hardware and a host of other data. The data for manufacturers kit gives all the operational AC/DC Voltage ratings, Kwh ratings, maximum/minimum power, losses due to temperature impact and other stuff.

What was very interesting is I plugged in everything for our system and ran the simulation and the figures are within a £50 electricity cost of what the system is doing for its first year of operation, I did my own estimates and am pleased that I was within £100. If you look at the electricity cost it shows $703, (substitute £ for $), £180 of this is the standing charge, so the SAM modelled electricity cost is £523 for the year. Based on our bills to date I believe we may be slightly below this, around £450.

Immediately below are the SAM figures and graphs for predicted usage and below them is the actual usage from our SolarEdge system. As you can see our actual figures are very close the SAM model figures.

So if any are interested in Solar/Batteries, costs/savings you can model it and get a very good idea of how it may work for you. One word of advise, to maximise benefit you need to understand what your average peak usage is in a day in the middle of winter, this will give you a base to work from. So for example if you use 20Kwh in a day then it would be sensible to have the ability to store that amount, but also you need to establish what the maximum you can capture is, this will be determined by number of solar panels, which way they face and what the total watt rating is. You can plug the basics into SAM and then play around to get the best you can for your needs. I hope some might find this useful.

https://i.postimg.cc/pr6CMtrM/Screenshot-2023-03-01-at-14-37-43.png

https://i.postimg.cc/pTkkkjtT/Screenshot-2023-03-01-at-14-39-04.png

https://i.postimg.cc/L5XDWsHV/Screenshot-2023-03-01-at-15-07-45.png

[CageyH]

Yes, but aren't you using a plug-in hybrid - IIRC? They probably don't store as much energy, or take as long to charge, so can (perhaps) run off a simple plug-in charger. We do have a plug-in charger for the M3 - but hardly ever use it - and the recommendation is to never use it on a extension cable or other accessary. Perhaps it's OK with some very low power, low rate chargers.

I guess if I was "forced" (by circumstances) to use one on an extension cable I would, but otherwise I'm not trying that. In the UK the ratio between some off-peak tariffs and max rate is over 6:1. Definitely worth keeping control over the timing. Even 5 minutes on a 7 kW charger daily can mount up considerably, so I always try to avoid having any accidental overlaps.

If we ever fit a storage battery system [possible, but quite expensive] then we might adopt slightly different approaches. My guess then is that a few minutes leeway with tarriffs would be less critical, as the battery system would already have saved quite a lot of energy for use with cars, though note that most battery systems for home use are typically between 1/4-1/8 the size of a large car battery.

Yes, A Skoda Superb IV. I can charge using 10A or 16A. Probably not enough for an EV but suits my PHEV fine.

[dave2010]

We have a Tesla M3, a myenergi Zappi charger for it, 2 SolarEdge 9.7Kwh batteries hooked to a SolarEdge 8Kwh hybrid inverter, the Inverter is also fed with 22 Trina 390Kw solar panels.

Should that be 22 Trina 390 W solar panels? 22*390 W comes to around 8.5 Kw.

Currently we are waiting to see if we can get an ASHP installed, so batteries - if we go for them - will come later - or not!

How big are the batteries?

Possibly we are now too old to worry about payback times - sadly! I tried to persuade our neighbour to have PV panels put on the roof of her house - said it would probably save her some dosh, but she's older than us, and she suggested it wouldn't give a return in sufficient time to be worthwhile.

Don't really blame her for that.

[AJSki2fly]

Yes it is 22*390w = 8.5kw

We are limited to 7.6kwh out to the grid, by Western Power. A lot of PV installer will try and tell you it can be no more than 3.6kwh for domestic. That is rubbish it’s down to the sub station capacity and current draw that your property is within, although getting more than 10kwh at the moment unless you feed out 3 phase is not likely.

Personally we did not look at from a payback view, for us it is more about insulation from rising power prices over the next 20 years or so, and doing our little bit for the planet, we are not well off, but comfortable I would say. I am 65 and Sue is 62, we don’t have hardly any savings now, it went in the bungalow refurb, the EV, Solar, batteries and heat pump.

Power (however and whatever it’s produced from)costs will go up over the long term, anyone who thinks otherwise is the poroverbial Ostrich IMO. There are many factors that will cause this, as burning stuff becomes more restricted, green energy generation will have to take over, infrastructure costs are not small and do not last forever. Whether people like it or not Nuclear will be needed at some level to support heavy draw periods and when green production is low. We all know building nuclear is very costly and energy companies will want their money back.

No one has heavily invested in tidal generation of electricity yet, there are a few small test plants that show this to be a very good prospect, it is possible that very large tidal station could generate megawatts of power and would operate 24*7, and daily low generation periods could be managed.

By the way if you think you will be able to heat your home with a log burner and limit the power costs, think again. I have been told installation of wooden burner will be legislated against within 2-3 years in a domestic environment, and then burning wood or coal will follow.

The so called renewable energy plant that burns wood pellet in the midlands is scheduled to be shutdown by the end of 2025. It has been realised that burning wood in any form is not ECO friendly, and chopping vast swaths of Canadian timber down to support it and shipping it to the UK does nothing for the planet in any form. All it does it make a few people very rich.

As most know being green or doing the right thing for the future of the planet is not easy, anything any of us do to make it better will help. If you don’t believe that just look at the improvement in air quality when we all went through the sad time of Covid lock down. It improved within weeks and got back to extremely high air quality levels in months, all because we were burning less pollutants.

We won’t be here in 20-30 years, and we don’t have children, so why should we care? Well IMO we have had the free gift of life on a rather beautiful planet, sadly we and our forbears have done a good job of getting close to trashing it, some purely driven by greed. Surely it’s time we made an effort to change that as much as we can?

By the way I and Sue knowvwe are not perfect in the ECO way, we still run a 20 year old Honda Jazz that does about 5k a year, but it will be replaced within 2 years with a small used EV or if it is not cost effective to repair. Also we do fly once a year, and this is not great, the only alternative I can see in the future will be holidays in the UK or EU countries and going by EV and enjoying getting there. I think flying will become too expensive for us in the next 5 years anyway.

I did not intend writing this but thought it worth saying. I make no apologies to the proverbial Ostriches out the.[emoji1]

[struth]

dont fly; have ev. use what power im connected to. it used to be supposedly green, but it probably wasnt;)...dont go hols either. gas heating and unless someone changes it it will stay that way. be surprised if im still around at time to change to those exchangers

[dave2010]

Adrian - I believe 2nd hand Nissan Leafs are considered a good buy. Early models are not very good, but the more recent ones have batteries which will still have some life in them. OK - Nissan use that Chadomo plug thing, but I don't think that's an insuperable problem.

The point is that if you don't do many miles, then the outlay is low with a 2nd hand Leaf, and you already know about the costs of running EVs. Trying to do long journeys in a Leaf - and I've met people who do - seems a total pain, but for everyday use - short distances - really OK.

Here is a YT video showing a view on PV panels from the US - https://youtu.be/jxt3v7kTlvw but most of the details are not currently relevant in the UK.
Interesting that this guy is using 1 MwH per month!

We use logs occasionally, and will be able to continue to do so since the burner is fairly new. It really is useful as a backup in case of grid failures. Re the wood - we have had a lot of locally sourced wood, which we're still working through.
I also bought wood [quite good] but sadly on checking, most of it comes from Lithuania. Really BAD! That's chopping down trees somewhere else, then moving it by road and sea at some expense and environmental damage until it eventually ends up in our wood pile.
We'll try to avoid doing that in the future, or at least moderate/minimise our use of such timber.

[struth]

cant convert the chademo either sadly. still you may find more of them free and available.

edit... ive got 309mls in tank after charging car the other day pretty decent for time of year.

[AJSki2fly]

Adrian - I believe 2nd hand Nissan Leafs are considered a good buy. Early models are not very good, but the more recent ones have batteries which will still have some life in them. OK - Nissan use that Chadomo plug thing, but I don't think that's an insuperable problem.

The point is that if you don't do many miles, then the outlay is low with a 2nd hand Leaf, and you already know about the costs of running EVs. Trying to do long journeys in a Leaf - and I've met people who do - seems a total pain, but for everyday use - short distances - really OK.

Here is a YT video showing a view on PV panels from the US - https://youtu.be/jxt3v7kTlvw but most of the details are not currently relevant in the UK.
Interesting that this guy is using 1 MwH per month!

We use logs occasionally, and will be able to continue to do so since the burner is fairly new. It really is useful as a backup in case of grid failures. Re the wood - we have had a lot of locally sourced wood, which we're still working through.
I also bought wood [quite good] but sadly on checking, most of it comes from Lithuania. Really BAD! That's chopping down trees somewhere else, then moving it by road and sea at some expense and environmental damage until it eventually ends up in our wood pile.
We'll try to avoid doing that in the future, or at least moderate/minimise our use of such timber.

Hi Dave,

Yes, we had the Nissan Leaf high up the list of possible replacements for the Jazz, it will be used mainly for local journeys. The Cha-Cha-demon plug:lol: is a bit of a put off, I will see if there are sensibly priced adapters, I don't understand why Nissan continue to use them, they are not exactly popular or maybe that's just here.

Thanks for the video I will take a look.

[dave2010]

Hi Dave,

Yes, we had the Nissan Leaf high up the list of possible replacements for the Jazz, it will be used mainly for local journeys. The Cha-Cha-demon plug:lol: is a bit of a put off, I will see if there are sensibly priced adapters, I don't understand why Nissan continue to use them, they are not exactly popular or maybe that's just here.

Thanks for the video I will take a look.There are still many Cha-Cha plugs in use. If you have a wall mounted charger which takes a separate cable, it's probably easy to get another with a Chademo end.
It looks as though a Leaf would work with our home charger for example - see https://pod-point.com/guides/vehicles/nissan/2018/leaf - though maybe that only refers to relatively recent models. By the time we need a 2nd hand cheap replacement vehicle I expect all the models we'd look at would be compatible.

If you have a tethered charger [which in many ways is more convenient] then you may not have such an easy conversion. There'd probably be cheap slow chargers available - if you didn't mind a very slow rate of charge overnight.

There's also this on Chademo - https://www.greencarfuture.com/electric/convert-leaf-to-ccs#Whats_the_Problem_with_CHAdeMO

[struth]

problems with convertion was that the computers talked a different language and the locks were on car for ccs and on charger for chademo. dunno if its been solved

[AJSki2fly]

problems with convertion was that the computers talked a different language and the locks were on car for ccs and on charger for chademo. dunno if its been solved

Well having read the article Dave put up we won’t be getting an EV with a Cha-cha connector. It will be CCS so that may put a nail in the Nissan Leaf,

Possibly a used Zoe and buy a beret, or a used Hyundai Kona with wok[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[struth]

Well having read the article Dave put up we won’t be getting an EV with a Cha-cha connector. It will be CCS so that may put a nail in the Nissan Leaf,

Possibly a used Zoe and buy a beret, or a used Hyundai Kona with wok[emoji23]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

kona is a great car and has converted lots of petrol heads on the motability forum. not a big boot but its easy in/out

[dave2010]

Well having read the article Dave put up we won’t be getting an EV with a Cha-cha connector. It will be CCS so that may put a nail in the Nissan Leaf,
Depending on when you might be buying a 2nd EV it's possible the Leaf will still be a goer. Firstly, the price differential may be significant - as the Leafs have been going for around a decade now, so might be possible to pick one up cheaply. Secondly, the newer Leafs may well have CCS, so would still be viable. Zoes will probably be more expensive as a more recent model, though eventually the prices will drop.

[walpurgis]

Tip for cyclists.

If you have cables to feed through outer sleeves and the ends are frayed, degrease the last inch or two of the cable end with thinners and let it dry, then give the end a couple of coats of superglue. When that dries, snip off the frayed bit, grease well and then it should feed through the outer easily as the glue will keep the strands together. You may need to shorten the sleeve to correct for length.

[struth]

good tip geoff

[Pigmy Pony]

Just had insurance renewal notices for my FireBlade and my Vito van.

Bike premium gone from £150 for the year to £140.

Van insurance has gone from £531 last year to £852.

On last year's policy I paid extra for personal accident cover, which has now been removed. They say that the additional cost of this has been removed accordingly, but this just makes their taking-the-piss quote even worse!

They (Dialdirect) won't be getting my money now, on principle. Even if they come back with a reduced quote.

[Pigmy Pony]

And while I'm having a moan, what's going on with the roads? They're all falling apart, I've never seen them so bad. Councils can't even blame frost damage as they have done in the past, the winter hasn't been that cold.

[struth]

Just had insurance renewal notices for my FireBlade and my Vito van.

Bike premium gone from £150 for the year to £140.

Van insurance has gone from £531 last year to £852.

On last year's policy I paid extra for personal accident cover, which has now been removed. They say that the additional cost of this has been removed accordingly, but this just makes their taking-the-piss quote even worse!

They (Dialdirect) won't be getting my money now, on principle. Even if they come back with a reduced quote.

a rip off indeed

[Pieoftheday]

Just had insurance renewal notices for my FireBlade and my Vito van.

Bike premium gone from £150 for the year to £140.

Van insurance has gone from £531 last year to £852.

On last year's policy I paid extra for personal accident cover, which has now been removed. They say that the additional cost of this has been removed accordingly, but this just makes their taking-the-piss quote even worse!

