technics tt advice wanted

[The Vinyl Adventure]

i have been floating around on this forum for long enough now to notice that people seem to have a little fasination with technics direct drive turntables.
i have read enough for it to have got me intriged

where do i start if i wanted to investigate this myself? what is a good turntable to start fiddleing with?

are there plenty of upgrades than can be made to these type of deck for little money?

is this one of those "great hifi for little cost" things that a certain few people on here seem to get off on?

how much realistically would i need to spend on a project like this for it to outperform my xerxes original/tabriz/oc9/psu 2 (i understand this is subjective and down to many variables but opinions are welcome)

im sure people have gone over this a lot of times on this forum but if people can spare the time to share thier knoledge on the subject with me id be very greatful

[DSJR]

A properly working and non-sagging Xerxes is a very good way to play records indeed. An old reviewer friend had one with Arta Xerxes add-on phono stage and the sound from it was always superb, with few if any of the "usual" LP woes of noise, wow and compression. he had thousands of CD's too and never needed to compare as the music came first.

The only way regarding the Technics is to try to get a good cheap one used and take Marco's and Dave Cawley's advice on how to proceed. Don't do anything with the Roksan until you're entirely satisfied that you're doing the right thing.

The main issue is going to be how well the Xerxes is running these days and how well set up it is. It's deceptively simple inside, but there are a few areas that need a skilled hand I gather (I know the Thorens/AR/Systemdek/Linn setup much better). The sagging armboard is an important issue these days and Roksan cannot replace with new parts (Neither can Technics supply parts for their old decks, but I digress).

The thing with the Technics is that spares for this generation won't be a problem for many decades I suspect, the setup seems to stay that way and carefully tweaked and with an even more capable arm fitted (the standard one is fine and surprisingly low mass for such a chunky looking device), it'll equal or better some very serious hardware (I look forward to comparing a certain SL110/SME with a Spacedeck sometime soon ).

Hope this helps a bit. Until you've heard one, you won't know if this is the route you wish to take.

[Marco]

Hi Hamish,

I'll get to this later - tied up at the moment. Sadly, though, it has nothing to do with bondage

Laters,
Marco.

[The Vinyl Adventure]

just to clarify a point, i dont want to replace my xerxes i just want something i can fiddle with without the fear of breaking it. beyond that the queery about cost of getting a sound better than the xerxes was more out of interest.
my xerxes is in need of a tweak but it does sound quite fantastic with the right vinyl

frustratingly i did at one point have a really rough 1200 tt but i, at the time, couldnt see how even with a huge investment it could be made to sound good... so i gave it away
the chap i gave it to has since spent about £80 on it and now its nothing special but it sounds like much more than the £80 he has spent on it... i nearly tried to buy it off him but decided i would look a bit daft

[DaveK]

Hi Marco,
I supect that I am not the only one that hopes you respond to Hamish's request on this open thread, as opposed to by PM - the more information that I can glean from you and any other member with something to offer the happier I will be .

[DSJR]

before thinking of tweaks, I'd ask this question... If buying new "out of the box," would you have a Techie, a Rega P3 or whatever Pro-ject are making this season?

I'll tell you one thing, although the Rega is a great "sensible" buy and the RB300/301 is legendary with the right deck and cartridge, I know which one I'd go for (and one of it's direct ancestors is up in the office awaiting a mounting plate and arm re-wire).

[MartinT]

how much realistically would i need to spend on a project like this for it to outperform my xerxes original/tabriz/oc9/psu 2 (i understand this is subjective and down to many variables but opinions are welcome)

Hi Hamish

I can perhaps answer your question and give you an idea of what you could achieve since my previous setup was very close to yours.

Previous Setup
Roksan Xerxes/SME IV/AT OC9/PSU 2
Phono amp was EAR 834P

Current Setup
Technics SL-1210/Jelco SA250ST/AT 33PTG/TimeStep PSU
Phono amp is PS Audio GCPH

The Xerxes was a good deck with excellent timing, good soundstaging, reasonable dynamics and far less colouration than a Linn. The reason I moved it on was because of the dreaded sag and Roksan's abandonment of support and spares.

You can buy a brand new SL-1210 and, with at least the TimeStep installed, you already have the makings of a very fine deck. I would say the arm comes next and then you're into giant-killing territory. My well-modded 1210 sounds better than I remember my Xerxes ever sounding, especially in dynamic impact and structural bass, but also in the almost holographic presentation. Some of this must be attributed to the excellent Jelco arm, but the 1210 responds very well to different cartridges too. I spent about £1300 on the 1210, arm and PSU. That outlay buys you a lot more turntable than anything else on the market that I can think of. There is also superb warranty, backup and spares availability. You can just keep taking it further with mats, clamps/weights, isolation feet etc. and it keeps on improving.

[NRG]

There's more than just Technics you know Ebay is awash with alternatives some expensive and some not so with the majority being at very reasonable cost if you just want to 'play', there's Denons, Pioneers, Kenwoods etc all worthy of checking out or for real budget thrills try the Lenco (idler wheel)...you never know you just may prefer it over the DD's

[MartinT]

There's more than just Technics you know

With the small but important difference that the Technics is still in production.

[The Vinyl Adventure]

Hi Hamish

I can perhaps answer your question and give you an idea of what you could achieve since my previous setup was very close to yours.

Previous Setup
Roksan Xerxes/SME IV/AT OC9/PSU 2
Phono amp was EAR 834P

Current Setup
Technics SL-1210/Jelco SA250ST/AT 33PTG/TimeStep PSU
Phono amp is PS Audio GCPH

The Xerxes was a good deck with excellent timing, good soundstaging, reasonable dynamics and far less colouration than a Linn. The reason I moved it on was because of the dreaded sag and Roksan's abandonment of support and spares.

You can buy a brand new SL-1210 and, with at least the TimeStep installed, you already have the makings of a very fine deck. I would say the arm comes next and then you're into giant-killing territory. My well-modded 1210 sounds better than I remember my Xerxes ever sounding, especially in dynamic impact and structural bass, but also in the almost holographic presentation. Some of this must be attributed to the excellent Jelco arm, but the 1210 responds very well to different cartridges too. I spent about £1300 on the 1210, arm and PSU. That outlay buys you a lot more turntable than anything else on the market that I can think of. There is also superb warranty, backup and spares availability. You can just keep taking it further with mats, clamps/weights, isolation feet etc. and it keeps on improving.

its nice to hear from someone who has direct experience!
the main issue, as i said , with the current set up is the fear i have of damageing it knowing it will cost a lot to get fixed
and it all seems so fragile!
the daft thing is i dont listen to enough vinyl to invest silly money but with the few hic-ups i have had with the xerxes of late, and in fact since i have owned it... it just feels like its showing its age and if i invest more it might be dead money
so spending a little bit of money now and again on something that, relativly speaking, is cheap to do up and easy to get bits for and isnt going to go out of date,and maybe, might replace the xerxes, when and if i feel its good enough... seems to be the logical thing to do to me....
hence my interest
and in resposnse NRG..... hence my lack of interest in some of the older stuff about.... i have read a bit about the pioneer pl-71 and coincidentally someone emailed me saying that had just got one (done up by richard dunn) today but i wouldnt feel comfortable investing in a deck and then relying scarce second hand bits if something went wrong... after all i have that situation with my xerxes

if this seems off or daft to anyone, or anyone can give me an alternative then let me know... but i genuinly think im on to a good idea here...

.... i just need to know a bit more about directions and prices of things and what is reasonable and what is not etc....