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Thread: Buying direct vs. through a dealer

  1. #11
    Join Date: Oct 2011

    Location: London Town

    Posts: 2,441
    I'm Julian.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    When I was building up my old Naim system, Geoff (at Acoustica, in Chester) used to let me take all sorts of kit home to audition first, before buy buying it, including (at the time) brand new £6.5k Naim CDS/XPS CDPs, NAC52/Supercaps, etc, not to mention my Spendor SP100.
    My mother bought a very modest Naim system from Geoff years ago but was always given the five star treatment. He knew that he was never going to make a fortune from her - she just wanted a simple to use system to sit back and enjoy for her well-earned retirement.

    I remember suggesting a speaker cable upgrade to Naim NACA4 a few years ago. Geoff actually drove over to my mum's house, installed the cable himself and also spent time trying some tweaks to the system. All that for little more than 100 quid ...
    Sonore Rendu - Cambridge Audio Edge W - Sonus Faber Venere 2.5

  2. #12
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Arrow Just in from Mr Dunn....

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    2) Your threatening, over the phone with violence, Chris Frost (an AV equipment dealer), as a result of an eBay dispute with him, involving your published sales. We do not tolerate threats of violence towards other members. I can publish evidence relating to this if necessary. You were thus instantly banned.
    Richard replied:

    Now quite simply this is libel and a lie, he was threatened with the courts not violence, and it did not "cause" a ban so if Danny wants to take the case if he thinks it is worth pursuing he is welcome.
    No lie, so no libel. The details are here on this thread, Richard, so read them for yourself (and your actions did lead to a ban, because I was the one who implemented it): http://theartofsound.net/forum/showp...&postcount=134

    From Chris Frost, on the above thread:

    If you want to try ringing me again for a calm rational discussion then please feel free. I stand by what I've said. But I give you fair warning, be careful threatening people with physical violence over the telephone. You never know if the conversation is being recorded.
    I've spoken with Chris and he tells me that he still has the tape recording, so you can deny it on your forum until the cows come home, but it's your word against his, and I know who I believe... Based on your rudeness and aggression towards people to date, as evidenced on this thread, and historically, I'll let others be the judge and form their own opinions

    And you've got a cheek to talk about me! When the Crossover Network stuff was going on (all old hat now), I was dealing with the trauma of suffering from what would've been a fatal spinal tumour (not to mention having this forum completely deleted by an idiot) - what was your excuse with Chris? Dementia??

    Anyway, you've had your ten minutes of fame now, sweetheart, so that's the last time I'll be publishing here what you've written on your forum. Job done

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  3. #13
    Join Date: Jul 2009

    Location: Hampshire, UK

    Posts: 3,693
    I'm Adam.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    I see one that I fancy on eBay from an on-line retailer (with no shop premises), who doesn't know me from Adam,
    Eh? What? What's going on? How did I get dragged into this?



    Engineers: fixing problems you didn't know you had in ways you don't understand.

  4. #14
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Hi Julian,

    My mother bought a very modest Naim system from Geoff years ago but was always given the five star treatment. He knew that he was never going to make a fortune from her - she just wanted a simple to use system to sit back and enjoy for her well-earned retirement.

    I remember suggesting a speaker cable upgrade to Naim NACA4 a few years ago. Geoff actually drove over to my mum's house, installed the cable himself and also spent time trying some tweaks to the system. All that for little more than 100 quid ...
    Nice to hear. Geoff is a genuine enthusiast, as well as undoubtedly a very shrewd businessman!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  5. #15
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beobloke View Post
    Eh? What? What's going on? How did I get dragged into this?



    It's your fault for having a daft name! I'm just a daftee

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  6. #16
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default Wrong again!

    This started with you insulting my wife by email, no one does that...
    I wasn't insulting your wife, Richard - I was sympathising with her, because the poor woman has had to put up with your ill-tempered argumentativeness for 20-odd years, unless you adopt a complete character change when you're in her company!!

    Therefore, the "insult" was aimed at YOU, not her!

    Furthermore, the comment was made in private, via email (which you chose to publish on your forum), after I'd reached the end of my tether, having been subjected to an endless barrage from you asking me to prove my version of why you were banned from AoS, which I've since done on this thread, and me seeking to avoid a pointless circular argument and us falling out again, which is precisely what has happened now, so well done!