They (Dialdirect) won't be getting my money now, on principle. Even if they come back with a reduced quote.
Who did you use for the Blade Steve? Just insured my yamaha and expected it to go down a bit , stayed pretty much the same

[struth]

I m fortunate i dont have to bother with car insurance now.. Buch of crims

[walpurgis]

Van insurance has gone from £531 last year to £852.

That's about what I paid for my sub 1000cc little Suzuki car.

Insurance is terribly pricey here. It's all the useless bloody drivers in the area that have endless accidents and the car thieves to blame.

[Pigmy Pony]

Who did you use for the Blade Steve? Just insured my yamaha and expected it to go down a bit , stayed pretty much the same

Hi James, that's with Bennetts. I won't be shopping around, I'm happy with that quote. Far cry from when i bought it 17 years ago, when it was about 800 quid, and uninsurable without alarm/immobiliser.

I suppose it all comes down to how often a particular model is nicked or crashed. Which in the case of Geoff's insurance is pretty much everything, as he lives in That London, where you can be the best driver in the world and still be at the mercy of all the knobheads.

[Pigmy Pony]

I m fortunate i dont have to bother with car insurance now.. Buch of crims

https://images2.minutemediacdn.com/image/upload/c_fill,w_720,ar_16:9,f_auto,q_auto,g_auto/shape/cover/sport/sundance-hed-39ce7b2191e2c58cffd1ad2a85ae54d7.jpg

Oi! Who you calling crims? And it's Butch, not Buch!

[Pigmy Pony]

That's about what I paid for my sub 1000cc little Suzuki car.

Insurance is terribly pricey here. It's all the useless bloody drivers in the area that have endless accidents and the car thieves to blame.

It's a shame that insurers base their quotes on post code instead of, well, I'm really not allowed to say. But if they were penalised with higher premiums they just wouldn't bother getting cover. And that's another way that law-abiding folk end up paying more.

[struth]

rereading a good article re ford's old flathead rebooted.. great stuff


https://www.autoweek.com/news/a2057466/fords-fabulous-flathead-engine-just-wont-die/

[walpurgis]

rereading a good article re ford's old flathead rebooted.. great stuff

I expect it will only sell in smaller quantities. Demand is unlikely to be great, hotrodders may like it though. Other modern sidevalve designs exist, Gas Gas motorcycles developed a modern sidevalve trials bike engine, not sure how far that got to.

My brother had a Ford V8 Pilot in the sixties. Not his cup of tea these days :).

[walpurgis]

When was the last time you saw a Peerless GT, if ever? They were a small British firm from Slough and made some pretty cars, they raced at Le Mans. This is a 1959 2 litre. A rare sight now and they were never common.

https://i.ibb.co/wY54w1x/Screen-Shot-03-24-23-at-11-06-AM.png (https://ibb.co/kMNX9FW)

[Macca]

never seen one. Cool car though.

[struth]

was reading that Ford are bringing back the Capri marque as a EV. that might be popular. i had one once

[Macca]

They were bringing it back about 5 years ago as an ICE but it never happened in the end.

Hopefully it will be a better effort than the EV Mustang which is pig-ugly.

We have one of these on demo at work at the moment:

https://www.volkswagen.co.uk/en/electric-and-hybrid/electric-cars/id-buzz.html

Looks quite funky, like a vehicle from the not too distant future.

[CageyH]

258 mile range. :confused:

I could not do a day trip to the beach with the family in that.
Surely there is space for a bigger battery in it than what they have fitted.

[AJSki2fly]

258 mile range. :confused:

I could not do a day trip to the beach with the family in that.
Surely there is space for a bigger battery in it than what they have fitted.

I think you have forgotten when lots of cars had a range of around 250 miles with a 8-10 gallon tank and only did 25-30 mpg. Did we worry about it, no we drove till it was on the red line or near, and if we knew a petrol station was further the 30-40 miles we filled up sooner.

Even in the 90’s I had several cars that struggled to reach 300 miles on a full tank.

We have just been spoilt with 400 mile pulse range in recent years, especially in emitting diesels.

[CageyH]

I think you have forgotten that you can fill a tank with petrol/diesel in about 5 minutes.

On a run my BMW 320D would do over 600 miles (I would get over 45mpg).
My Skoda Superb IV will do over 500 miles (only a 50 litre tank).

The problem is that I don’t want to arrive at a destination, and then look for a recharge point, which may already be taken.
This is why I drive a PHEV and not an EV, as it suits my usage case better.

[AJSki2fly]

Have to disagree, I have done quite a few long trips.

For example, 200 miles to Aberystwyth, done twice and the pretty route through the Elan valley. First time we left with 320 miles of charge, we charged up on arrival for 25 minutes, and had coffee and rest before going to relatives. We took them out and used 30 miles range up, and drove home the next day. The second time on the way home we just popped into the chargers at Bristol, put 50% on the battery which was a 15 minute break, and went home, we recharge the car to full from Solar over the next 2 days.

I regularly go up to Dorking, 170 miles and I know of 4 charging sites on the route with 120kwh chargers, as long as the car has around 50% battery before I go I just leave home, and stop of at a charge site when I get to it, and have a coffee and break, no worries, no big deal.

I have driven up to Derby and back in one day, 210 each way, with outside temp around 0c, had heating on 20c so range reduced by about 8%. I stopped the other side of Birmingham on the way up for 10 mins to top up to 80%, on the way back I did the same at Bristol and had a coffee/pee break.

The only time charging was interesting was when we went via Stevenage to North of Milton Keynes to friends, 240 mile route. We found the charge site on the last leg which we went to on a B road was on the South side of the M1 with restricted access. The one on the North side was 10 miles away. We managed to get in through the service gate when a friendly delivery man turned up. If fact it did not matter we had enough charge anyway to get to our friends and then when we went home drive to another charge site. It was our early days of EV ownership and was being unnecessarily cautious.

I would point out all the charge sites, except Aberystwyth, are one Motorways and we just drove up and plugged up and other charging bays were still available.

I hear your arguments all the time from friends, relatives, other car owners and I’m pleased to say it is unfounded. When I ask them if any have at least tried an EV, with +250 miles range, for 2 or 3 days and done a mix of short medium and long range trips, it’s always return with embarrassed silence.

I just point out I am talking from personal hands on EV experience and ownership, no more no less. Nearly all cars do no more than 50 miles in one trip for 95% of their life. The exceptions are the long distance commuters, but most are sub 100miles to work, the others are reps and managers that spend 50% of their days sat driving in a car.

So a 250 mile range car is more than adequate for most.

Talking of heavy EV users I had a conversation with a suited and booted Tesla M3 driver at one charge site last year. He averaged +35k miles a year in it, it was his second Tesla, the first being moved on at 2 years old. The cost of lease purchase for his company was no different to a similar size ICE BMW or Benz, but the company saved 60% in fuel costs, he said about £8k in 2 years, and about £1500 in servicing costs. He said made economic and Eco sense, I asked how he found the recharging stops, his answer was “No problem, in fact I look forward to a break and a coffee, I often check up on messages/emails or make notes of actions from the last meeting, I am more relaxed driving it and get less stressed, I did not expect that when I first got one. All my colleagues generally feel the same.”

So there you have, an honest and true account of EV ownership, try one and find out.[emoji2]

[struth]

distance is the main issue most have with ev's. in good warmish weather i get over 300 to a tank.. but yes its a lot less than a ice. mine isnt a super rapid charger, only taking a max of about 70 i think, and not for long. so if doing a lot of miles a day a tesla is the best choice. but as said most folk do about 30 odd miles a day tops... if you have a driveway then its a doddle to charge overnight. in fact ive only ever charged at home.

[CageyH]

Have to disagree, I have done quite a few long trips.

For example, 200 miles to Aberystwyth, done twice and the pretty route through the Elan valley. First time we left with 320 miles of charge, we charged up on arrival for 25 minutes, and had coffee and rest before going to relatives. We took them out and used 30 miles range up, and drove home the next day. The second time on the way home we just popped into the chargers at Bristol, put 50% on the battery which was a 15 minute break, and went home, we recharge the car to full from Solar over the next 2 days.

I regularly go up to Dorking, 170 miles and I know of 4 charging sites on the route with 120kwh chargers, as long as the car has around 50% battery before I go I just leave home, and stop of at a charge site when I get to it, and have a coffee and break, no worries, no big deal.

I have driven up to Derby and back in one day, 210 each way, with outside temp around 0c, had heating on 20c so range reduced by about 8%. I stopped the other side of Birmingham on the way up for 10 mins to top up to 80%, on the way back I did the same at Bristol and had a coffee/pee break.

The only time charging was interesting was when we went via Stevenage to North of Milton Keynes to friends, 240 mile route. We found the charge site on the last leg which we went to on a B road was on the South side of the M1 with restricted access. The one on the North side was 10 miles away. We managed to get in through the service gate when a friendly delivery man turned up. If fact it did not matter we had enough charge anyway to get to our friends and then when we went home drive to another charge site. It was our early days of EV ownership and was being unnecessarily cautious.

I would point out all the charge sites, except Aberystwyth, are one Motorways and we just drove up and plugged up and other charging bays were still available.

I hear your arguments all the time from friends, relatives, other car owners and I’m pleased to say it is unfounded. When I ask them if any have at least tried an EV, with +250 miles range, for 2 or 3 days and done a mix of short medium and long range trips, it’s always return with embarrassed silence.

I just point out I am talking from personal hands on EV experience and ownership, no more no less. Nearly all cars do no more than 50 miles in one trip for 95% of their life. The exceptions are the long distance commuters, but most are sub 100miles to work, the others are reps and managers that spend 50% of their days sat driving in a car.

So a 250 mile range car is more than adequate for most.

Talking of heavy EV users I had a conversation with a suited and booted Tesla M3 driver at one charge site last year. He averaged +35k miles a year in it, it was his second Tesla, the first being moved on at 2 years old. The cost of lease purchase for his company was no different to a similar size ICE BMW or Benz, but the company saved 60% in fuel costs, he said about £8k in 2 years, and about £1500 in servicing costs. He said made economic and Eco sense, I asked how he found the recharging stops, his answer was “No problem, in fact I look forward to a break and a coffee, I often check up on messages/emails or make notes of actions from the last meeting, I am more relaxed driving it and get less stressed, I did not expect that when I first got one. All my colleagues generally feel the same.”

So there you have, an honest and true account of EV ownership, try one and find out.[emoji2]

I am glad it is good for you. As I said, it does not fit my usage case.

How long does a Tesla take to charge from a standard 13A plug?

200 miles is not a long trip. I often travel from Toulouse to Brittany. I stop for lunch, but not always at an area dictated by a charging point.

[dave2010]

I am glad it is good for you. As I said, it does not fit my usage case.

How long does a Tesla take to charge from a standard 13A plug?

200 miles is not a long trip. I often travel from Toulouse to Brittany. I stop for lunch, but not always at an area dictated by a charging point.Re how long does a Tesla take to charge from a standard 13A plug - too long! It's occasionally useful to do this for an overnight top up if that's all that's available at a hotel. As I recall from a recent experience, 5 minutes equates to about 1 mile of journey, so a 200 mile journey might take 1000 minutes to charge up - over 15 hours. Tesla destination chargers are much better and could probably do a fairly full charge overnight at a hotel. Tesla fast chargers are really good, and don't really hold up journeys too much. They are not all so conveniently located though. Ideally one wants to be able to have enough time for a coffee, maybe a sandwich or a loo trip. Often the charging time is either too long or too short. Too short is a problem, as in theory one can be charged more for longer stays even if not charging.

Your Toulouse to Brittany trip is around 500 miles. You can use tools such as ABRP (a better route planner) to check on timings. For a journey like that, the charging time is likely to add in something significant. Very probably your choice of a plugin hybrid makes a lot of sense for your usage.

Around the UK most people won't have a problem, though it can be a pain in Scotland as there aren't always a lot of chargers en route, some don't work, and getting to the furthest point from home and discovering that chargers don't work - for whatever reason - is not fun. Adrian's estimates are correct - for most people - but not all. It depends on usage patterns.

I did meet one couple who had experienced a problem as their cable didn't release from the charger, and they had to spend a night in a hotel as a result since they were unable to move their car. All part of life's rich tapestry!

[CageyH]

Until the infrastructure improves, I will stick with my PHEV.
100% electric for commuting and petrol for the longer runs.

The problem is that I often go to rural parts of France, where it is difficult to find a reasonable charger.
I looked in to this, as I was tempted by a Tesla. There were good government grants available when I was car shopping, but based on places I visit often, it was just not practical. I would happily live with a 15 minute stop to top up to 80%, but not when it means a big diversion to visit a Supercharger.

My next car is likely to be 100% electric. I don’t think we will have the choice for much longer.

[struth]

Until the infrastructure improves, I will stick with my PHEV.
100% electric for commuting and petrol for the longer runs.

The problem is that I often go to rural parts of France, where it is difficult to find a reasonable charger.
I looked in to this, as I was tempted by a Tesla. There were good government grants available when I was car shopping, but based on places I visit often, it was just not practical. I would happily live with a 15 minute stop to top up to 80%, but not when it means a big diversion to visit a Supercharger.

My next car is likely to be 100% electric. I don’t think we will have the choice for much longer.

your in eu, so youll be able to use efuel vehicles... britain probably wont as the govt are dicks and hate to seem like they are doing what the eu are.. of course we can hope fore a labour govt in a year or 2... but they will likely blow their chance

[CageyH]

The risk is Marine gets voted in, then anything not French will get frowned upon.

