Vantage Audio Technics SL-1210 PCB upgrade & PSU

[worrasf]

Or alternatively, pour a nice glass of wine, sit back and spin some of your favourite tunes, trust your senses and let your ears tell you whether the new PSU makes a genuine improvement or not (my method)

F*ck the 'test disc'.... I'd demonstrate to anyone, in a relevant comparison, how good the Paul Hynes SR5-21 PSU is that I use with my Techy. The stock PSU is but a toy in comparison. The SR5 annihilates it - and trust me, I *know* what I'm talking about.



Same here, but it doesn't hurt to relate your experiences to others in the hope that it may be of use them, such is the purpose of forums like this....

No doubt the Vantage Audio upgrades are excellent - I trust Richard's expertise, even though I've not used one of his products. Sometimes you just have a gut feeling when someone knows what they're doing. I'll go with that before I'll take any notice of what is freakin' 'test disc' tells me.

Marco.

Marco - good job getting this thread back on track - I'd begun to think I accidentally posted my totally subjective aural findings on a HiFi news site given all the brouhahas about test data and the like

Steve

[Marco]

Marco - good job getting this thread back on track - I'd begun to think I accidentally posted my totally subjective aural findings on a HiFi news site given all the brouhahas about test data and the like

Indeed, particularly as this is a staunchly SUBJECTIVIST site, so let's put the white lab coats in the bin where they belong!

Marco.

[Beobloke]

F*ck the 'test disc'.....

With respect, Marco, unless you actually check that the improvement has actually made an improvement, all you can be sure of is that you're listening to a "difference you happen to like" rather than an improvement!

Just to clarify, I have no doubt that all (well, most anyway...) of these improved PSU arrangements do definitely improve the performance of the SL1200, it just never hurts to be completely sure.

[Marco]

Hi Adam,

On forums, I don't make indisputable 'factual' statements; I merely express my subjective opinion, based on the results I hear, and report my experiences to others accordingly for their consideration.

Therefore, I usually find my ears plenty good enough as an arbiter for that, without the need for 'test discs'.

The (superb) system I've assembled over many years is thus so with no 'test disc', or measurement apparatus, having ever graced it. The cumulative sonic signature of the assembled components in my system has been tuned solely by ear - and that state of affairs will remain so.

Do you honestly think that I'd bin using the Paul Hynes PSU for my T/T, when I've heard it clearly and indisputably transform my T/T's performance, during the time I've been using it (and discount all that I've genuinely heard in that respect), just because the results of a 'test disc' perhaps said otherwise?

Marco.

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

With respect, Marco, unless you actually check that the improvement has actually made an improvement, all you can be sure of is that you're listening to a "difference you happen to like" rather than an improvement!

How can a difference you happen to like not be an improvement. To say that is bonkers IMO, as all we are (or should be) looking for *individually* is improvement.

[Marco]

How can a difference you happen to like not be an improvement.

Exactly. If it sounds better, to my ears, then it *is* better, to my ears - simples!

And the same applies in that situation to anyone else with faith in their human senses.

Marco.

[pure sound]

While I'm generally in agreement with this entirely subjective approach, it is handy when something is obviously amiss (such as with those early 1210 needledrops) to be able to look at why there might be a problem. At least in that case the limiting was visible (on the traces) as well as audible. A good job, otherwise there may have been some who continued to assert that they were fine when they clearly weren't.

I think that if the means are there to explain phenomena they should, if possible, be made use of. That said, I'm not yet convinced that there is yet a reliable way of really closely examining speed constancy, dynamic slowing, even rumble/noise at very low levels. Much of the reason for this is in the fact that adequately quiet & accurately pressed test discs don't seem to be readily available. It's therefore difficult to express subjective improvements in these areas in terms of numbers.

With regard to Adam's comment about improvements, there are times when an improvement might be heard but only on some recordings. The SPU I've been experimenting with recently does some very nice things with some recordings but can sound very wrong with others. An improvement or just a change? I like it when its working well but not when it isn't!

[Marco]

Hi Guy,

I've no problem with any of that.

Thing is, I didn't need the waveforms to tell me that the needle-drops I'd done of my Techy were recorded too loudly. I could clearly hear it afterwards when playing them back (it wasn't me who was monitoring the recordings).

The 'objective proof', therefore, merely confirmed what my ears had already told me.

I'm afraid that, whilst what you say is applicable in some circumstances, I don't need a 'test disc' (which can merely test what it's been designed for, no more) to tell me conclusively what a power supply is doing, sonically (or not) to my T/T, in a system that I know inside out

YMMV.

Marco.

[pure sound]

No you would not have done, playing them back on your home system. But there were a few posters here whose subjective opinion was that they were good needledrops. I did find that a bit puzzling.

[Beobloke]

How can a difference you happen to like not be an improvement. To say that is bonkers IMO, as all we are (or should be) looking for *individually* is improvement.

Because in that case, it is an improvement to the sound of your system, and NOT an improvement to the design of the equipment in question - in this case, the SL1200.

That said, it is still perfectly valid in the personal context. The point I raised to Marco was that the suggested improvement to the design of the SL1200 cannot be confirmed without measuring it.