    Quite simply, you don't know when to let an argument lie and simply 'agree to disagree' - that's another one of your many 'issues'. Have you asked yourself why you're always embroiled in conflict with someone, and blaming everyone else for it but yourself?? Think about it!!

    Anyway, that's definitely the last time I'll be engaging you in debate, so can waffle away now on your forum until your heart's content.

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  7. #17
    Join Date: Apr 2008

    Location: Warrington

    Posts: 3,438
    I'm Neil.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    When I was building up my old Naim system, Geoff (at Acoustica, in Chester) used to let me take all sorts of kit home to audition first, before buy buying it, including (at the time) brand new £6.5k Naim CDS/XPS CDPs, NAC52/Supercaps, etc, not to mention my Spendor SP100s.
    Great dealers at Acoustica it's where I got my old Amphion Argon2s from after going into demo some Spendor S3/5 & S3/E speakers, and listening to them get blown away by these strange Finnish speakers that the dealer was enthusing about. I did like how relaxed they were with allowing us to demo equipment & no pushy tactics at all. Pretty sure Geoff is still there...

    As for buying direct I don't see how, for example, NVA's model isn't ideal for people with a 30 days zero quibble returns policy if you don't like it as well as trade-ins against the value of the items should you want to upgrade.

    In short you get poor direct sellers, great direct sellers, poor dealers & great dealers... so not saying much really am I?!
    Mana Acoustics Racks / Bright Star IsoNodes Decoupling >> Allo DigiOne Player >> Pedja Rogic's Audial Model S DAC + Pioneer PL-71 turntable / Vista Audio phono-1 mk II / Denon PCL-5 headshell / Reson Reca >> LFD DLS >> LFD PA2M (SE) >> Royd RR3s.

  8. #18
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: gone

    Posts: 11,510
    I'm gone.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Hi Jerry,

    There'll be no "punch up" on here ... so what's the difference in me creating a similar discussion platform here, albeit temporarily?
    That's fine, I just meant that I didn't want to get caught in the middle.

    I have been enjoying RD's renewed forum, although once again he is subject to Keyboard Rage, which is a shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    You contribute on the AoS section of 'Elsewhere on the Web' on RD's forum (very well and fairly, I would hasten to add)
    Thanks, Marco - I'm glad to see you say that.

    I think that AOS is the best forum around these days, and I am happy to say so!
    .

  9. #19
    Join Date: Oct 2008

    Location: Glasgowshire

    Posts: 10,641
    I'm Gary.

    Default

    Not being funny Marco, but does anyone really want to read a "tit for tat" argument between forums?
    I'd be a bit hacked off it it crept into a thread I'd started.
    Its Mr Dunn's sniping at others about people on other forums that leaves a bad taste in my mouth..would never buy from him because of this, even if his products are great.

    ...its not big and its not clever, and in my opinion AOS shouldn't go down that road.
    Why not post directly over on Richards forum instead?


    Not looking to argue, just saying dude...

    respectfully
    gaz.
    Letting go and relaxing
    is the most ‘in control’ thing you can do

  10. #20
    Join Date: Aug 2010

    Location: Montseny National Park, Catalonia

    Posts: 3,254
    I'm John.

    Default

    Having read all he posts and links on both forums I wondered if this was a members only flame war and if I could interest the participants in some lessons in how to conduct a flame war without making yourselves look more foolish than you already do?

    I moderate a couple of gaming forums largely populated by adolescent males who to be quite frank manage to conduct quite protracted flame wars with considerably more skill, dignity and intelligence than I’ve witnessed in these posts.

    One of the great advantages of such flame wars on gaming forums is that the protagonists have the option of doing battle on an agreed map and game mode where matters of honor can be settled without loss of blood, or the threat of legal action.
    This would of course mean a period of training in the use of the weapons availible and game tactics relevant to each mode and map, but I would be more than happy to provide the necessary instruction for those interested for a small fee.
    Single spur balanced Mains. Self built music server with 3 seperate linear PSU, Intel i5, 16 GB RAM no hard drive (various Linux OS). Benchmark Dac2 HGC, single ended XLR interconnects/Belkin cable. Exposure 21RC Pre, Super 18 Power (recap & modified). Modded World Audio HD83 HP amp. Hand built Monitors with external crossovers , Volt 250 bass & ABR, Scanspeak 13M8621 Mid & Scanspeak D2905/9300 Hi. HD595 & Beyer 880 (600 ohm) cans.

    The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.
    -Bertrand Russel

    John.

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