[struth]

The risk is Marine gets voted in, then anything not French will get frowned upon.

she just lost recently so he should be safe for a while. she's a nutter and may well implode between now and next election

[Macca]

your in eu, so youll be able to use efuel vehicles... britain probably wont as the govt are dicks and hate to seem like they are doing what the eu are.. of course we can hope fore a labour govt in a year or 2... but they will likely blow their chance

we already have E-Fuel here but it's really not that much better than ordinary fuel in CO2 emissions, and it doesn't reduce air pollution at all.

Have to say I am looking forward to most vehicles being electric. Lockdown showed how much air pollution was reduced. I live in the loop of an 8 lane highway and the difference was staggering.


When it gets closer to the majority of vehicles being electric there will be charging points everywhere, a lot of money to be made there.


Thought Adrian made some good points with his last post.

[struth]

e fuel will improve; im sure it will as the germans insist :eyebrows:

i like the ev ive got; but i feel its not for everyone and perhaps never will be so we need to adapt existing tech to suit too. we can do it if we are sensible.... fuck what am i saying? politicians and sense:doh:

[Macca]

e fuel will improve; im sure it will as the germans insist :eyebrows:

i like the ev ive got; but i feel its not for everyone and perhaps never will be so we need to adapt existing tech to suit too. we can do it if we are sensible.... fuck what am i saying? politicians and sense:doh:

well even after 2030 you'll still be able to buy a second hand ICE or hybrid, or import one (I don't think they are banning personal imports or grey market imports but maybe they will). I think like Adrian says electric will cover 95 percent of use cases.

Okay I do work at a company that supplies electric vehicles so will probably be open to accusations of bias, but doing that has changed my perspective on it as I've learnt more about them.

[AJSki2fly]

e fuel will improve; im sure it will as the germans insist :eyebrows:

i like the ev ive got; but i feel its not for everyone and perhaps never will be so we need to adapt existing tech to suit too. we can do it if we are sensible.... fuck what am i saying? politicians and sense:doh:

E-fuel is no different to Diesel or Petrol, if you burn stuff that has a carbon derivative you get C02, FFS.

I am sick of companies saying there shitty product is Eco friendly and good for the planet, when it plainly is not, it is just lies and they need to be dealt with, all they are interested in is money!

We all need to “Stop burning stuff”

The only thing I know of if you burn it that is good is Hydrogen which results in water. So if ICE fanatical manufacturers want to carry on building highly inefficient engines, by design, they better get on the hydrogen wagon.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[struth]

currently tho a major issue is europe only produce about 10% of ev batteries... as we(europe and gb) are not popular or especially friendly with countries that have much of the raw materials or ones that make most of the batteries, we are going to be out on a limb..

[walpurgis]

currently tho a major issue is europe only produce about 10% of ev batteries... as we(europe and gb) are not popular or especially friendly with countries that have much of the raw materials or ones that make most of the batteries, we are going to be out on a limb..

As long as there's a demand, it will be met. Money talks, but we'll pay a premium.

[AJSki2fly]

currently tho a major issue is europe only produce about 10% of ev batteries... as we(europe and gb) are not popular or especially friendly with countries that have much of the raw materials or ones that make most of the batteries, we are going to be out on a limb..

I believe that there is large amounts of Lithium in Cornwall and a commercial mine is being put into operation as we type, its aim is to supply the battery industry. However our government needs pull its finger out and get its wallet out to get the moth balled Mega-Factory built and into operation instead of siting on the fence and waiting for a commercial company to build it, probably a foreign one so UK will loose out yet gain. Our politicians have no vision of how/what to invest in and how to protect the UKs future, although they will probably buy shares in the companies that do invest!

There is also a large Lithium source in Australia, but shipping the stuff around the world is not very ECO. CA, USA and Zimbabwe also have large mines.

However Lithium based batteries may not be around for that long, as SAS batteries comes of age. Having said that LPD batteries are 95% recycle-able and can have very long usable life spans way beyond the life of SAS, around 15 years.

Sodium Alumina Solid State (SAS) Battery is obviously made using Sodium and aluminium oxide(from Bauxite and Corundum ore). So production of Sodium in quantity would be needed and Bauxite/Corundum mines, how much and whereat is available I have no idea.

see https://hotcopper.com.au/threads/lpd-lithium-vs-solid-state-battery-technology.7276719/

There are other battery technologies in development including iron based ones, more than likely be used in large storage solutions as not fast charge like LPD, for home and commercial, much cheaper to make and Iron is in abundance.

I think the world will see a variety of battery solutions develop very quickly over the next 5-10 years, each will be refined and will be applied to the appropriate and most effective use in terms of use and length of service. Another key in all the these will be the ability to re-cycle them at a very high percentage level, or we will eventually just run out of base materials at some point in the future, no different to Oil and Gas deposits running out. I suppose in 50 years we could start digging up the moon or Mars for resources, The Expanse (it's a very good sci-fi series on Prime) here we come.

[struth]

cobalt is needed too and china have most of the congolese mines in their pocket...smart movers the chinese

[AJSki2fly]

cobalt is needed too and china have most of the congolese mines in their pocket...smart movers the chinese

Not quite the only source for Cobalt

https://www.cobaltinstitute.org/about-cobalt/cobalt-life-cycle/cobalt-mining/

[dave2010]

The only thing I know of if you burn it that is good is Hydrogen which results in water. So if ICE fanatical manufacturers want to carry on building highly inefficient engines, by design, they better get on the hydrogen wagon.
Sorry no.

Agreed - hydrogen when burnt or used in a fuel cell doesn't produce any bad outputs. Which is a good thing.

BIG PROBLEM: Nearly all hydrogen produced is generated either as a by product of some other very polluting industrial process, or a very energy intensive process. The current claims about hydrogen as a panacea for vehicle use or for a fuel for domestic heating are mostly bogus.

See https://youtu.be/Zklo4Z1SqkE - Sabine Hossenfelder's take on the issue.

[AJSki2fly]

Sorry no.

Agreed - hydrogen when burnt or used in a fuel cell doesn't produce any bad outputs. Which is a good thing.

BIG PROBLEM: Nearly all hydrogen produced is generated either as a by product of some other very polluting industrial process, or a very energy intensive process. The current claims about hydrogen as a panacea for vehicle use or for a fuel for domestic heating are mostly bogus.

See https://youtu.be/Zklo4Z1SqkE - Sabine Hossenfelder's take on the issue.

Yep Dave, producing a clean energy source that does not result in CO2 production is VERY limited.

The answer is basically hydro-electric, wind or solar produced electricity, or nuclear fusion or maybe in the future fission. Unfortunately building stuff will involve CO2 and other greenhouse gas production but will be able to be limited.

Big boats in the future may need to be very cleverly designed, powered by a combination of wind sail, wind turbine and solar for power, possibly hydrogen to run engines all to drive electric motors to the props.

Aeroplanes are quite a difficult technical nut to crack, due to weight limitations, but people are working on it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[struth]

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/porsche-e-fuel-emissions-neutral-synthetic-gas

[Roy S]

With the impending onset of ulez I had to move on the Clio, got this, pedal car hybrid [emoji4]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230403/6db23d811c2bac38cfb04960baa93bff.jpg

[struth]

baby peugeot. nice colour

[dave2010]

Aeroplanes are quite a difficult technical nut to crack, due to weight limitations, but people are working on it.

Surprisingly there are already some small electric planes about to come on line - at least in early stages of trials. Will have to revert back to propellors I think - at least for the short term - and they won't be any good for long distance travel for quite some time.
Might just be viable for some journeys.

[Pigmy Pony]

Surprisingly there are already some small electric planes about to come on line - at least in early stages of trials. Will have to revert back to propellors I think - at least for the short term - and they won't be any good for long distance travel for quite some time.
Might just be viable for some journeys.

Perhaps they could send up planes to recharge the batteries on the move.

[Pigmy Pony]

Gratuitous pic to see if i can make that imgbb as suggested by Geoff (Walpurgis) work for me. Success!

https://i.ibb.co/3SzyXBj/IMG-1121.jpg

I could be persuaded to have one of these evs for nipping to the shops.

[Macca]

got me thinking of the Banana Splits.

https://i.ibb.co/6vSvB4M/splits.jpg (https://imgbb.com/)

The drugs were better in them days.

[walpurgis]

Well that worked OK :).

[Pigmy Pony]

Well that worked OK :).

Yes it seemed to. Thanks Geoff. But that is just some random pic I took in Bulgaria 5 years ago. No idea how it got onto my laptop. I need to learn how to do that next. And also how to crop/resize. But I'm getting there :)

[walpurgis]

Yes it seemed to. Thanks Geoff. But that is just some random pic I took in Bulgaria 5 years ago. No idea how it got onto my laptop. I need to learn how to do that next. And also how to crop/resize. But I'm getting there :)

Have a play with this free image editor: https://www.faststone.org/FSViewerDetail.htm

I've been using it for years. Some very handy tricks!

[Pigmy Pony]

Have a play with this free image editor: https://www.faststone.org/FSViewerDetail.htm

I've been using it for years. Some very handy tricks!

Thanks for that, but might be a bit too technical for someone like me who has barely progressed from cave paintings. I remember that you 'doctored' a pic of my bike I managed to post a few years ago, where you might have been using something similar. Clever and effective, but I'm not nearly there yet :)

[Macca]

A cave painting yesterday

https://i.ibb.co/BVJWmyN/cartoon-kids-pavement.jpg (https://ibb.co/jvY0dyR)

[struth]

google pics is free and can be used on pc and smart phone. has a basic editor and you can import from pc etc . should then be able to post pics via tapatalk that were on pc

[Macca]

There's a Triumph Stag Estate now?

https://i.ibb.co/dM6tvHL/stag.jpg (https://imgbb.com/)

Well there was in 1971.

Never knew such a thing existed but just got mentioned on 'Salvage Hunters.' They didn't have one, or see one, but they did meet a bloke who had some of the interior trim for one.

[struth]

vaguely remember those ugly things

[Macca]

Yeah it's not a looker is it unlike the standard one.

When I was in infant school there was a lad whose mother used to collect him in a Stag. I thought they must be millionaires.

[walpurgis]

There's a Triumph Stag Estate now?

That's not a Stag. Looks like a 2000 MkII or 2500. I had both, but not in estate form. (loved my 2500TC)

Stag was slightly shorter and two door.

[Macca]

That's not a Stag. Looks like a 2000 MkII or 2500. I had both, but not in estate form. (loved my 2500TC)

Stag was slightly shorter and two door.

I did wonder but that is what the pic is supposed to be.

[Pigmy Pony]

In the early 70s my girlfriend's dad had a 2500TC. I thought it looked pretty cool. He was in a high up job with British Leyland, so probably a company car. Her mum had a Triumph Toledo.

[struth]

Dad had a loan of a triumph 2500. Polis used them.
It wasn't as good as the rover tho

[Macca]

In the early 70s my girlfriend's dad had a 2500TC. I thought it looked pretty cool. He was in a high up job with British Leyland, so probably a company car. Her mum had a Triumph Toledo.

had a pal with a Toledo, his first car, bought it off some old geezer, low mileage and mint since it was always garaged and looked after.

Lots of character but slower than a milk float.

[walpurgis]

Dad had a loan of a triumph 2500. Polis used them.
It wasn't as good as the rover tho

I had the Rover P6 V8 too, it may have been slightly quicker but drove like a bus compared to the Triumph.

[struth]

I had the Rover P6 V8 too, it may have been slightly quicker but drove like a bus compared to the Triumph.

i'd agree re handling, but the 2200 was quick; the 3500 was silly. dad had every rover made i guess around the late 50's/60's/70's. tho his fav was probably the super snipe. a beautiful interior in its day, with those bench leather seats and wood dash. so british lol.. he wouldnt but german after fighting them in war right up to his early death, he had this total dislike

[Pigmy Pony]

My old boss once tried to burn me off from the lights with his V8 Rover. I was on my bike. He failed dismally. When I got to work I got a bollocking for riding like a nutter.

[struth]

My old boss once tried to burn me off from the lights with his V8 Rover. I was on my bike. He failed dismally. When I got to work I got a bollocking for riding like a nutter.

:lolsign:

yeah a bike is way too fast with its weight ratio.. rover was fast off mark tho once it got to about 15/20mph is could rock

[walpurgis]

Just arrived. New vacuum brake bleeding set! Not tried one before, but If it's good enough for Edd China it's probably OK :).

https://i.ibb.co/HB4FLNC/IMG-1212.jpg (https://ibb.co/Fm3xksX)

The car went through the MOT with spongy brakes and four workshops have looked at it and not sorted things. I'm pretty sure there's a bit of air in the ABS pump, so that will require a bit of 'creative' bleeding, we'll see.

[struth]

https://www.aa1car.com/library/abs_bleeding.htm

[walpurgis]

https://www.aa1car.com/library/abs_bleeding.htm

Think I read that before. I'll see how I get on.

[struth]

Cute car
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/cute-carice-tc2-two-seater-convertible-netherlandshttps://www.topgear.com/sites/default/files/2023/05/CariceTC2_exterior_front_quarter_Ps.jpg?w=1784&h=1004 (https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/cute-carice-tc2-two-seater-convertible-netherlands)

[Cotlake]

On my second Tesla now and I really like that. So simple as an EV should be. Just a slightly developed ‘dodgem’ car with a proper front. Why do so many EV’s have ugly fronts? Mind you, not sure about the handbrake handle location? Fine if you need an excuse for putting your hand on the passengers knee.

