Which Tannoys, folks?

[Marco]

I disagree Tam. When tweaking the crossover and later when experimenting with active, I did lots of measurement. They are putting treble out there right up to where microphone response falls off. Lack of Tannoy treble response is a myth. The fact is they are voiced to make music, not to compete with gee-whiz hifi speakers which overemphasise the treble region to make an impact.

I've actually tried four different brands of supertweeter with mine to see what impact that might have, in all cases the result was less musical.

There were speakers (Cambridge R50s - which I've owned - and various KEFs spring to mind) back in the 60s and 70s that did the extended treble response thing and none of them can hold a candle musically to the coherence and 'rightness' of a Monitor Gold.

I totally agree, Tom, but it's rather interesting when I swap from my Lockwoods and pop the Celestion 66s onto the end of the system... I can say for a fact that the 66s are defo more extended at the top-end, and in a way which isn't in the slightest "gee-whiz hifi"!

It's one of the reasons why I bought the 66s, as they have a totally different presentation from Tannoy DCs, but do the same 'musical thing' in their own inimitable way, which is equally as enjoyable.... It's nice to have a choice

Marco.

[montesquieu]

they die above 13/14 khz , everything below is a right thing , everything above is missing

Bit of a fallacy .. I could show you the measurements (if I could find the graphs).

[wee tam]

that being the whole point tom , most people do not have the capabilities to "tweak" have to put up with what they get , imho , a 4/5 foot quarter wave to speed the bass up / dig deeper , and a very carefully selected tweeter , running in tandem would lift them to another level , all of ccourse imho

I disagree Tam. When tweaking the crossover and later when experimenting with active, I did lots of measurement. They are putting treble out there right up to where microphone response falls off. Lack of Tannoy treble response is a myth. The fact is they are voiced to make music, not to compete with gee-whiz hifi speakers which overemphasise the treble region to make an impact.

I've actually tried four different brands of supertweeter with mine to see what impact that might have, in all cases the result was less musical.

There were speakers (Cambridge R50s - which I've owned - and various KEFs spring to mind) back in the 60s and 70s that did the extended treble response thing and none of them can hold a candle musically to the coherence and 'rightness' of a Monitor Gold.

[montesquieu]

I totally agree, Tom, but it's rather interesting when I swap from my Lockwoods and pop the Celestion 66s onto the end of the system... I can say for a fact that the 66s are defo more extended at the top-end, and in a way which isn't in the slightest "gee-whiz hifi"!

It's one of the reasons why I bought the 66s, as they have a totally different presentation from Tannoy DCs, but do the same 'musical thing' in their own inimitable way, which is equally as enjoyable.... It's nice to have a choice

Marco.

My point is that it's a matter of voicing, not a question of lack of response. There is information up there it's simply not over-emphasised. I have no time whatever for Dalis and the like with their ribbon tweeters and rising treble response as advocated by people who prefer to hifi to music.

[Marco]

they die above 13/14 khz , everything below is a right thing , everything above is missing

Ah, I getcha now... I think it was the overuse of commas! Maybe try using a wee full-stop now and again...

I certainly wouldn't say that everything above was missing (defo not the case with mine), otherwise I would notice that effect very easily when I swapped back from using the 66s.

However, the Celestions most certainly extend higher up into the frequency range, which is easily heard with the right music, and indeed I'm sure that the effect could be measured, but it's a subtle difference, rather than a glaringly obvious one.

I love the 66s, but after a few days of listening to music through them, and returning to my Lockwoods, there's always a feeling of 'ah, now I'm home'!

Marco.

[Marco]

My point is that it's a matter of voicing, not a question of lack of response. There is information up there it's simply not over-emphasised. I have no time whatever for Dalis and the like with their ribbon tweeters and rising treble response as advocated by people who prefer to hifi to music.

I do agree, although in my opinion, the difference in the high-frequency response between the Celestions and my Tannoy MGs is likely there in the measurments. For me, it's defo not a voicing thing.

However, that doesn't stop me from overall preferring the Tannoys! Ultimately, I enjoy their style of musical presentation more

Marco.

[wee tam]

have to agree marco , love the sound that tannoys bring , could very easily live with them everyday , but , and there is a but , i think with a bit of modern design , they could be , simply the best , soz about the poor english , and yes whilst entriged listening , still think a wee bit more could be squeezed

Ah, I getcha now... I think it was the overuse of commas! Maybe try a wee full-stop now and again...

I certainly wouldn't say that everything above was missing (defo not the case with mine), otherwise I would notice that effect very easily when I swapped back from using the 66s.

However, the Celestions most certainly extend higher up into the frequency range, which is most obvious with the right music, and indeed I'm sure that the effect could be measured, but it's a subtle difference, rather than a glaringly obvious one.

I love the 66s, but after a few days of listening to music through them, and returning to my Lockwoods, there's always a feeling of 'ah, now I'm home'!

Marco.

[Marco]

Fair enough, dude. However, you don't need to make 15 MGs "larger sounding", because they're fooking "larger sounding" enough!!

I think half the problem is that you don't really like BIG speakers. All the speakers you've said you've liked on here are what I would term as 'titchy'. Personally, I couldn't live with anything smaller than my 66s, as I like deep bass, and especially SCALE...

If I used the speakers you like on the end of my system, whilst I might like the sound, I'd wonder where the bass had gone!!

YMMV

Marco.

[Reffc]

Entering the latest discussion a little late but I'm with Marco and Tom. I was told in no uncertain terms that the Turnberrys needed super tweeters (by someone who happened to sell them) but there's plenty of detail there. Unlike my old Proac speakers that were designed to wow on first impressions but actually tend to make your ears bleed after 20 minutes listening, I can listen to the Tannoys all day without treble fatigue. They are voiced very naturally IMHO, although its true that there are speakers out there with a flatter response across the audible bandwidth. That doesn't matter when they are so musically involving and when most music bought today is mastered and engineered so that whatever your speakers measure at, the replay depends to some extent what the studio monitors were that the engineers used for mastering....and many still use Tannoys!

Have a look at this graph (link below) those who still mistakenly believe that all vintage Tannoys are rolled off. The top line on each graph shows the "flat" response befoe applying any roll off or energy drop to accommodate different room acoustics. Those graphs are still more than acceptable today and much flatter in the 50 to 100Hz region too where many of todays compact floor standers and stand mount speakers have an artificial hump built in (usually where port tuning kicks in) so have a more natural bass presentation too. This is an actual measurement from the 315HPD and puts to bed the myth that they don't do treble or that it rolls off after 14KHz:

http://www.44bx.com/tannoy/images/Page8.jpg

[walpurgis]

Bit of a fallacy .. I could show you the measurements (if I could find the graphs).

Here's a publicity sheet for the Monitor Gold with response graphs.



There is significant but slightly reduced output beyond 20kHz and I believe the treble output actually extends to around 30kHz, but is dropping steeply by that point.