Which Tannoys, folks?

[lewis]

As Marco and others have correctly pointed out, the Turnberry's are indeed a price/performance/size compromise, and the next step up the Tannoy ladder is the Kensington, which is approx double the price of the Turnberry My listening room also doubles as our lounge, and the 18" width of the Turnberry is about as large as i could go to. Personally, i love the looks of the Turnberry, and the walnut finish blends quite nicely with our natural oak furniture, but if i had a dedicated listening room i think the Lockwood Majors would be a no-brainer! Let us know how you get on.

[Reffc]

Right folks: My report!

After a marathon day with not that far short of 5 hours driving in total and two stops, I can give you my impressions. please note that these are my own personal views and in no way reflect on what other enthiusiasts and manufacturers may claim.

1st Stop: Turnberry SE's - Location...somewhere in the Twilghlight Zone (do-do-do-do) North of London,; John's system (non AoS member)

These were in a room of equal proportions to my own set up more nearfield (within a few m) and were on the end of a long chain of fairly exotic components (probably £35Ks worth) including Audio Note gear and a rather tasty Air Tight EL34 amp.

I had several album tracks played (these I took with me) for comparisons sake:

St Celia's Mass (Gounod) (Barbara Hendrix...soprano);
James Blake "James Blake" album (track 6);
Robert Plant "Band of Joy" Track 3 side 3.

We listened to more music but these were my comparison tracks as they had between them a lot going on and I am very familiar with them.

First and foremost, the Turnberrys exhibited a "wall" of sound, even at low volumes which clearly placed instruments in the mix without ever sounding "boxy" or in any way constrained. the bass quality was excellent. Crisp and well defined without boom and with genuine extension. James Blake Track 6 drops to about 35 Hz in places (synth bass) and unlike the SHL5's they played the bass lines clearly, with real definition to the notes and without a hint of roll off. The upper treble detail was crisp without being forward or aggressive.

After playing all album tracks it became evident that the above qualities shone through no-matter what the recording but the weakness was the the UPPER mids had a slight indistinct rough edge...ever so slight but there. There was a little colouration in the mix, but certainly not annoyingly so and it improved when the crossover treble controls were dropped by -3dB. The mid range was more recessed than the SHL5s and slightly less distinct because of that upper nasality but the overall effect was far more balanced, thanks to better HF detail and FAR better LF detail and extension. The overall "non boxiness" appealed and at low volumes it was delightful to get such accurate and realistic bass. I like the Turnberrys a lot. they are a cracking speaker and ones that I could very happily live with.

Onto the 2nd Stop: 30 miles later: Tannoy 15 inch MGs in GRF cabs (big buggers...about the same size as Lockwoods) - AoS's very own montesquieu's system!

Everything described above applies to this set up, but with some notable differences. Bass whilst no more forward or better defined but had larger scale and harmonic content which shaped the overall sonic picture quite favourably. Midrange was much improved over the Turnberrys and treble detail a smidgen cleaner. The crossovers were new £500 affairs but there was lots of other system adjustment (wont go into detail). The choral works were a complete joy. They showed the SHL5s a clean pair of heals in mid range transparency and upper detail cleanliness as well as in bass and imaging. What I had thought of as sibilance on track 3 of St Celia's Mass turned out to be a French Horn (stage right, at least on the recording) getting all raspy and high. I genuinely have never heard that before! Bass...oh dear. Brilliant on some CD recordings but vague and woolly on the vinyl set up until I pointed out that the output impedance on Tom's (very useful) fancy cart loading box of tricks was way too high. We dropped it down to 20KOhms and the bass snapped into focus. Tom has since contacted me to explain that the cabs were moved too close to the rear walls and by pulling them out, the bass has improved and the boominess disappeared.

Tom (montesquieu) explained just how much work had gone into the amp and crossover to get things this far (£2K in all, just in mods) and was left with the distinct impression that whilst the older units can reward like few others in a natural and effortless wall of balanced sound, it takes great pain for EACH set of loudspeakers and living room space to play with crossovers and amplifiers in order to achieve this. They are much more fussy than the newer prestige range which are far more "plug and play".

Conclusions:

1. I drove a bloody long way!
2. SHL5s can have an apparent mid forwardness mainly due to indistinct and slightly rolled of bass and to my ears, a poor treble quality by comparison with well sorted older Tannoys, but they are still very good. I'm talking subtleties and not night and day.
3. the newer Tannoy Prestige range is very good, straight out of the box and not as amp/room fussy as older models
4. Newer Prestige Tannoys do have an upper mid "honk" which adds distortion to some vocals but it is liveable with IMHO and their overall balance is still very much high quality Tannoy sound.
5. SHL5s major in clear midrange but lose out IMHO in other areas compared to the Prestige range and older Tannoys, particularly bass and scale. However the mid range is what many like, so for broadcast work, quiet home listening, jazz and vocals, the SHL5s are near on perfect and for most would count as their last loudspeaker.


For full on orchestral/choral works, Tannoys rock!

I still feel like I have an itch to scratch so although I'm sure that I might just regret doing this, it's likely that I will be moving on the SHL5s and matching stands. pm if interested!
Oh...I also made another convert of Tom to Choral. That's two converts now (Jerry was the first!)

Now out for a well earned pint.
.

[The Black Adder]

Ahh... good work, Paul.