PS I’ve been a member here for a long time but have mostly lurked daily. I know Marco fairly well and have recently thought maybe I should join in more. ‘Yertis’ as we say in the West Country.

[Pieoftheday]

Cute car
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/cute-carice-tc2-two-seater-convertible-netherlandshttps://www.topgear.com/sites/default/files/2023/05/CariceTC2_exterior_front_quarter_Ps.jpg?w=1784&h=1004 (https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/cute-carice-tc2-two-seater-convertible-netherlands)
Not really a car person, that reminds me of a frog eyed Sprite, bloody ugly

[Pigmy Pony]

it would certainly get the nod from Noddy.

[Macca]

On my second Tesla now and I really like that. So simple as an EV should be. Just a slightly developed ‘dodgem’ car with a proper front. Why do so many EV’s have ugly fronts? Mind you, not sure about the handbrake handle location? Fine if you need an excuse for putting your hand on the passengers knee.

PS I’ve been a member here for a long time but have mostly lurked daily. I know Marco fairly well and have recently thought maybe I should join in more. ‘Yertis’ as we say in the West Country.

You are always welcome.

[Macca]

Not really a car person, that reminds me of a frog eyed Sprite, bloody ugly

Seats need to be cream not brown IMO

Just looks wrong.

[Cotlake]

You are always welcome.

Thanks, Macca. Appreciated.

[walpurgis]

Cute car
https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/cute-carice-tc2-two-seater-convertible-netherlandshttps://www.topgear.com/sites/default/files/2023/05/CariceTC2_exterior_front_quarter_Ps.jpg?w=1784&h=1004 (https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/cute-carice-tc2-two-seater-convertible-netherlands)

Whoever styled that has definitely been looking at pictures of the Porsche 356.

https://i.ibb.co/FXxJKvQ/Screen-Shot-05-17-23-at-08-01-AM.png (https://ibb.co/DYVktXB)

[struth]

some similarities yes.. maybe more than some, although it is rather nice for a small sports car. not sure about the dash tho, and seat colour as mentioned

[walpurgis]

On TV news today, Raleigh Chopper kids bike reintroduced. Looks pretty authentic, but it's pricey at nearly a grand.

https://www.bikeradar.com/news/2023-raleigh-chopper/

Original ones have been sought after items for years (for some strange reason :D)

I don't think collectors will be too pleased, this will probably effect values.

[dave2010]

On my second Tesla now and I really like that. So simple as an EV should be. Just a slightly developed ‘dodgem’ car with a proper front. Why do so many EV’s have ugly fronts? Mind you, not sure about the handbrake handle location? Fine if you need an excuse for putting your hand on the passengers knee.

PS I’ve been a member here for a long time but have mostly lurked daily. I know Marco fairly well and have recently thought maybe I should join in more. ‘Yertis’ as we say in the West Country.I'm wondering which Tesla model you are referring to. The newer ones don't - I think - have a brake control anywhere near passenger's knees, unless they climb up above the steering wheel. Ha! What an image!

[struth]

I'm wondering which Tesla model you are referring to. The newer ones don't - I think - have a brake control anywhere near passenger's knees, unless they climb up above the steering wheel. Ha! What an image!

maybe coz it was designed as a lhd initially. i read tesla are stopping making rhd cars

[Cotlake]

I'm wondering which Tesla model you are referring to. The newer ones don't - I think - have a brake control anywhere near passenger's knees, unless they climb up above the steering wheel. Ha! What an image!

I have a Model Y Dual Motor Long Range, but I was referring to the handbrake arm on the Carice TC2!

https://www.topgear.com/sites/default/files/2023/05/CariceTC2_interior_overview_left_Ps.jpg?w=1952&h=1098

[struth]

I have a Model Y Dual Motor Long Range, but I was referring to the handbrake arm on the Carice TC2!

https://www.topgear.com/sites/default/files/2023/05/CariceTC2_interior_overview_left_Ps.jpg?w=1952&h=1098

ah the wee carice. yes its an odd place but guess there wasnt enough room to activate it by driver on his side... maybe not heard of button handbrakes yet.

[Pigmy Pony]

On TV news today, Raleigh Chopper kids bike reintroduced. Looks pretty authentic, but it's pricey at nearly a grand.

https://www.bikeradar.com/news/2023-raleigh-chopper/

Original ones have been sought after items for years (for some strange reason :D)

I don't think collectors will be too pleased, this will probably effect values.

I like that. Although there had to be some concessions made for health & safety reasons, they don't appear to be obvious. Nice to see the ball-busting gear change is there, good on them.

But £950 is a lot to pay for something I may use for a couple of weeks until the novelty wears off. I can see a lot of parents who remember the originals getting them for their kids.

And bollocks to the "collectors".

[walpurgis]

Hope she wasn't taking her driving test :eek:.

https://www.itv.com/news/2023-05-31/watch-as-car-is-propelled-into-air-after-riding-up-tow-truck-ramp-in-us

[struth]

must have been asleep to not see that

[walpurgis]

No need to grow old gracefully, try a brisk mobility scooter! :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1z43muPetNc&ab_channel=DukeVideo

[Firebottle]

Brilliant, good old excessive engineering.

[struth]

Thought it would be battery powered. Sure goes quick

[CageyH]

A ybody here use Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric 6 tyres?
If so, are you happy with them?

[Zoidburg]

Little pic of me and the KTM taken on a weekend trip away up to the north east with my mate. Done about 600 miles over the weekend mainly on a and b roads from Liverpool up to Berwick upon Tweed. Apart from the odd spit of rain it was a fun weekend. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230823/215e208ff7e6146717dcfdaab2944d00.jpg

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

[Zoidburg]

My wife's been talking about getting her own bike for a few years now so as a birthday surprise I bought her a little Mondial HPS 125. Its quite a funky looking bike, modern cafe racer type styling with a little water cooled 4 stroke engine.

I had to ride it home from about 15 miles away which was a real effort lol, suffice to say I didn't fit it at all well. It's a small bike and trying to keep both feet of the pegs made my hip cramp up... I won't be rushing to ride it again but so far Sarahs really enjoying it. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230823/ee3a27e82081e6a8be78204eb90cfd03.jpg

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

[Pigmy Pony]

My wife's been talking about getting her own bike for a few years now so as a birthday surprise I bought her a little Mondial HPS 125. Its quite a funky looking bike, modern cafe racer type styling with a little water cooled 4 stroke engine.

I had to ride it home from about 15 miles away which was a real effort lol, suffice to say I didn't fit it at all well. It's a small bike and trying to keep both feet of the pegs made my hip cramp up... I won't be rushing to ride it again but so far Sarahs really enjoying it. https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230823/ee3a27e82081e6a8be78204eb90cfd03.jpg

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

That looks so cool, and a lot of bike for the money. I think I saw Henry Cole with one recently on The Motorbike Show.

[Zoidburg]

That looks so cool, and a lot of bike for the money. I think I saw Henry Cole with one recently on The Motorbike Show.I'l keep an eye on the motor bike show but I doubt it's featured one of these [emoji16]

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

[struth]

your one a ktm?

[Pieoftheday]

Has anyone had positive results with braided brake lines? The brakes on my Yamaha fz6n arnt bad but the feel of the front brakes is a bit vague and spongey.

[Zoidburg]

your one a ktm?Yes it's a 1090 adventure

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

[Zoidburg]

Has anyone had positive results with braided brake lines? The brakes on my Yamaha fz6n arnt bad but the feel of the front brakes is a bit vague and spongey.Id probably change the pads and bleed the system with new fluid first.

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

[dave2010]

I have just absolutely "had it" with Tesla. They are the worst organisation for service I have ever dealt with, and right now they are ruining my life.

[struth]

I have just absolutely "had it" with Tesla. They are the worst organisation for service I have ever dealt with, and right now they are ruining my life.

they alas have a very poor rep for service etc, or lack of it and their customer relations are worse. build quality is not great im led to believe so i guess its important that they get the first 2 right

[Pigmy Pony]

I think Tesla just became complacent, and they really shouldn't, not with every other manufacturer going electric. If I could afford a Tesla, I'd get a Polestar :)

[Pieoftheday]

Id probably change the pads and bleed the system with new fluid first.

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk
Hello Ben the bike/pads only have 2500 miles on and have loads of wear left, but I think it would be the cheapest option to try. I can do the pads myself but I think I'll leave bleeding the system to someone that knows what they're doing, thank you Jim

[Barry]

I think Tesla just became complacent, and they really shouldn't, not with every other manufacturer going electric. If I could afford a Tesla, I'd get a Polestar :)

My neighbour has a top of the range Polestar. It's a company car, but is a very nice car to have the use of.

If I had the dosh I would buy one anyday over a Tesla. It is a Volvo after all.

Sadly however they are made in China. :(

[Pieoftheday]

My neighbour has a top of the range Polestar. It's a company car, but is a very nice car to have the use of.

If I had the dosh I would buy one anyday over a Tesla. It is a Volvo after all.

Sadly however they are made in China. :(
Whars the issue with China.? Media stories?

[Macca]

they alas have a very poor rep for service etc, or lack of it and their customer relations are worse. build quality is not great im led to believe so i guess its important that they get the first 2 right

we have six Teslas at work, three different models and they have not given any issues. There's also some other EVs - a Jag, a Mustang a Mercedes and a VW.

Only issues have been with the Merc.

[dave2010]

The reason I'm particularly p'd off right now is we wanted to do a road trip - from Scotland right down to the south coast of England and back, stopping off at Sheffield on the way.

The car is almost 3 years old. I'm not quite sure when it has to be MOTd, but it should be 3 years after first registration. It was registered in September 2020 - so does that mean 1st September is when the MOT is due?
It looks as though in fact it was first registered on 8th September - judging by the date on the V5C, which suggests that if I get it MOTd by 7th September 2020 that'd be OK - though I'd get it done before that for safety if I could - as not quite sure.

There is an issue with the rear brake lights - and it turns out the the lights are LEDs and there is water ingress. Tesla agree the part should be changed.

We have tried to request service - but Tesla has a crazy aversion to human beings, and keeps sending out automated messages and cancelling service calls. I don't want to have to drive to Aberdeen and back just to get this done - even if they would/could do it - but that may turn out to be the best option.

We had actually arranged for someone to come yesterday over to Inverness - actually a tad further - but he didn't come anyway. Now he "promises" to come next week.

So if this actually gets fixed, then maybe the car can be MOTd. Unlike around London, getting a drive in MOT is not easy. It often takes a week or two to set up an MOT appointment.

Assuming that we want to leave at the end of the first week of September there's little time to get this done.

Have we got backup plans? Yes - but they are not good or expensive.

We have another EV car, but it would take about 9 hours longer on the whole round road trip. It's not only the distance between charges which would be a problem for that, but also the unreliability of finding charging points. We never intended the small car to be used for long trips - it's really good for local trips and round trips less than 200 miles. The one good thing [one of the few ...] about Tesla is that mostly the charging points are quite easy to find, easy to use and very quick. For other cars charging can be a real pain in the rear end.

We also have a petrol car, but it has been SORNd and would need work done on it [new exhaust] and an MOT. I don't know whether I could get that done in time.

Other options - bus - not really - too far. Train - also a long distance, and very expensive.

Last option - fly and hire cars at destinations. That is possible, but would take time to set up. It would be more expensive than getting the Tesla fixed.

Did we try to get this issue fixed ahead of time? Yes - you bet. I've been trying to get service for this issue from Tesla for over a year now. [aghhh!!!!]

Will we get this fixed? I haven't a clue!

So does that explain why I really hate Tesla? When the car works it goes like a dream - but it has a lot irritating small issues. The service is just appalling.

I wrote to Elon Musk and tracked my letter all the way to California where it was handed in. Any reply? Of course not!

[Macca]

That doesn't sound very good I agree. Which Tesla do you have?

Your other option would be to rent a car and do the whole trip in that.

[Pigmy Pony]

My neighbour has a top of the range Polestar. It's a company car, but is a very nice car to have the use of.

If I had the dosh I would buy one anyday over a Tesla. It is a Volvo after all.

Sadly however they are made in China. :(

Boycotting Chinese goods almost impossible these days Barry. I'm betting that just about any car not made in the US will have some Chinese-made parts in them.

[Pigmy Pony]

Do you not have any friends/family up there you can call on, and do a short term car swap? All you would need is a quick chat with insurers and bung 'em a few quid.

[struth]

Boycotting Chinese goods almost impossible these days Barry. I'm betting that just about any car not made in the US will have some Chinese-made parts in them.

im betting most usa cars are riddled with chinese parts....

[Zoidburg]

Hello Ben the bike/pads only have 2500 miles on and have loads of wear left, but I think it would be the cheapest option to try. I can do the pads myself but I think I'll leave bleeding the system to someone that knows what they're doing, thank you JimA local bike mechanic should be able to bleed them for you for not much.

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk

[Pieoftheday]

A local bike mechanic should be able to bleed them for you for not much.

