Synergy

[Spectral Morn]

Well to be honest i think the best way is to hear as many systems as you can, hear what possible, then hear stuff in your own enviornment and do not make rash choices.

Agreed

[Spectral Morn]

This is more what I had in mind at the start of the thread. The magical synergy we speak of can be more easily found is some account of specs is taken as some sense applied to matching and yes, plently of listening to different setups. I think what we have though is not so much any magical synergy, it more a profound lack of synergy all too often.

Agreed

[nat8808]

Following this line of logic, which I'm happy to do...when we hear a sound we prefer over another we tend to say this is a subjective view. We could say that providing there is agreement that a difference exists, then we are objectively measuring some system parameters without a defined scale.

No, the cook is judging in a subjective manner (an experienced and trained one perhaps, but still subjective) unless he/she is using a measuring cup, scales or a meat thermometer etc., then it is objective.

Subjectivity is only about choices due to taste. Using yourself as a measuring instrument isn't about taste, it's about using you senses as tools to make rough objective measurements.

For example if you have to put up a shelf level and at 1.5m but forgot your tape measure or spirit level, you're not suddenly making subjective choices because you forgot your tools, you're trying to make objective measurements using what you have to hand - your previous experience and senses. Similarly, if you're trying to put a shelf up at the same height as you previously had it and still with no measuring implements to hand, that is also objective.

If you were asked to put up a shelf so that it was aesthetically pleasing then where you put it, at what height at what angle etc would be subjective.

There's a big difference in the situations in terms of why and how you are making the choices. The subjective one is only the one where you are making choices to please yourself at that particular moment (not a pre-determined choice where the subjective part was done in the past and you're objectively recreating it).

Can't remember why I'm talking about it now.... sure its relevent.

[nat8808]

Doing it more randomly is ultimately more fun though as it allows you to come up with combos that are more pleasing because they seem to defy convention.

It frees up your choices too and more able to make purchases on other perameters like the design or 'aura' of the bit of kit (like a 40s cinema valve amp).

I see people trying to find a good match for their speakers or pre for their power amp, making logical choices and disregarding this or that out of hand or this type of topology and see them taking well trodden paths because they have to make choices where the kit's specs are well known etc.

For me, that turns a hobby (the hifi kit part) into a bit of a sterile and boring affair in my personal opinion anyway. Then again if hifi for someone is only about the music (not the kit) then it's a means to and end I suppose.

[awkwardbydesign]

Subjectivity is only about choices due to taste. Using yourself as a measuring instrument isn't about taste, it's about using you senses as tools to make rough objective measurements.

For example if you have to put up a shelf level and at 1.5m but forgot your tape measure or spirit level, you're not suddenly making subjective choices because you forgot your tools, you're trying to make objective measurements using what you have to hand - your previous experience and senses. Similarly, if you're trying to put a shelf up at the same height as you previously had it and still with no measuring implements to hand, that is also objective.

If you were asked to put up a shelf so that it was aesthetically pleasing then where you put it, at what height at what angle etc would be subjective.

There's a big difference in the situations in terms of why and how you are making the choices. The subjective one is only the one where you are making choices to please yourself at that particular moment (not a pre-determined choice where the subjective part was done in the past and you're objectively recreating it).

Can't remember why I'm talking about it now.... sure its relevent.

Coo, I like it. Can I quote it elsewhere, please?

[awkwardbydesign]

Trail and error very costly IMHO
But this is where forums and friends come in

However, if you can modify AND return to earlier specs cheaply, then trial and error can be very useful. Unless you blow something up!

[nat8808]

Coo, I like it. Can I quote it elsewhere, please?

Ha ha, of course you can. A brave man...

[synsei]

So, what you are saying Nat is that the shelf I put up a few years ago is subjectively straight and level therefore everyone who's criticised it for being wonky can go sling their collective (objective) hooks. I win...

[awkwardbydesign]

So, what you are saying Nat is that the shelf I put up a few years ago is subjectively straight and level therefore everyone who's criticised it for being wonky can go sling their collective hooks. I win...

Surely that should read "objective hooks...."

[synsei]

Good point, fixed