Which would you keep?

[kininigin]

There was a period when i didn't have a tt and i moved around alot.I thought to myself,i don't play them might as well sell them.Even when times were tough,i could never bring myself to do it.Instead they came with me taking up space just sitting there.

So i agree with some here,that it's more than just the music its self,there's memories and feelings that go along with it also.

Whilst I accept that in modern times people's lives have changed, it is *precisely* the dehumanising effect you have just described which I hate (and refuse to embrace) about today's computer-driven, technology obsessed, world.

It's so easy getting sucked into living a life driven by insidious marketing (and in the process technology subconsciously dictating how we live, rather than us using it moderation), to the extent that most folk don't even realise that it's happening to them!

In effect, we've become a nation of technology tarts, and as such, more robot-like by the day....

Long may I own the physical and tactile personal possessions which define me as a human being; and most importantly, as an individual. And my treasured music collection is one of them.

Marco.

While i tend to agree with the points you have made here,i wouldn't go as far as saying computers or technology are dehumanising,but more there implementation can be dehumanising.

If someone makes a piece of music using nothing but computers and it connects with thousands of people,emotionally,socially,spiritually ect,is that dehumanising?

If someone gives an awe inspiring speech or presentation ect,which can motivate people to achieve something better and this can be transmited around the world in a matter of minutes,is this dehumanising?

When i go snowboarding,everyone has harddrives with them full of music.We can swap drives check out each others music,discover new bands ect.When we go to the local bars,we can have such a varied selection of music playing by simply plugging in someones harddrive and then either taking the piss out of there music tastes or getting the whole bar enjoying something they might not of heard before.
This to me is not dehumanising,but in fact the opposite

[jandl100]

Jerry, have you thought of adding a computer to your listening habits ?

Yes, I've thought about it, but it doesn't do it for me.

I've a strong, personal and, I am happy to admit, illogical aversion to connecting a computer to my hifi. It's just not something that I want to do.

... maybe it's something about spending my entire career concerned with aspects of the IT industry!

The very last thing I want to do at home is feck about with computers!

[bobbasrah]

And the original question was.... “If you had to choose b/w them, which would you keep, your hi-fi or your music collection? And, why. “
Although a theoretical question, it does seem to have stirred weighty considerations of the dilemna, and we are all entitled to our individual opinions and justifications, irrespective of what anyone else thinks.
I'm not sure the criticisms of modern technology or personal feelings of others are merited though.
The thought of being surrounded in silence and memorabilia alone would be like one foot in the grave to me.... Imagine the hell of being grateful to see a Bose system.....

[Marco]

Hi Darren,

You make some very good points, all of which I agree with

While i tend to agree with the points you have made here,i wouldn't go as far as saying computers or technology are dehumanising,but more there implementation can be dehumanising.

Yes, but for me, any technology which makes us use the God-given skills we were born with LESS, is dehmanising us, and I'll cite some examples of this in a minute.

If someone makes a piece of music using nothing but computers and it connects with thousands of people,emotionally,socially,spiritually ect,is that dehumanising?

Nope; it has precisely the opposite effect, and is simply a valid example (of which there are many) of where technology can enrichen our lives. I own some of that very music on vinyl, which is mostly of the trance/electronic genre, and when I'm in the right mood, it is utterly fantastic!

For me, it comes down to a question of moderation. Almost anything in moderation is good for us in some way; it's when things are taken to extremes and dominate our lives that they become bad.

My view is that technology should be respected and used considerately, in moderation, in areas of our lives where it can make a genuine improvement, during circumstances where solely human intervention cannot achieve the same desired result.

If someone gives an awe inspiring speech or presentation ect,which can motivate people to achieve something better and this can be transmited around the world in a matter of minutes,is this dehumanising?

Nope. It's another valid example where the effect of using technology is good.

When i go snowboarding,everyone has harddrives with them full of music.We can swap drives check out each others music,discover new bands ect.When we go to the local bars,we can have such a varied selection of music playing by simply plugging in someones harddrive and then either taking the piss out of there music tastes or getting the whole bar enjoying something they might not of heard before.
This to me is not dehumanising,but in fact the opposite

Absolutely - and ditto, as per my previous reply.