Sent from my 2201116SG using Tapatalk
Yeah got a great mechanic nearby, Jumbo motorcycle breakers in wakefield :)

[dave2010]

Do you not have any friends/family up there you can call on, and do a short term car swap? All you would need is a quick chat with insurers and bung 'em a few quid.We could probably borrow a Hyundai i10, or if we could get the work done on our Peugeot 207 in time do that, but it is a real pain. Re renting a car - yep I've looked into that. Renting something similar would cost £1000+ not including the electric charging! Probably would make more sense to do fly drive if we could arrange in time.

I'm pushing on Tesla now - but I'm only 20% hopeful so far. Sure - this time I got to speak with someone who said he'd get it sorted - sounded "nice", but then those guys sitting in offices often do - they're not the ones actually going out [or not] to do the work. Backup plan B - using Zoe - definitely not preferred - but feasible. Customer service in the UK is often pretty bad generally - and there was Covid as an excuse for a while - but Tesla is off the scale for abysmality IMO.

Such a shame, as there are some very good things [speed, acceleration, power, charging network] about the cars, some not so good things [rear camera often cuts out, cruise control frequently failis, poor wiper control], but if the service is so dreadful who in their right minds would want to buy one?

[dave2010]

I know there are some sceptics about EVs round here - and indeed many places - but they may indeed really be the way to go, as the oil runs out. Diesel and petrol are certainly more polluting at the point of use, and clearly there are health issues in cities with poor air circulation.

However many will also be concerned about costs - and will perhaps worry more about those than health and other societal issues.

I started to check out how much our proposed trip to the far south of these islands will cost, and somewhat to my surprise, it could be more than if we used a petrol car.

Because of our recent adoption of an air source heat pump for domestic heating - which may eventually turn out to be a good thing - we have changed electricity tariff, so now our cheapest electricity is dynamically priced on a daily basis,
and currently is about 19p per kWh. In a Tesla Model 3 each kWh gives around 3.5 to 4 miles of travel. In a Renault Zoe each kWh may give 4 miles or more - though that depends on how hard the cars are driven.

Assume our round trip is going to be about 1400 miles. So in TM3 that would require perhaps 1400/3.5 kWh = 400 kWh. We could get the first 200 miles at 20p per kWh by charging up at home, so the rest of the journey - 1200 miles - would require 343kWh of charge.
Some of the public charges are high - well over 60p per kWh. So the total cost could be £57*0.2 + 343*0.6 = £218 or even more as some of the chargers charge more than 60p per unit, and some also charge ridiculously high penalty charges for overstaying.

A petrol car doing the same 1400 miles might do 40 mpg, so need 35 gallons, and a more efficient car doing 50 mpg could need 28 gallons. Based on the current prices of petrol round here - which may not be representative over the whole of the UK - an efficient 50 mpg car could cost about £188, while a less efficient 40 mpg car could cost £228. So for this round trip journey some petrol cars could work out cheaper.

If we were even to attempt the round trip with Zoe [we might end up doing that, but I'd rather not ...], then probably the first 150 miles could be done at 20p per kWh, while the remaining 1250 miles would be at the "along the route" rates.

The first 150 miles would require 37.5 kWh, while the remainder would require 312.5 kWh, so the total cost in that case would be estimated at £37.5*0.2 + 312.5*0.6 = £195.

An added complication is that the Zoe can use some of the Tesla charging stations, but not all of them, and the cost per unit for non Tesla cars tends to be higher. OTOH using the Tesla charging stations has definite advantages in terms of accessibility and speed of service.

These factors might drive some to consider plug-in hybrids more seriously, as then drivers would at least have a choice of fuel. Currently most drivers are committed to one of three "fuels", petrol, diesel or electricity, and if the big businesses which supply these up the price, then they have a captive market.

For us considering these factors, it is still better to use EVs, as most of the time we do local journeys, or currently journeys within Scotland, and most journeys are done using electricity from the home charger, some of which will have been generated by PV panels.

Others, who either care less about the environment, or simply can't afford an EV may well decide to stick with fossil fuels. A large, even gas guzzling car [say 35mpg] could probably be bought second hand for £10-£15k - maybe less, and there are still occasionally cheap runabouts available for under £2k. The price differential could buy a lot of "fuel".

If the governments are serious [you must be joking ...] about trying to get people to switch to different energy sources, then much more effort needs to be put into supporting low income households which perhaps still need to have the use of a car, and the current market pricing strategies do seem to be counter productive.

[Cotlake]

I own a Tesla Model Y. I recently went on holiday to S. Devon and Cornwall. I found Tesla Chargers were the cheapest and the price per kWh seems to vary during the day and possibly depending on location. At Camborne in Cornwall I was paying 56.5p and on another occasion the price was down to 43.5p per kWh. It was also 43.5p at M5 Exeter Services. In contrast, I had to charge a few times at the new Osprey charger at Buckfastliegh, Devon where I was ripped off at 95p per kWh.

Generally I expect to pay a similar travel cost to running an ICE when repeatably charging away from home. At home I’m on intelligent Octopus. Night charging at just 7.5p per kWh.

[struth]

My Kona has always been charged at home as it's got good range and I don't go that far these days.
It's not worth me getting Octopus cheap charging as I don't use it enough

[Macca]

I know there are some sceptics about EVs round here - and indeed many places - but they may indeed really be the way to go, as the oil runs out. Diesel and petrol are certainly more polluting at the point of use, and clearly there are health issues in cities with poor air circulation.
.

There's no issue with oil running out. Air pollution is another matter and worth it just for that.

Really hydrogen fuel cell is a much better idea than batteries, it overcomes all the problems with EV and would be cheaper vehicles once mass-market. Infrastructure is no argument against as that needs putting in for electric anyway.

But you need a lot of power to make the fuel and that means nuclear which isn't popular so where do you go? Back to only rich people driving and everyone else on bikes, scooters and buses, which I suspect is where they want them to be.

[Barry]

Who are the "they" in your final sentence? Car drivers?

[struth]

Who are the "they" in your final sentence? Car drivers?

presumeably the govt and the rich...

[Barry]

That's what I thought, but it wasn't clear.

[AJSki2fly]

....and currently is about 19p per kWh. In a Tesla Model 3 each kWh gives around 3.5 to 4 miles of travel. In a Renault Zoe each kWh may give 4 miles or more - though that depends on how hard the cars are driven.

Assume our round trip is going to be about 1400 miles. So in TM3 that would require perhaps 1400/3.5 kWh = 400 kWh. We could get the first 200 miles at 20p per kWh by charging up at home, so the rest of the journey - 1200 miles - would require 343kWh of charge.
Some of the public charges are high - well over 60p per kWh. So the total cost could be £57*0.2 + 343*0.6 = £218 or even more as some of the chargers charge more than 60p per unit, and some also charge ridiculously high penalty charges for overstaying.

.

Don't get the TM3 stuff, why would you not use Telsa chargers, there are plenty of Tesla charge points down this way which are now at around 43p/Kwh.

200miles at 20p per mile is 57Kwh = £11.42, yes, then 1200 miles 343Kwh of charge, 43p/Kwh so £148. So £159.42 to do 1400 miles, which is £0.11/miles. So to compare a ICE petrol cars that do 40mpg will need 35 gallons of petrol at around £6.86 for Unleaded(low grade) which is £239.75. So cheaper on Tesla network. Assume 50mpg for a diesel car, then its £6.95/gall so 28 galls for 1400 miles will cost £194.60. So the Tesla is still cheaper. :scratch:

[dave2010]

Don't get the TM3 stuff, why would you not use Telsa chargers, there are plenty of Tesla charge points down this way which are now at around 43p/Kwh.

200miles at 20p per mile is 57Kwh = £11.42, yes, then 1200 miles 343Kwh of charge, 43p/Kwh so £148. So £159.42 to do 1400 miles, which is £0.11/miles. So to compare a ICE petrol cars that do 40mpg will need 35 gallons of petrol at around £6.86 for Unleaded(low grade) which is £239.75. So cheaper on Tesla network. Assume 50mpg for a diesel car, then its £6.95/gall so 28 galls for 1400 miles will cost £194.60. So the Tesla is still cheaper. :scratch:Firstly we still don't know if we can use the TM3 - as Tesla are still faffing about and not fixing the rear light issue. There is no point in taking the car for its due MOT, as it will fail immediately on the light issue, and that does need to be fixed. We would certainly use the Tesla chargers if we get the car fixed so that it can be driven on this trip. I have checked the chargers along the route and several are at the high end of the price range. If we take Zoe instead then at the allowed Tesla chargers - there are a few - the charge costs would probably be higher. Some of the other chargers - which would work for that car - and some which used to be free - are now relatively expensive.

You may be right that if we hit lucky the whole trip could be done for less than an ICE car, but right now that is uncertain. One of the supposed benefits of running an EV is that running costs are lower - but even with the optimistic estimates of "fuel" savings my calculations suggest that the financial "savings" do not offset the high marginal price over an ICE car. Most people who have a home charger and who don't do long trips will get a significant financial benefit from EVs, but that fails if many longer trips are done.

Do I personally favour EVs? Yes - certainly - because of the environmental impact, and the inhererent "automatic" transmission - no gear changing - and a few other factors, but where some organisations are trying to persuade people that EVs are cheaper to run and that offsets the higher initial costs I would suggest that that is dubious, as energy suppliers are adjusting their prices.

Right now however we are still maintaining options B,C,D etc., as so far the useless Tesla service has failed to deliver - though maybe I'm getting closer to a result. Someone suggested I drove to a Tesla service centre and deliberately blocked the entrance until I got satisfaction, but the nearest one is over 140 miles away, and I would probably "be in the wrong" if I adopted such a tactic.

[dave2010]

I own a Tesla Model Y. I recently went on holiday to S. Devon and Cornwall. I found Tesla Chargers were the cheapest and the price per kWh seems to vary during the day and possibly depending on location. At Camborne in Cornwall I was paying 56.5p and on another occasion the price was down to 43.5p per kWh. It was also 43.5p at M5 Exeter Services. In contrast, I had to charge a few times at the new Osprey charger at Buckfastliegh, Devon where I was ripped off at 95p per kWh.

Generally I expect to pay a similar travel cost to running an ICE when repeatably charging away from home. At home I’m on intelligent Octopus. Night charging at just 7.5p per kWh.Indeed the Intelligent Otopus tarrif is good if you can get the 7.xp per kWh rate and keep your cars charged up. That is what we were on until recently, though the disparity between the peak rate and the cheap rate is significant. Now we have moved on to the Tracker rate [I didn't make the decision - perhaps it was premature] so now we get a flat rate per day, but it is variable, and we can decide whether to charge up, use appliances etc. once we know the daily rate. The reason for the change of tariff is that we were expecting to use more electricity, and also through the day due to our new ASHP. Our tariff switch may well have been premature, as after the initial set up of the ASHP which had us running it flat out for a couple of days to get the anti-freeze circulating - the ASHP now seems to be running at a low level. However as the weather gets colder we will need a tariff which lowers our costs due to the likelihood of significant near continuous power use during each day.

Hopefully the costs of running the ASHP will be significantly less than the cost of having to fill up an oil tank every few months. This doesn't completely isolate us from supply problems though, as if the electricity supply goes down we get no heating - but we wouldn't have done with the oil boiler anyway due to the pumps not working - but our backup for that eventuality is to burn logs in our log burner. Failing that we'll follow Dr Zhivago and burn the furniture!

[AJSki2fly]

Indeed the Intelligent Otopus tarrif is good if you can get the 7.xp per kWh rate and keep your cars charged up. That is what we were on until recently, though the disparity between the peak rate and the cheap rate is significant. Now we have moved on to the Tracker rate [I didn't make the decision - perhaps it was premature] so now we get a flat rate per day, but it is variable, and we can decide whether to charge up, use appliances etc. once we know the daily rate. The reason for the change of tariff is that we were expecting to use more electricity, and also through the day due to our new ASHP. Our tariff switch may well have been premature, as after the initial set up of the ASHP which had us running it flat out for a couple of days to get the anti-freeze circulating - the ASHP now seems to be running at a low level. However as the weather gets colder we will need a tariff which lowers our costs due to the likelihood of significant near continuous power use during each day.

Hopefully the costs of running the ASHP will be significantly less than the cost of having to fill up an oil tank every few months. This doesn't completely isolate us from supply problems though, as if the electricity supply goes down we get no heating - but we wouldn't have done with the oil boiler anyway due to the pumps not working - but our backup for that eventuality is to burn logs in our log burner. Failing that we'll follow Dr Zhivago and burn the furniture!

As I said the way to make it work, ASHP, is 20kwh batteries and power them up over night at 7.5p/kWh in the winter and run everything off batteries in the day,

Our total bill for the last year was £780, this includes EV charging int the winter, all heating, hot water and cookin and £180 for standing charge. If we had gas/electric like most the bill would have been £4k[emoji33]


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Cotlake]

As I said the way to make it work, ASHP, is 20kwh batteries and power them up over night at 7.5p/kWh in the winter and run everything off batteries in the day,

Our total bill for the last year was £780, this includes EV charging int the winter, all heating, hot water and cookin and £180 for standing charge. If we had gas/electric like most the bill would have been £4k[emoji33]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Interesting. What was the outlay on the battery system, including cost of fitting/commissioning, please?

[AJSki2fly]

We went for 2 SolarEdge 9.7kwh batteries, £5k rack and a 8kwh hybrid inverter £1.2k fitting was about £1.5 with cables etc.

Prices have come down a little a GivEnergy 9.5kwh battery can be had for £3.6k and inverter £1k. So should be able to do for around.