Sounds like you heard the same thing as I did with the Tannoys when I changed from the SHL5's. Although I do still like the SHL5's very much but I'm hooked to the sheer scale of the Tannoy sound.. I too have heard Tom's system. The GRF's do sound well smart. His room is really quite fitting for them too I felt.

I bought my Lockwood cabs from Tom, nice chap.

[Marco]

Hi Paul,

Sounds like you had a great time and learned a few things, which is what it's all about! I agree pretty much with your findings

They showed the SHL5s a clean pair of heals in mid range transparency and upper detail cleanliness as well as in bass and imaging. What I had thought of as sibilance on track 3 of St Celia's Mass turned out to be a French Horn (stage right, at least on the recording) getting all raspy and high. I genuinely have never heard that before!

Hehehe... I've had a similar thing happen often when people visit my place who are used to hearing music through more conventional speakers. 15MGs, when properly sorted with top-notch modern crossovers, reveal everything in the mix, as they are genuine studio monitors, but their ruthlessly revealing nature isn't at the expense of musicality, unlike can be the case with some of today's studio monitors.

That is also why I love my Celestion 66s, which are similarly revealing, but offer a different take on music, to my Tannoys. I just love the brutal honesty offered by both! It's one of the reasons why I'm able to detect the subtlest of differences when making adjustments to my system, such as changing plugs on cables or even analysing the sonic effect of different types of solder! With the 15MGs, the system serves as being both an analytical tool and a wide-open open window onto the music, making for long and very enjoyable listening sessions.

What did you think of Tom's Tube Distinctions/AoS valve amp? It's a Chinese Puresound P/P design, heavily modified by Anthony Matthews, who's one of our trade members here.

Marco.

[Reffc]

Tannoys: Part II

Well, for balance, I invited Jerry over today and he brought with him his Parasound amp, as it was taking the day off from bump starting the local power station

We hooked up the Harbeths and compared the 7R to the Parasound. To the credit of the Croft amps, they compared very favourably; the difference was not one of those "night and day" moments.

The point of this was to see if better bass definition could be had with the SHL5s. What the Parasound (250w/ch) brought to the table when used with the Croft micro25 pre was better clarity and slightly better definition of the bass, with sligtly more obvious bass note decay. Note the repeated use of the word "slight".

Conclusions: The SHL5s are a wonderful loudspeaker, and for many, would be the last speaker they'd ever want to own. They do most things quite well and IMHO they exel at human voice reproduction, are great with acoustic, jazz, blues and light orchestral music. The play rock well too and you tend to forget the speakers and get your toes tapping to whaever spins up.

However, the itch I thought needed scratching still needs scratching and I find the crispness of bass and balanced presentation of the Turnberrys infectious as indeed on a larger scale the GRFs. They are coloured and aren't IMHo in the league of the SHL5s in some areas, but do things differently enough (such as full scale orchestral) to tip their charms in favour of what I like...more effortless scale even at lower volumes. Swapping amps and fiddling with position didn't change things appreciably with the Harbeths, so great as they are, they are now up for sale. the ad will be appearing soon. rare to get a new set complete with custom stands in the more expensive finish come up for grabs, so someone is going to get a bargain!

[Reffc]

Result.

Just agreed a deal on some Tannoys. Now need to make room for them so selling the SHL5s, stands and cables all in for a silly knock down price

[Marco]

Result.

Just agreed a deal on some Tannoys.

Which ones: Turnberrys or 15MGs?

Marco.

[Reffc]

Which ones: Turnberrys or 15MGs?

Marco.

Was offered the Lockwoods but on reflection, we have to live in the room too, and measuring up we could get the Lockwoods in no problem, but I think they'd dominate too much, so I've settled on the Turnberrys and agreed a deal. They can't be compared with 10inch DC 'speakers of old. The cabinets are better for a start (Tannoy didn't do cabs very well in the past and they'd be the first to agree!) and the driver design extracts greater and cleaner bass than the older 10 inchers. Married to a not insubstantial cab volume, they're not the compromise you might think. I was mightily impressed by them. I have already penned a design for some American black Walnut short stands to raise them 150mm (needed for our listening position) and will have those completed in a week or so. They will be designed to exactly match the profile of the Turnberrys so it looks like an extension of the 'speaker.

[Marco]

Hi Paul,

Nice one - you've obviously made the best overall choice for your circumstances, so congrats on acquiring a very nice pair of speakers and on joining the Tannoy club. Enjoy, and we want to see some pics when you have your new babies in situ

Marco.

[Reffc]

Cheers Marco, will post pics in due course...depends how long the SHL5's hang around now, as the option is to box them up and put them in storage if they don't go this week. I'd rather sell to forum members than use the dreaded Ebay for speakers of this quality. They know they'd be getting a great deal and great speakers and I'd know I was dealing with a genuine buyer.

Really looking forward to getting the Tannoys in place now.

In answer to your earlier question (just picked up that I hadn't answered it) I was pretty impressed with Tom's Puresound amp. Anthony's done a great job. Ironically, my own Lumley ST40 (which I sold a few months back) was offered back to me recently, and I can't think of a better amp for Tannoys. Push-pull? Check. Sounds great? Check. Hand builtusing very high quality transformers? Check. Rebuilt from the chassis up a few years back with high quality internals (I had that done by the original designer/builder). had I known then I'd be going to Tannoys I'd have broken the chaps arm for it back