The price is right....or is it?

[Mr Kipling]

What is it exactly?

Marco.

I'll let Geoff (walpurgis) enlighten you. I always liked it for its simplicity and form, especially when mounted on its stand.

I mentioned this on the infamous cable thread. Some say it all comes down to personal choice. If someone wants to blow £500 on interconnects, well, that's their choice. I still find it hard to see it that way, but that's just me.

It's hardly anything new though, as has already been said. Perhaps hi-fi dave can tell us what the cost price to Linn for the Ittok was, and compare that to the retail price they sold it for.

[Barry]

I'll let Geoff (walpurgis) enlighten you. I always liked it for its simplicity and form, especially when mounted on its stand.

I mentioned this on the infamous cable thread. Some say it all comes down to personal choice. If someone wants to blow £500 on interconnects, well, that's their choice. I still find it hard to see it that way, but that's just me.

It's hardly anything new though, as has already been said. Perhaps hi-fi dave can tell us what the cost price to Linn for the Ittok was, and compare that to the retail price they sold it for.

Don't know about the Ittok, but I believe Linn bought the Grace 707 arms in for £30 a piece and sold them on for ~£150.

[julesd68]

Hi Julian,
Thanks for that reply, as I said my choice of valves is unusual, 2 x PCF80 plus PCC189, with 2 JFETs for the MC input.
The unit is all hard wired apart from the JFET stage and I'm making them for the introductory price of £290.

Interesting - never even heard of those tubes!

Couple of questions - are you able to offer 'bespoke' cases if people want something a bit different to the stock case? And in terms of testing or feedback you have got, what kind of 'level' of phono stage have you been comparing yours to?

[Ali Tait]

They are the same valves as ECF80 and ECC189, except the heaters are wired in series rather than parallel.

[Firebottle]

Julian I will happily build into a different case if you wish.
I have recently compared the Firebottle Phono with a Croft 25R. There was a small tonal difference which I think is due to Glen Croft using a non RIAA equalisation curve.

I have also had an albeit too brief comparison with a Graaf GM70 phono, during which I couldn't tell a difference. The gain for both is very similar.

Ali - the P series of valve have a fixed current rating of 300mA for the heater, so some might require 7.6V and others 9.6V, or in between.

Alan

[Marco]

I have recently compared the Firebottle Phono with a Croft 25R. There was a small tonal difference which I think is due to Glen Croft using a non RIAA equalisation curve.

Hi Alan,

Interesting... Could you please expand on the small tonal difference you heard, by describing it, and also in what way Glenn's phono stages use a non RIAA equalisation curve, i.e. what is the recognised standard and how does the curve Glenn uses differ?

As a long-term owner of a Croft Charisma-X preamp, with its superb built-in phono stage, I've been aware that it's always sounded different/more 'musical', to my ears, than any other phono stages I've heard or used, so some rationale for what I've experienced would be good!

Marco.

[Firebottle]

Hi Marco,
Yes it is interesting and I am keen to learn what it is that gives the Croft preamps their 'voicing'.
I'm rather making assumptions (why I said I think..) about the non-RIAA eq as I haven't got the circuits to hand at the moment, but will be following this up.
From what I have read Glen is a huge fan of Decca carts and has tailored the eq to match.

The tonal difference was slight, a more 'full bodied' sound from the Firebottle phono, as if the lower mid range was a little stronger in comparison.
I know that Croft kit incorporates feedback equalisation whereas I opt for passive.

I'm on the case to find out more

Alan

[Marco]

Nice one... Yup, Glenn is defo a big fan of Deccas, although if his phono stages have been voiced to match them, I've not noticed any incompatibility, as a result, sonically or electrically, with other cartridges. However, most of the time my MM stage is being used in conjunction with an MC head amp or step-up transformer.

Do bear in mind, too, that my preamp is the old type, which uses the octal-style 6SL7 valves, as opposed to the current varieties inside the 25R, and which do sound rather different

Marco.

[nat8808]

I think the Lampizator example (which I guess is based on Audio Note et al) of upgrades along the line is a good one to follow for boutique products.

More features or better parts for different levels of performance. It gets the mouth watering, imagining what the next level up sounds like.

[Firebottle]

I certainly have no objection to anyone taking that approach but I have initially taken the approach of maximum sound for minimum buck

Alan