We peak in winter at around 25kwh per day usage when it coldest. I spent quite some time looking at our previous bills and working out what would meet our needs. Don’t forget that with the Solar PV we usually get some power in the day as well unless it is completely overcast, but Dec to Mar is pretty low.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[dave2010]

The saga with Tesla continues. I am still certain that they are an absolutely appalling company.

Couldn't run a booze up in a brewery, or a bun fight in a bakery.

I'm interested in the batteries. No way I would go anywhere near Tesla for those, now. No way I would buy Tesla batteries after all the hassle I've had with the car - which incidentally may be off the road now for a month or two. Thanks Tesla!


Total incompetence. I can't get an MOT done up here in Scotland before 6th September, when we need the car - or at least a car. I can get an MOT done in Sheffield on 6th or 7th September, but there's no point in going for that unless I'm absolutely sure the car will pass.
With the problem with the driver's side rear lights it would certainly fail, and it's arguable whether I should even be driving it.

There are very few centres up near where we live which can cope with MOTs for EVs - there are some - but they are geared up to other brands. Even the larger outfits, such as Kwik Fit and Halfords which might be able to do an MOT on an EV are not able to offer earlier appointments.
Tesla itself does not do MOTs.

Overall this is grim.

I did ask when we bought the wretched thing how we could get service. "Oh - easy - just bring it into a service centre." "Yes, and what part of the nearest one is 140+ miles and the next is 175+ miles away don't you understand?" "Oh - no problem, we can send out a mobile technician."

Foolishly we agreed to this. In practice it doesn't happen, or hasn't happened so far. The only communication with Tesla service centres is via a phone app, and occasional robotic messages sent to our home phone. It seems deliberate to stop people actually getting the service they require.

Today I actually got to speak to a lovely lady, perhaps employed as a pacifier, who took some of my concerns on board, and indeed last week I also spoke to another adviser who appeared to be helpful. Amazingly these interactions have been recorded, so the Tesla "system" is aware of them, and there is a fragment of joined up organisation there, though we still haven't resolved the main issue.

Last week's service appointment didn't happen - we didn't get advance notice, or an apology. Other companies we've dealt with recently have also had problems with service, due to illness or other reasons, but at least they usually manage to phone or message us in advance to let us know that someone is sick and can't make it. That's not unreasonable, but Tesla .... No!

Oh - yes - for a high tech company - doesn't even seem to have minimal intelligence. The adviser I spoke to last week pointed out that we might not get further contact until today - because Monday "is a bank holiday". However Monday was not a bank holiday in Scotland, so why are people in Scotland undeserving of service on days when there isn't a bank holiday there?

No compensation for inconvenience ... and all this from a company run/owned/managed (??) at least partially by one of the richest men on the planet. Other companies do offer compensation for poor service, and actually provide it if asked, but presumably Tesla won't because it's not a service organisation. "No - we don't do that!"

No - you don't do very much, do you? !!!!

[dave2010]

We went for 2 SolarEdge 9.7kwh batteries, £5k rack and a 8kwh hybrid inverter £1.2k fitting was about £1.5 with cables etc.

Prices have come down a little a GivEnergy 9.5kwh battery can be had for £3.6k and inverter £1k. So should be able to do for around.

We peak in winter at around 25kwh per day usage when it coldest. I spent quite some time looking at our previous bills and working out what would meet our needs. Don’t forget that with the Solar PV we usually get some power in the day as well unless it is completely overcast, but Dec to Mar is pretty low.

Thanks for this - interesting that your daily usage is around 25kWh per day in cold weather, so you are able to get most of the power you need from the batteries. Does that include charging the car(s) as well, or do you have to schedule those for different days - or perhaps you charge the cars and the batteries up at the same time.

It seems that at the moment we are using about 25kWh per day, though it's hard to work out whether that's using electricity from the PV arrays - because the meters may not show that. That would be about £5 per day at the recent rates of 20p per kWh.

Perhaps it's not going to bother us, but how long do you expect the batteries to last? I would hope at least 10 years, again hopefully with minimal servicing, and also without burning the house down - or affecting insurance.

[There have been some instances of batteries catching fire - I think].

It's difficult to get a handle on "real world" costs, but maybe for us it would now be interesting to get batteries fitted - I would hope for something as big as your system for around £6k, which might pay for itself in 4 years.
[Actually looking at your costings - not fully filled in - it looks as though £10k would be needed to get 2 or 3 batteries for 25kWh, including installation - so might take 10 years or more to "recover" the costs.
Could be dead in that time - sadly!]

One problem is that one is still at the mercy of the electricity suppliers - but Octopus do seem to be good for us so far. Another sad fact of life up in the far north is that just getting people to do the work is not easy - and that would be to some extent independent of the costs.

Tesla, a company which I will now try mostly to avoid like bubonic plague - would likely charge at least double my target price for a system which would probably not be as capable - so I'm not doing that - and they probably still wouldn't provide adequate service or installation.

The market for ASHPs and other environmentally conservative technology is still too fragmented, so it really does take a lot of organisation to get jobs done to complete satisfaction.

We still have to dispose of our old oil boiler [scrap metal merchant?] and the oil tank [legally disposing of oil tanks isn't so easy ..].

The UK is not really geared up for big [or even smallish] organisations which can really tackle the whole of any job, and just "get it done". There is too much buck passing.

[AJSki2fly]

Thanks for this - interesting that your daily usage is around 25kWh per day in cold weather, so you are able to get most of the power you need from the batteries. Does that include charging the car(s) as well, or do you have to schedule those for different days - or perhaps you charge the cars and the batteries up at the same time.

It includes charging the EV up overnight when needed. Car as Octopus schedule in the daily plan between 23:30 and 5:30 and Batteries get charged from 23:30 until full or until 5:30am.



It seems that at the moment we are using about 25kWh per day, though it's hard to work out whether that's using electricity from the PV arrays - because the meters may not show that. That would be about £5 per day at the recent rates of 20p per kWh.

You should have a PV Array meter or and app for it that shows generated or Total house usage, you can see Grid Imported usage on the Smart Meter, so should be able to get what Solar you are using each day/week.



Perhaps it's not going to bother us, but how long do you expect the batteries to last? I would hope at least 10 years, again hopefully with minimal servicing, and also without burning the house down - or affecting insurance.

I would expect 10 to 15 years, possibly more but less efficient. Our batteries effective charge is to 80% of total capacity to maximise life this is built into system config.

[There have been some instances of batteries catching fire - I think]. Ours have built in fire extinguisher system.




It's difficult to get a handle on "real world" costs, but maybe for us it would now be interesting to get batteries fitted - I would hope for something as big as your system for around £6k, which might pay for itself in 4 years.
[Actually looking at your costings - not fully filled in - it looks as though £10k would be needed to get 2 or 3 batteries for 25kWh, including installation - so might take 10 years or more to "recover" the costs.
Could be dead in that time - sadly!].

It depends what you are looking for, do you want to insulate yourself from rising power costs, be able to run off grid, do you care about power costs or not, do you want to do your bit for the planet? If you think 10 years paying around £4K a year for power is (without inflationary or increasing power costs) is OK then do nothing.




One problem is that one is still at the mercy of the electricity suppliers - but Octopus do seem to be good for us so far. Another sad fact of life up in the far north is that just getting people to do the work is not easy - and that would be to some extent independent of the costs.

Most Suppliers are moving towards the Octopus model or similar, they know they have to for several reasons, one being that Octopus has become so successful, thinking about the customer as well as making a reasonable profit.



Tesla, a company which I will now try mostly to avoid like bubonic plague - would likely charge at least double my target price for a system which would probably not be as capable - so I'm not doing that - and they probably still wouldn't provide adequate service or installation.

Whatever your beef is with Tesla, and I understand your frustration getting hold of a rear light cluster, by the way they can be got https://www.motor-doctor.co.uk/rear-lights/tesla/model-3/model-3-5yj3/143476-ev https://www.ebay.co.uk/b/Tesla-Rear-Light-Assembly-Car-Rear-Light-Assemblies/33716/bn_7079103892 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225428820644?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338791177&toolid=10001&customid=

Might be the cheaper and quicker option, just get your local garage to fit and then MOT it.

Some people though do have a good experience with them, their Powerwall is not one I would personally choose anyway, it can be a bit restrictive and only offers 13.KWH for around £9.5K and is a AC Inverter system.



The market for ASHPs and other environmentally conservative technology is still too fragmented, so it really does take a lot of organisation to get jobs done to complete satisfaction.

ASHP installation has not been that well thought through by the government in terms of installer and the number of them needed longer term. A MCS certified installer needs to meet specific standards, our installer was very good, and answered all our questions and made sure we got a system that worked efficiently for our home. Maybe it is different up your way with how many installer are available to you. I did do quite a bit of up front work so that I had some base knowledge and understanding of how a ASHP system should work and some basic design criteria, I was then is a position to ask pertinent questions of prospective installers before we chose, I also asked other customer their feedback. No gain without some pain here, I think this applies to most things to get the best VFM and something that is reliable and works.[/QUOTE]




The UK is not really geared up for big [or even smallish] organisations which can really tackle the whole of any job, and just "get it done". There is too much buck passing.

Our supplier, actually does, they do Solar PV, Solar Thermal, Wind generation(in limited numbers), Battery storage, ASHP, GroundSHP, and Thermal Battery storage . So they have a good understanding how to integrate these together depending what the customer wants get out of it, they do commercial and home installations, from very large to small. Needless to say they are overrun with work and have double in size over the last 2 years due to demand.

This is deviating from this thread somewhat apart from my thoughts to try and help with your rear light issue.

[dave2010]

Free Tesla charging today - and not only Tesla vehicles - but check compatibility.

29th August, 2023

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/quick-tesla-offering-free-supercharging-today-only

[Cotlake]

Whatever your beef is with Tesla, and I understand your frustration getting hold of a rear light cluster, by the way they can be got https://www.motor-doctor.co.uk/rear-lights/tesla/model-3/model-3-5yj3/143476-ev https://www.ebay.co.uk/b/Tesla-Rear-Light-Assembly-Car-Rear-Light-Assemblies/33716/bn_7079103892 https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/225428820644?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338791177&toolid=10001&customid=

Might be the cheaper and quicker option, just get your local garage to fit and then MOT it.

Dave, my understanding is your Tesla is still under warranty. You won’t want to invalidate that. I think the problem is your remote location. If you don’t do the 280 mile round trip to a Tesla service centre, the field mechanic has to do it, which they should honour even if the job spends time in the ‘Too hard to do’ basket. If your M3 is still under warranty, and having booked a service appointment, if Tesla can’t fix it there and then, their policy is to supply you with a courtesy car which normally is another Tesla for however long it takes. Could that be worked into your planned road trip? Don’t Tesla service centres have their own third party MOT centre contracts?

[AJSki2fly]

Dave, my understanding is your Tesla is still under warranty. You won’t want to invalidate that. I think the problem is your remote location. If you don’t do the 280 mile round trip to a Tesla service centre, the field mechanic has to do it, which they should honour even if the job spends time in the ‘Too hard to do’ basket. If your M3 is still under warranty, and having booked a service appointment, if Tesla can’t fix it there and then, their policy is to supply you with a courtesy car which normally is another Tesla for however long it takes. Could that be worked into your planned road trip? Don’t Tesla service centres have their own third party MOT centre contracts?

A good point as the Warranty is 4 years. I think I would consider booking a service at Tesla ensuring they have the Part(s) in stock and driving there early and treating it as a day trip, either coming back with the car or a loan car.

[dave2010]

A good point as the Warranty is 4 years. I think I would consider booking a service at Tesla ensuring they have the Part(s) in stock and driving there early and treating it as a day trip, either coming back with the car or a loan car.Thanks both of you.

We currently "almost" have something which works, but there's no plan B associated directly with that.

If the mobile mechanic comes and gets the rear light fixed before (say) the 5th of September, then we will set off and do the MOT appointment in Sheffield. I hope there won't be a problem with that - windscreen wipers, tyres etc. If there is a problem I'll then drive the car round to the Tesla centre in Sheffield - and take it from there.

Personally I don't care where the mobile mechanic comes from - Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen - I just want someone to turn up and do the work. Apparently there are a lot of Teslas up here, so there might be a new service centre. In the meantime we are supposed to console ourselves with the thought that the Lake District is [allegedly] even more poorly served - though I don't do schadenfreude - well not now - anyway!

Many other companies which have chosen to operate and provide service in Scotland do actually send people out, even if they do have to drive 200 or more miles. I have talked to service or delivery people who came to us, and then said they were on the way to Wick, or back to Aberdeen before returning to Glasgow, Edinburgh or points south of those cities. Given that I specifically asked before buying the TM3 whether service would be a problem, and was given positive assurances that things would be OK, it does rather seem that Tesla doesn't give a **** about service when they are trying to sell cars. I also don't care if they make a paper loss on servicing people in out of the way places - they shouldn't be making a profit on other activities when they can't support service.

If the wretched car isn't fixed in time for us to travel, then I will have to cancel the MOT appointment, and we'll use another car - but I really don't want to have to do that. The stress of trying to get this done has been very painful and a major distraction, and has interfered very considerably with other things we wanted to do.

Go on - somebody tell me of other EV cars which are worse!

The light assembly seems expensive, and Tesla should fit it FOC - they just need to get their act together and do it.

[dave2010]

Free Tesla charging today - and not only Tesla vehicles - but check compatibility.

