Shure M3D - yet another truly great classic cartridge

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Originally Posted by NRG

Ah! PX4 now your'e talking Steve...

Crikey, if Steve is a youngster at 51 then I'm still in nappies! :
My experiments where with the WAD KiT88 and the WAD K5881 PSE. The PSE nested feedback loops can be tweaked to alter the response... or I could have messed about with a LP filter on the input...anyhow tweaking it to 12K had a very noticeable effect, not just the loss of upper freq response but also loss of mid range detail...

This is a great web site showing instrument freq ranges, no fundamentals up in the regions we are talking about (maybe pipe organ get close) but there are harmonics that stretch past 12KHz.

http://www.independentrecording.net/...in_display.htm

Glad you like the M3D, my points aren't meant to dismiss it or your enjoyment of it but to just say there's a lot of upper freq information that will be missed if the roll off point is too low....

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thanks neil, thats a good link it equates to my books except on the violin..
which is a difficult one to measure by all accounts.. one books states 15 k and the other which works it out.. based on a good violin thinks 9.8k is about it... for what its worth ?

so on the whole the m3d is not missing much out.. as it does not cut off at 15k .. just drops its output..like our ears

my question about filtering around the 12k mark is that filters are usually.. lets say 12 db or 6 db per octive.. and an octive can extend quite low into the treble... the feed back loop was often used as a tone control on early 'basic' amps and had a shallow slope..
i just wondered if you had used some type of 'brick wall' filter

thanks steve

No brick wall filter Steve, also that 12KHz was the -3db point meaning the response was probably flat up to approx 6Khz rolling of gently past that. I found the effect very noticable....will you bring your setup to Owston?

This would be interesting to try....

http://www.shure.com/stellent/groups...pro_m66_ug.pdf

More Shure info from the 50's...cartridges towards the end...

http://www.coutant.org/shure61/shure61.pdf

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Originally Posted by NRG

No brick wall filter Steve, also that 12KHz was the -3db point meaning the response was probably flat up to approx 6Khz rolling of gently past that. I found the effect very noticable....will you bring your setup to Owston?

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thanks..

yes..

and eggbrough....
i hope it works this time..
last time was a disaster...

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Originally Posted by Will

You can expect a few questions about OB's I've got some Field Coils coming.
Will.

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Which variety? Vintage or Fertin/Supravox?

Interesting the M3N21D owners manual on VE states the response is out to 20K with conciderable 'response' down to 10Hz and up to 30KHz....

Fantastic links there, Neal... Oh what I'd give for an M236 professional tonearm!!! :eek: :wah:

I shall set a goal to find one somehow, somewhere... :eyebrows:

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Interesting the M3N21D owners manual on VE states the response is out to 20K with conciderable 'response' down to 10Hz and up to 30KHz....

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Could you provide a link to the discussion you're referring to on VE?

Marco.

Check this link out, chaps!

http://shure.com/stellent/groups/pub...m3-n21d_ug.pdf

Marco.

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Originally Posted by Marco

Fantastic links there, Neal... Oh what I'd give for an M236 professional tonearm!!! :eek: :wah:

I shall set a goal to find one somehow, somewhere... :eyebrows:



Could you provide a link to the discussion you're referring to on VE?

Marco.

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No doubt about it Marco -

Looks like you will have to fit the N21D stylus to your M3D and play it through the M66 equaliser. When you have done that, you can then track down an M3D-LS (Laboratory Standard) to play in your M236 arm!

Happy hunting!

Barry