Alternative platters ?

[MCRU]

Yup, Mark, I fully understand that, but that's not what I'm getting at. Let's remove the Paradise temporarily from the equation... What I'm getting at is if Simon got to hear Andy's Sugden phono stage with and without his SUT?

If not, an opportunity was missed to demonstrate the superiority of an SUT, in the context of Andy's system (therefore backing up previous arguments here over the claimed efficacy of SUTs), as the fact is he wouldn't be using it if his T/T sounded better connected directly to the Sugden.

If that was demonstrated to Simon, and he heard the improvement the ST-80SE provided in that context, then it would've added to his experience of SUTs, and moreover, provided further subjective evidence showing that SUTs can improve matters in the right circumstances, thus demonstrating that it is a valid approach.

Ya gets me now?

We will obviously have to wait until either Andrew or Simon confirm if the above comparison was carried out or not.

Marco.

off topic, move please!

[Wakefield Turntables]

off topic, move please!

Why is this off topic? This topic is about the development of platters and the possible variables which affect them. Considering your trying to sell these platters to people I would consider you let the discussion flow and learn from conclusions made from the people who may or may not purchase one.

[MCRU]

Why is this off topic? This topic is about the development of platters and the possible variables which affect them. Considering your trying to sell these platters to people I would consider you let the discussion flow and learn from conclusions made from the people who may or may not purchase one.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Reply says it all , would be nice to take a part in a discussion and not have your products rammed down our throats.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Sure, but did he hear it sans SUT, directly through the MC input of his phono stage, before the Paradise entered the equation?

*That* is the question, amigo. If not, an opportunity was missed to demonstrate the superiority of an SUT, over an active MC stage, in the context of Andy's system.... Let's face it, he wouldn't have kept the ST-80SE if it didn't improve things

The Paradise may have been overall better, but that would only have been because it outperformed his Sugden Masterclass PA4, when comparing one phono stage against the other.

Marco.

Simon got to hear several pieces of music Dream Theater, Deep Purple, some jazz, and some classical alongside some of his own stuff. This was with the SUT and the SUGDEN. The SUT was not used with the Paradise. The HiQ supercuts version of Holst's planet suite when played through the Paradise alone was amazing and comfortably outperformed than the sugden and the SUT. NO THATS SAYING SOMETHING!

I'll leave aside the SUT versus active bit..... but the Paradise doesn't have MM input.

Correct and that is why I'm attracted to this phonostage. The design of the phonostage follows one of my principles, mainly less is more, removing the whole MM section from the circuit must surely be beneficial.

Well, no doubt Si will be along in a bit to clarify; but there doesn't seem much point in listening to the Sugden without the SUT if that is how Andy normaly uses it - as Jez says, the SUT couldn't be used with the Paradise even if you wanted to. The Paradise is inherantly a MC stage and cannot be configured for MM.

I hope he does. Simon has better ears than myself and he may be able to give an accurate appraisal of what he heard. The SUT and Sugden may not be going too far It could still be used in the valve system I own. I can't believe that none of the major mags have reviewed the Sugden phonostage. It really is an excellent piece of kit.

Ah, I yeah, you mean did he get a demo of the Sugden with and without the SUT? Dunno, in short

I dont think we used the sugden without the SUT.

I hope this clears things up a little.

[Audio Al]

Its arrived

[Arkless Electronics]

Simon got to hear several pieces of music Dream Theater, Deep Purple, some jazz, and some classical alongside some of his own stuff. This was with the SUT and the SUGDEN. The SUT was not used with the Paradise. The HiQ supercuts version of Holst's planet suite when played through the Paradise alone was amazing and comfortably outperformed than the sugden and the SUT. NO THATS SAYING SOMETHING!





Correct and that is why I'm attracted to this phonostage. The design of the phonostage follows one of my principles, mainly less is more, removing the whole MM section from the circuit must surely be beneficial.



I hope he does. Simon has better ears than myself and he may be able to give an accurate appraisal of what he heard. The SUT and Sugden may not be going too far It could still be used in the valve system I own. I can't believe that none of the major mags have reviewed the Sugden phonostage. It really is an excellent piece of kit.



I dont think we used the sugden without the SUT.

I hope this clears things up a little.

Like many phono stages it doesn't have a MM stage to remove... units which have a separate internal head amp for MC are in the minority. In the case of the Arkless 640p and many others there is no more in the signal path when switched to MC than there is on MM. Only the value of 1 resistor is changed in order to give higher gain for MC.

The Paradise is different again.... The only other phono stage I know of which works in a similar manner is the Pink Triangle "The Pip". It is much more involved to make it into a MM stage but it can be done.... making it switchable is not possible. It involves a major redesign! (I don't know if the pip is switchable...).
I'm hoping to have a MC only phono stage of my own which works on the same principle available before too long It's a very interesting principle on which this technology is based.. zero feedback and virtually impossible to overload. I'm quite excited about the possibilities of this way of doing things.. just wish I didn't have to do mundane stuff to make a living and then it would be ready a lot sooner I can see possibilities (thinking out loud now) for line stages.... and more to the point, power amps, built with this technology. The later is not possible to do cheaply though!

[The Grand Wazoo]

I have an LFD MC1 moving coil only phono stage - do you know whether it falls into this same design category?

[Arkless Electronics]

I have an LFD MC1 moving coil only phono stage - do you know whether it falls into this same design category?

That's prescient! It had just occurred to me that probably some of the LFD gear uses the same technology and I was considering editing the last post to mention this....

I see you use an AR SP8.... my own valve phono stage is just the phono stage from the sp8 (home made copy) but with a 4U rack-mount 19" case PSU which gives a separate regulated supply to every valve... a 25 way "D" type connector and 1/2" thick umbilical cord connects them together. I built it about 18 years ago and it hasn't been powered up for at least 12 years! A gradual powering up via a variac seems in order before I try it with the head amp I'm working on!

[Mike_New]

Hey Folks,
Dave B really is correct when he says that all this SUT and phono amp talk is off topic.
A SUT or amplifier or surely speakers can hardly effect the characteristics of a humbl platter.