29th August, 2023

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/quick-tesla-offering-free-supercharging-today-onlyI derived a modicum of satisfaction earlier this afternoon by driving to Inverness and charging the TM3 up to 100%. OK - in real terms it was probably only worth about £3, so miniscule in comparison with the value of the aggro we've had to put up with - but I would still encourage everyone else to go out and screw the juice out of them!

[AJSki2fly]

Thanks both of you.

We currently "almost" have something which works, but there's no plan B associated directly with that.

If the mobile mechanic comes and gets the rear light fixed before (say) the 5th of September, then we will set off and do the MOT appointment in Sheffield. I hope there won't be a problem with that - windscreen wipers, tyres etc. If there is a problem I'll then drive the car round to the Tesla centre in Sheffield - and take it from there.

Personally I don't care where the mobile mechanic comes from - Glasgow, Edinburgh, Aberdeen - I just want someone to turn up and do the work. Apparently there are a lot of Teslas up here, so there might be a new service centre. In the meantime we are supposed to console ourselves with the thought that the Lake District is [allegedly] even more poorly served - though I don't do schadenfreude - well not now - anyway!

Many other companies which have chosen to operate and provide service in Scotland do actually send people out, even if they do have to drive 200 or more miles. I have talked to service or delivery people who came to us, and then said they were on the way to Wick, or back to Aberdeen before returning to Glasgow, Edinburgh or points south of those cities. Given that I specifically asked before buying the TM3 whether service would be a problem, and was given positive assurances that things would be OK, it does rather seem that Tesla doesn't give a **** about service when they are trying to sell cars. I also don't care if they make a paper loss on servicing people in out of the way places - they shouldn't be making a profit on other activities when they can't support service.

If the wretched car isn't fixed in time for us to travel, then I will have to cancel the MOT appointment, and we'll use another car - but I really don't want to have to do that. The stress of trying to get this done has been very painful and a major distraction, and has interfered very considerably with other things we wanted to do.

Go on - somebody tell me of other EV cars which are worse!

The light assembly seems expensive, and Tesla should fit it FOC - they just need to get their act together and do it.

Hi Dave, I feel your frustration, and agree Tesla could do something’s better especially on the service front.

I just raised a service issue this week reporting a bug in a new software release that causes the service manual to be displayed in Catalan language, when the screen language is set to British English, a service chap has come back asking for further clarification, I had already sent photos of the issue, I really do wonder at the quality of some of their people[emoji848]

I hope you get it sorted and you enjoy your trip.

Cheers

[Macca]

Hi Dave, I feel your frustration, and agree Tesla could do something’s better especially on the service front.

I just raised a service issue this week reporting a bug in a new software release that causes the service manual to be displayed in Catalan language, when the screen language is set to British English, a service chap has come back asking for further clarification, I had already sent photos of the issue, I really do wonder at the quality of some of their people[emoji848]

I hope you get it sorted and you enjoy your trip.

Cheers

Saw a show the other day where some bloke was saying A.I will soon be taking over the world and we should all be worried.

I'll start worrying when they can manage to get basic stuff like that to work properly and consistently let alone program some electronic super brain to achieve global dominance.

[Pigmy Pony]

Saw a show the other day where some bloke was saying A.I will soon be taking over the world and we should all be worried.

I'll start worrying when they can manage to get basic stuff like that to work properly and consistently let alone program some electronic super brain to achieve global dominance.

I think AI not working properly and consistently is more of a worry. "The weather man said we're in for a stormy night, my pet robot thought he said exterminate. I got out of there just in time. Oh God it's here again! It's relentless!"

[Macca]

I think AI not working properly and consistently is more of a worry.

They'll never get it working at all. And even if they do it will get more useless with every update just like Microsoft Outlook.

Everyone moving to cloud storage so that spread sheet that used to take one second to open now takes thirty. That's progress in the wacky world of I.T

'But it's cheaper!'. Yes and some filing cabinets and a pen and paper were even cheaper and didn't need a whole department of people on mega-money to support them.

I can see it getting back to that let alone moving on to a world where computers are in charge.

[AJSki2fly]

Saw a show the other day where some bloke was saying A.I will soon be taking over the world and we should all be worried.

I'll start worrying when they can manage to get basic stuff like that to work properly and consistently let alone program some electronic super brain to achieve global dominance.

I think you should look at the very recent video of Mr Musk test driving a Tesla, sorry I mean the Tesla driving itself, meeting M4 Full Self Driving level(not allowed here yet). This was achieved using AI and no code, the previous M3 level FSD was achieved with 300k lines of C++ code [emoji33]

It’s quite a boring video as nothing goes wrong, just Elon randomly pin selecting destination and letting the car do its thing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Macca]

I think you should look at the very recent video of Mr Musk test driving a Tesla, sorry I mean the Tesla driving itself, meeting M4 Full Self Driving level(not allowed here yet). This was achieved using AI and no code, the previous M3 level FSD was achieved with 300k lines of C++ code [emoji33]

It’s quite a boring video as nothing goes wrong, just Elon randomly pin selecting destination and letting the car do its thing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

it's not really A.I though is it? It's only A.I in my book when it starts choosing where it wants to go i,e it starts pursuing it's own, cohesive agenda.

As a former programmer I know what is behind the curtain. Driverless car does not even pass the Turing Test let alone be classed as intelligent.

[dave2010]

Hi Dave, I feel your frustration, and agree Tesla could do something’s better especially on the service front.

I just raised a service issue this week reporting a bug in a new software release that causes the service manual to be displayed in Catalan language, when the screen language is set to British English, a service chap has come back asking for further clarification, I had already sent photos of the issue, I really do wonder at the quality of some of their people[emoji848]

I hope you get it sorted and you enjoy your trip.

CheersWonder of wonders! The Tesla man came!

Still have a few things to sort out, but basically should be OK now. I'll fit new tyres on Monday - after I went into have the tyres checked a couple of days ago. A tad more than £800 to get new ones, but I don't suppose that's too dreadful for 3 years driving, some on terrible roads.

Although the guy was helpful and pleasant, there are too many problems with Tesla service. Lack of communication between different people, plus just a general reluctance to really get things done. I will still push for much better service, even though for the moment things are starting to look up for my TM3.

[struth]

Well it's a start. Hopefully you can get the MOT done now and have your rd trip

[Pigmy Pony]

Glad you're getting sorted, now you can look forward to your trip :)

[Pigmy Pony]

Forecast for Barnard Castle today has changed, surprise surprise. Looks like showers most of the day, then a drizzly evening. British weather never fails to disappoint. I've got mud in me cornflakes!

Rest of weekend looking good though.

[AJSki2fly]

it's not really A.I though is it? It's only A.I in my book when it starts choosing where it wants to go i,e it starts pursuing it's own, cohesive agenda.

As a former programmer I know what is behind the curtain. Driverless car does not even pass the Turing Test let alone be classed as intelligent.

I don’t think I would like my car intelligently deciding to pop off fort road trip to see the sights, or get into a sulk and refuse to drive, or even take vengeance on other road users or take leaf out of Death Race 2000.[emoji33]

The AI aspect as I understand it is that it has learnt how to drive and react to different situations based on vast amounts of data feed to it, video and car metric data from real life journeys. It learns and then assimilates this to perform driving in a safe manner. The key is the quality of the data used for it to learn, Elon Musk points out that using good driver video and data is very important, and if any deficiencies are found to supply better data to address them, so really a feedback process.

[AJSki2fly]

Wonder of wonders! The Tesla man came!

Still have a few things to sort out, but basically should be OK now. I'll fit new tyres on Monday - after I went into have the tyres checked a couple of days ago. A tad more than £800 to get new ones, but I don't suppose that's too dreadful for 3 years driving, some on terrible roads.

Although the guy was helpful and pleasant, there are too many problems with Tesla service. Lack of communication between different people, plus just a general reluctance to really get things done. I will still push for much better service, even though for the moment things are starting to look up for my TM3.

Great Dave, really pleased for you, hopefully your stress levels can drop a bit now, and look forward to your trip.

[Macca]

I don’t think I would like my car intelligently deciding to pop off fort road trip to see the sights, or get into a sulk and refuse to drive, or even take vengeance on other road users or take leaf out of Death Race 2000.[emoji33]

The AI aspect as I understand it is that it has learnt how to drive and react to different situations based on vast amounts of data feed to it, video and car metric data from real life journeys. It learns and then assimilates this to perform driving in a safe manner. The key is the quality of the data used for it to learn, Elon Musk points out that using good driver video and data is very important, and if any deficiencies are found to supply better data to address them, so really a feedback process.

Yes but that's not intelligence, it can't extrapolate anything for itself from the data it has, it still follows the limits of it's programme.

I remember years ago at university when it was mainframes in a windowless bunker and all the I.T geeks had read 'Neuromancer' and would bang on about intelligent computers, but really we are no further forward.

When they've got a Commander Data on the go, even if it isn't mobile, then that's artificial intelligence. Until then all they have is a sophisticated algorithm. It's impressive, but it isn't A.I.

[struth]

Yes but that's not intelligence, it can't extrapolate anything for itself from the data it has, it still follows the limits of it's programme.

I remember years ago at university when it was mainframes in a windowless bunker and all the I.T geeks had read 'Neuromancer' and would bang on about intelligent computers, but really we are no further forward.

When they've got a Commander Data on the go, even if it isn't mobile, then that's artificial intelligence. Until then all they have is a sophisticated algorithm. It's impressive, but it isn't A.I.

give them 200 years, except we probably will have self destructed by then.

[Macca]

give them 200 years, except we probably will have self destructed by then.

we'll be back in the stone age by then the rate it's going. Be well past my bedtime anyway so I don't care.

[AJSki2fly]

Yes but that's not intelligence, it can't extrapolate anything for itself from the data it has, it still follows the limits of it's programme.

I remember years ago at university when it was mainframes in a windowless bunker and all the I.T geeks had read 'Neuromancer' and would bang on about intelligent computers, but really we are no further forward.

When they've got a Commander Data on the go, even if it isn't mobile, then that's artificial intelligence. Until then all they have is a sophisticated algorithm. It's impressive, but it isn't A.I.

I actually do agree with you. I suspect the next serpent will be the Borg, for those that can afford to enhance themselves and want more power and control.

[Macca]

I actually do agree with you. I suspect the next serpent will be the Borg, for those that can afford to enhance themselves and want more power and control.

I do wonder if people will go for that, tech-wise it's not that far off. Lots of people seem happy to have cosmetic implants so it's only the next stage on.

What happens when they malfunction though? You have to call tech-support in India:

'My optical enhancement isn't working, I can't see.'

'Okay sir, I regret I cannot help you with that. Let me open a level 4 support ticket for you, someone from that team will contact you in five working days. Before you go, may I ask how you have found the service today?'

[struth]

ps, we shall remotely switch you off until then....:ner:

[walpurgis]

I wonder if there's a digital dick option? :D

[struth]

I wonder if there's a digital dick option? :D

an AI one could be disasterous.. might start after dirty ol' men in black macs...:eek: dunno if you still get those but you used to see them hanging about public lavs:mental:

[Pigmy Pony]

I actually do agree with you. I suspect the next serpent will be the Borg, for those that can afford to enhance themselves and want more power and control.

If I wanted to enhance myself there's a little shop at the other end of town (the one with the bead curtains across the doorway) and they're really not that expensive.

[AJSki2fly]

Sounds like the local Chinese takeaway to me[emoji6]

[dave2010]

Great Dave, really pleased for you, hopefully your stress levels can drop a bit now, and look forward to your trip.Thanks. It did pass the MOT - perhaps I'd better not say where, but Kwik Fit somewhere near Sheffield were great. Car was booked in, driven there, and after a while a new MOT certificate handed to me. I have written to KF customer service thanking them - and asking them to inform the garage which did the work which seemed very well organised. OTOH similar garages in the frozen north, round Inverness, including Kwik Fit - were totally unable to cope. I don't like living that dangerously, but I did nothing illegal. The car was insured, and roadworthy, and even though I drove it on the day the MOT expired I was driving to an MOT station.

Re AI - I'm not at all convinced that Musk's video would work with UK drivers and for UK roads, though I have discovered a few features of the T3 which I didn't know about or expect for motorway driving. Mostly was OK - though I upset someone - a prat I assume - who thought he was on the M25 where that kind of thing is more common and to be expected. Tried to creep up on me on the inside instead of pulling up behind me, and expecting me to pull in - which I probably would have done, or gone round the outside. So he got a bit hissy when I pulled right in front of him - I'm not proud of it - but as I wrote - on the M25 I expect that kind of driving, but not on the M1 in Yorkshire.

I'm guessing that many people are now either really good at controlling their speed, or using some form of automated cruise control. I can't maintain speed accurately for more than a mile or two, whereas I think the cruise control is within one or two per cent of the setting most of the time. There don't seem to be as many drivers screaming along at 80 mph or more, and expecting everyone to get out of the way, and weaving in and out as there use to be. Today the T3 put on the brakes as a driver with L plates wobbled around in the lane just in front and to the left - so it was reassuring to know that it is doing something useful.