Technology succeeds in dehumanising us when:

*Children can no longer read, write or communicate properly because mobile phones, texting, and Internet social networking sites have robbed them of the need to use those basic human skills - providing of course that they were taught them properly in the first place, which these days one cannot take as a 'given'.

What state of affairs have we reached when children in the SAME ROOM would rather text each other on mobile phones, in order to 'communicate', than open their mouths and SPEAK??? *That* is the ultimate example of dehumanisation via technology!

*Able-bodied people would rather send emails to friends and/or family than pick up the phone, or (shock, horror!) go and visit them, should they live nearby... Could you imagine a scarier concept than getting off of your backside and moving, or horror of horrors, actually TALKING face-to-face with a fellow human being??

*On-line shopping is slowly killing the high-streets of our towns by forcing long-established family-run businesses to close their premises because they can't compete financially with heavily discounting on-line retailers.

*People would rather click on a mouse, buying their groceries from supermarket websites and having it delivered to their doors, than getting off of their backsides and physically selecting them from the actual shops where they came from, and taking their groceries home with them instead. No wonder that as a nation we're becoming lazier, more obese and unhealthier than ever!

*We are forced to abandon perfectly good technology, as a result of goods made from older technology being made commercially obsolete, for something inferior that marketing men have decided we should have instead, thus creating an unhealthy obsession with gadgetry, and today's rather horrific 'disposable society'.

I could go on, but hopefully you're getting the picture...

Marco.

[Marco]

The thought of being surrounded in silence and memorabilia alone would be like one foot in the grave to me.... Imagine the hell of being grateful to see a Bose system.....

Bob, don't you have a wife/partner and/or friends and family with whom to share your passions?

If not, then perhaps that's why you feel the way you do. "Being surrounded in silence and memorabilia alone" is far removed from the reality of my life!

Marco.

[Barry]

Well it seems this thread is going to run and run!

Apologies for ‘shouting’ in my post, but it did seem as though the answer to the OP was so dammed obvious that there was no need for discussion.

Yet Jerry’s thought provoking post, which runs against the feelings of most of the responders, is just that: thought provoking and deserves further comment. I still remain convinced that if it were a clear choice between my music collection and my system, it would be the music collection every time. That doesn’t mean I would set out to replace my system with the same items that I had – I would most likely buy ‘new’, modern and well-regarded items of gear. But Jerry is a self confessed ‘box-swapper’ for reasons he eloquently outlined in another thread.

So let’s consider starting out again to build up a music collection. Well, unless struck by an acute case of amnesia (or heaven forbid, a stroke), I would have a memory of my musical history, so would be as likely to include items of those artists and musical genres that I had. Not every thing of course, that would be impossible: many albums are long out of print with little chance of re-issue, and some of them are, with hindsight, of less interest to me than they were. But my tastes would not have changed, so my new collection would not be so different, at least in musical styles.

I am always looking for new music as well as re-discovering music that I had (to my loss) dismissed in my youth: Tamla Motown, soul, and stuff on the Atlantic label for example. AoS’s ‘Spinning Today’ thread is a mine of new listening for me, and is the first thread I visit when I log on. The ‘Album club’ is also a very useful source of ‘new’ music for me. So there would be some different items in my ‘new’ collection, but fundamentally it would not be so very different.

I don’t understand André’s approach whereby the hardware seems to be more important than the software, but I have probably misunderstood his thoughts.

My conviction hasn’t changed, but I would like to thank Jerry for “thinking the unthinkable”, or for “thinking outside the box” – I certainly made me think!



Regarding e-Books, Kindles and the like. I can understand their appeal, but they are not for me. I don’t like reading off a screen and much prefer the tactile experience of printed books (preferably hardback): the feel and yes, the smell. When I travel I’m quite happy to take a couple of paperbacks with me to read whilst waiting at airports. Kindles are stiff, solid and vulnerable, and as I say, I don’t like reading off a screen: never have done. At work I would print off large amounts of text onto paper, rather than read off the screen. So much for the “paperless office”!

[kininigin]

I could go on, but hopefully you're getting the picture...

Marco.

I get the picture marco and fully agree,when technology is used excessively in the way you described.Text speak being
particularly high on my list of the way tech has made people lazy and dumbed down,im no einstein,but i try at least.

In answer to the OP,music first and foremost!

[Rare Bird]

I don’t understand André’s approach whereby the hardware seems to be more important than the software, but I have probably misunderstood his thoughts.

People change & so do their habbits. Many moons ago when i first got serious about hifi & had so much money i was changing equipment like crazy, there wasnt anything i hadnt had at one point or another, this be the very early 80's. & putting together such a collection of rare LP's i literally had no where to house them. Remember i was still young & all i knew was present time hi-fi components, as i matured i got to reading about vintage Hi-fi,it was different, seemed to have lots more character to what i was presently using.. my love for vintage grew & grew. It got to a stage where actual music too a back seat, from then the music was getting unimportant!

Since my very early intrests in Vintage ive always always had an attraction for the Ferrograph Series Seven Equipment, no other brand apart from the early Castle Acoustics Loudspeakers have had such a prelonged effect on me, a love affair that will no doubt last forever.

You may think i'm crazy but it's taken me six 'F307' amplifiers & nine series seven open reels to get the cosmetic parts together to create the mint items i own today. I could never ever ever part with them.

That clears the hifi bit up & as to why they are so so important to me.

As for music, it's still to this day has less of an intrest to me than my gear does.. i find myself listerning to a lesser & lesser selection of music, what i do listern most of is not the obscure Psych & Prog i so prized within my early collection but the more common garden side (if you like) of the music, hence they are very easy to source.

I'm even considering buying another vintage turntable & sourcing just these records but big collections are no more with me.All other music will be plain old CD on open Reel, I use technology to feed off but dont rely on it as a source. if you get my meaning.

I am a complex mixed up character so bare with me cos i'm crap at putting my thang across in writing

[Marco]

Hi Barry,

I don’t like reading off a screen and much prefer the tactile experience of printed books (preferably hardback): the feel and yes, the smell. When I travel I’m quite happy to take a couple of paperbacks with me to read whilst waiting at airports. Kindles are stiff, solid and vulnerable, and as I say, I don’t like reading off a screen: never have done. At work I would print off large amounts of text onto paper, rather than read off the screen.

I can totally relate to that, especially to the bits in bold! The only exception to that is when I'm on here. But what you describe is precisely why I couldn't live with on-line magazines or newspapers, not that I bother with the latter these days, even in a paper format.

Reading reams of text on a screen gets on my nerves, as does typing sometimes on a computer, which is why most of my posts these days are spur-of-the-moment 'bursts', where if possible, I am able to get things off of my chest all in one go. Fortunately, I can type pretty fast and reasonably accurately, and so can rattle off large paragraphs of prose within minutes!

Not being arsed typing is also one of the reasons why instead of replying to PMs, I often ask people to phone me. It's usually much quicker, more effective, and the whole experience is rather more, well, 'human'

Marco.

[Marco]

People change & so do their habbits. Many moons ago when i first got serious about hifi & had so much money i was changing equipment like crazy, there wasnt anything i hadnt had at one point or another, this be the very early 80's. & putting together such a collection of rare LP's i literally had no where to house them. Remember i was still young & all i knew was present time hi-fi components, as i matured i got to reading about vintage Hi-fi,it was different, seemed to have lots more character to what i was presently using.. my love for vintage grew & grew. It got to a stage where actual music too a back seat, from then the music was getting unimportant!

Since my very early intrests in Vintage ive always always had an attraction for the Ferrograph Series Seven Equipment, no other brand apart from the early Castle Acoustics Loudspeakers have had such a prelonged effect on me, a love affair that will no doubt last forever.

You may think i'm crazy but it's taken me six 'F307' amplifiers & nine series seven open reels to get the cosmetic parts together to create the mint items i own today. I could never ever ever part with them.

That clears the hifi bit up & as to why they are so so important to me.

As for music, it's still to this day has less of an intrest to me as my gear does i find myself listerning to lesser & lesser selection of music, what i do listern most of is not the obscure Psych & Prog i so prized within my early collection but the more common garden side (if you like) of the music, hence they are very easy to source.

I'm even considering buying another vintage turntable & sourcing just these records but big collections are no more with me.All other music will be plain old CD on open Reel, I use technology to feed off but dont rely on it as a source. if you get my meaning.

I am a complex mixed up character so bear with me

Excellent insight, dude, into the reasons why you make your decisions. So thanks for sharing. It's always good to know what makes people 'tick'

Marco.