Only got around 150 miles to go to get to the south coast, and some of the Tesla charging stations have been really quite cheap - last one was 35p per kWh, so charged most of the way up. They are a bit difficult to find sometimes though, or misleading. In Sheffield the Tesla centre doesn't have chargers, so one has to go down on to the M1 to find the superchargers at Woodall, which are not so obvious, then get back to Sheffield via the next M1 exit. Fortunately I know Sheffield moderately well, but it was a lot more hassle than just driving to a petrol garage. Having to do a 25 mile trip just to charge up is a bit excessive. It's OK for people actually travelling down the motorway, though even there it's a pain as the chargers are nowhere near the service area with shops and food stores. I didn't mind - as I sat and watched some YT videos - but really Tesla ought to site these chargers where people might get other services. Today we went to another Supercharger, but it was in a retail park, and the nearest bog was right next to a Pizza Hut - so I had no real alternative but to walk in there and apologise for using their facilities while the car did its thing. For goodness sake Tesla, put the chargers at least next to a toilet and coffee stand!

However, thank goodness we didn't have to fall back to one of our other plans. Zoe would not have been able to do this trip anything like as easily, and finding chargers which could work fast enough and reliably enough would have been a major headache at each stop.

[Barry]

So Teslas can only use dedicated chargers?

Another reason why I wouldn't buy one, or anything else from Elon Musk.

[struth]

So Teslas can only use dedicated chargers?

Another reason why I wouldn't buy one, or anything else from Elon Musk.

i think you can get adaptor to use other chargers

[Pigmy Pony]

i think you can get adaptor to use other chargers

Why can things never be simple? Why not make chargers universal? Are Tesla not worried about becoming the Betamax of EVs?

[struth]

Why can things never be simple? Why not make chargers universal? Are Tesla not worried about becoming the Betamax of EVs? At least you can get one if you need it. Most will be happy with Tesla's super charging system which imo is much better than their cars

[Barry]

Why can things never be simple? Why not make chargers universal? Are Tesla not worried about becoming the Betamax of EVs?

Maybe, but Betamax was superior to VHS, whereas if was interested in an EV (and I'm not) I would choose a Polestar anyday over a Tesla.

[Macca]

i think you can get adaptor to use other chargers

You can, we have lots of Teslas charging at work and the power points aren't Tesla's own.

It's non-Teslas using Tesla chargers that doesn't work.

[struth]

You can, we have lots of Teslas charging at work and the power points aren't Tesla's own.

It's non-Teslas using Tesla chargers that doesn't work.

some do.. the v2 charger works with some cars apparently. v3 tesla are a bad mix tho

[Macca]

some do.. the v2 charger works with some cars apparently. v3 tesla are a bad mix tho

They are compatible but I read that they use software to make them incompatible.

[Pigmy Pony]

Maybe, but Betamax was superior to VHS, whereas if was interested in an EV (and I'm not) I would choose a Polestar anyday over a Tesla.

Me too. They look solid, chunky and purposeful. With hopefully some of the Volvoness I've come to know and love.

[dave2010]

So Teslas can only use dedicated chargers?

Another reason why I wouldn't buy one, or anything else from Elon Musk.No - that's not true. There are however several issues.

First, the Tesla Superchargers are generally way faster than any other chargers. It may be possible to go from 30% to 80% charge in 20 or so minutes at a Supercharger. In contrast, at chargers like some of the Chargeplace Scotland chargers a similar period of time just about adds enough charge to go 5 miles or so - if you're lucky.

There's nothing wrong with slow charging if you're not going anywhere long distance, and the prices of slow chargers are typically a bit lower - maybe 16-25p per kWh, versus 35-60p at a fast charger. Many of us do charge at home with rates of between 7p-20p per kWh - but that works overnight or in the daytime when the sun is out.

So Teslas can charge up at non Tesla chargers - but it may take so long it's hardly worth the bother.

Conversely non Teslas can charge up at some Tesla chargers, but there the catch is that there may be an extra charge per kWh for using a non Tesla car. Not all Tesla chargers will allow other cars.

What about other charging networks? Trouble with those is there are so many, and they are diverse, and require different Apps and means of payment etc. I believe things are getting very slightly better - but one doesn't normally find out until actually trying to use any of these. That's usually exactly the time when you "just want the ***** thing to work", and quite often there are arcane reasons why these don't.

[AJSki2fly]

No - that's not true. There are however several issues.

.......
What about other charging networks? Trouble with those is there are so many, and they are diverse, and require different Apps and means of payment etc. I believe things are getting very slightly better - but one doesn't normally find out until actually trying to use any of these. That's usually exactly the time when you "just want the ***** thing to work", and quite often there are arcane reasons why these don't.

The Electroverse Charging app is well worth looking into incase you need to charge at a non Tesla site https://electroverse.octopus.energyand if you have Intelligent Octopus Go or Octopus Go customers receive an 8% and 5% discount respectively on all charging through Electroverse, the App makes it all much easier.

[Macca]

The Electroverse Charging app is well worth looking into incase you need to charge at a non Tesla site https://electroverse.octopus.energyand if you have Intelligent Octopus Go or Octopus Go customers receive an 8% and 5% discount respectively on all charging through Electroverse, the App makes it all much easier.

The saving wiped out by the outrageous food and coffee prices at the service station you have to hang around at for an hour or more while the car charges or while waiting for a charge point to become free...

The whole thing still has a long way to go before it's viable and acceptable for the majority of people. I like the idea of electric cars but we also have to confront the reality of it.

[struth]

The saving wiped out by the outrageous food and coffee prices at the service station you have to hang around at for an hour or more while the car charges or while waiting for a charge point to become free...

The whole thing still has a long way to go before it's viable and acceptable for the majority of people. I like the idea of electric cars but we also have to confront the reality of it.

yup, i you charge mostly or completely away from home then ev's really are currently not for you. im fortunate i do all my driving fairly local, and if i go a bit further afield ive got over 300 miles in summer if i take it easy which i do anyway, so can go near to 150 and still get home. 150 covers most of Scotland and bits of England.

[Macca]

yup, i you charge mostly or completely away from home then ev's really are currently not for you. im fortunate i do all my driving fairly local, and if i go a bit further afield ive got over 300 miles in summer if i take it easy which i do anyway, so can go near to 150 and still get home. 150 covers most of Scotland and bits of England.

yes it's ideal for you and no doubt a lot of people. At work we have 4 chargers for fleet cars so no issues going to and from work. But once off the reservation it's a different matter and some of the reps have reported that doing any distance other than to work and back is a giant pain in the arse re charging. Even with Teslas.

[dave2010]

The Electroverse Charging app is well worth looking into incase you need to charge at a non Tesla site https://electroverse.octopus.energyand if you have Intelligent Octopus Go or Octopus Go customers receive an 8% and 5% discount respectively on all charging through Electroverse, the App makes it all much easier.We have both of those.

We are now around 550 miles from our starting point, with a further 130 miles approximately to go until we reach our destination. I'll let you guys know how things go on the return trip back to the frozen wastes. Whatever my feelings about the Tesla cars - and anyone reading may know that they are not all positive - this trip would have been horrible in anything else - even a better EV - with the uncertainties of alternative networks. The Tesla charging network just about makes this work - though the location of the charging points while "adequate" could have been thought out much better. While yesterday's stop outside a pizza restaurant could have been helpful, given that it only took about 20 mins to charge up, that wasn't long enough to eat a pizza, even disregarding the issue that we didn't want to eat an exensive pizza [not really too expensive for a sit down meal - but not what we wanted at that time of day...] and in theory there are penalty charges for staying longer than the time it takes to charge up. As I've already suggested, the absolute minimum requirements are a sandwich bar and a toilet adjacent to the charging stations. Is it beyond the wit of man - if competent - to achieve that?

[dave2010]

Nearly back at base now.

Is Charnock Richard services on the M6 absolutely the worst motorway service station in the UK? Could there be anywhere worse?

The signage is terrible. To get to the Tesla chargers one has to go through a no entry sign - with an annotation allowing drivers making their way to the chargers as an exception. I have no idea if there is another way back to it if the turn is missed - the left turn is almost as soon as one pulls into the area and easily missed if this is one's first experience of this service area - though we had to reverse direction and push in in the wrong direction across an incoming stream in order to get to it. The parking spaces in the general parking area are minute, and very difficult to get in or out of.

There are a few service areas with similar no entry signs, with exceptions - such as at Tebay - where to get to the chargers from the northbound carriageway one has to use a service road to the hotel, and reach the chargers on the southbound side of the motorway.

I doubt whether any area can surpass Charnock Richard's level of mediocrity. It is unlikely that we'll make the same mistakes again, as this is definitely one area to avoid like the plague.

[Pigmy Pony]

I'm fortunate to live only six miles from Charnock Richard services, so have no need for any of their "services".

But... my mate worked there for a while in the 70s (as did I for two whole weekends), and once saw Engelbert Humperdinck there. And if it's good enough for the Hump...

[Macca]

I'm fortunate to live only six miles from Charnock Richard services, so have no need for any of their "services".

But... my mate worked there for a while in the 70s (as did I for two whole weekends), and once saw Engelbert Humperdinck there. And if it's good enough for the Hump...

It's a seal of approval no question.

[Pigmy Pony]

It's a seal of approval no question.

Well, Mr. Humperdinck's visit wasn't without issues - when trying to leave and continue his journey he was led a merry dance with all the confusing signage. It was only when he shouted "Please release me, let me go" that staff came to his aid. But he wasn't best pleased, and that is the origin of the phrase "got the right hump".

[struth]

Well, Mr. Humperdinck's visit wasn't without issues - when trying to leave and continue his journey he was led a merry dance with all the confusing sineage. It was only when he shouted "Please release me, let me go" that staff came to his aid. But he wasn't best pleased, and that is the origin of the phrase "got the right hump".

talking of humping, he tried to hump big tam jones's missus...

[Pigmy Pony]

Did he now? You're such a gossip :)

[struth]

Did he now? You're such a gossip :)

:lolsign:

[dave2010]

:lolsign:Maybe this - from a trash rag - https://www.express.co.uk/entertainment/music/1372004/Tom-Jones-Engelbert-Humperdinck-feud-what-happened-gordon-mills-evg

The last line is interesting.

[struth]

Maybe this - from a trash rag - https://www.express.co.uk/entertainment/music/1372004/Tom-Jones-Engelbert-Humperdinck-feud-what-happened-gordon-mills-evg

The last line is interesting.

not seen that one before.

[Pigmy Pony]

Who knows where the law stands with electric pushbikes?

When driving home earlier we were doing 30-35mph down a road when a bicycle ridden by some hoodie scrote overtook us doing at least 40, overtook the car in front of us, found himself heading straight for a traffic island so tore past it on the other side of the road. There was no car coming in the opposite direction at that moment, unfortunately.

Surely this can't be right?

Edit: Just seen Geoff's link on another thread. So this fast moving scumbag is clearly outside of the law and all we can hope is that if the the cops don't catch up with him, karma will.

[Macca]

15.5 mph is the legal speed limit.

[walpurgis]

15.5 mph is the legal speed limit.

Loads of illegal higher powered eBikes about and privately owned eScooters. There's no policing!

My bike will indicate higher speeds on the 'dash', but it is compliant spec.

(just bought another conversion kit in case anybody here wants to ride along, fifty quid used bike with £350 conversion kit, cheap way to zoom about :))

[Macca]

Does look like fun, but walking is the only exercise I get.

[Pigmy Pony]

I have to say I'm tempted, but really the house and garage is already full of stuff that's not getting used.

[Cotlake]

The sellers of high performance electric bikes evade the law by selling them for off road use only. That’ll do it, then!

[Pigmy Pony]

The sellers of high performance electric bikes evade the law by selling them for off road use only. That’ll do it, then!

And the buyers of high performance electric bikes evade the law by getting through gaps the pursuing cop car can't.

[struth]

think they are capped at 15.5mph. which is more than enough. think pedals have turn too

[Cotlake]

think they are capped at 15.5mph. which is more than enough. think pedals have turn too

Off road models are available that exceed 35 mph.

[struth]

Off road models are available that exceed 35 mph.Yeah, I meant road legal ones.

[walpurgis]

The sellers of high performance electric bikes evade the law by selling them for off road use only. That’ll do it, then!

Plenty on the road around here with big rear drive hubs that are obviously 1000watt or bigger. Clearly illegal as no reg plates and who's checking? Nobody!.

[Macca]

Plenty on the road around here with big rear drive hubs that are obviously 1000watt or bigger. Clearly illegal as no reg plates and who's checking? Nobody!.

Suspect cops are told to turn a blind eye, looks good for the government if lots of people are using personal eco-transport. Can bang on about how green they are. Votes in that.

[Pigmy Pony]

Suspect cops are told to turn a blind eye, looks good for the government if lots of people are using personal eco-transport. Can bang on about how green they are. Votes in that.

Nothing green about an ambulance on blues and twos when one of these dickheads bins it or mows down a pedestrian. Police will have been told to look the other way because there's more danger in chasing them than ignoring them.

[Macca]

Nothing green about an ambulance on blues and twos when one of these dickheads bins it or mows down a pedestrian. Police will have been told to look the other way because there's more danger in chasing them than ignoring them.

Fair point.

[struth]

a guy got kidnapped by his car... sounds funny but could have been disasterous.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-67005620

[Pigmy Pony]

Not good publicity for MG. Nor the RAC, taking three bloody hours to turn up.

That certainly is a new one - traditionally MG cars had problems starting, not stopping, if my brother's old Midget is anything to go by. It was part of my morning routine: get up, have shit, eat breakfast, push MG down hill to get it started, get bus to work.