Beresford Bushmaster DAC

How about dropping the 1 2 3 4 and placing Optical Coxaxial where the numbers were? Users can refer to Optical left or right / Coxaxial left or right. Further simplification.....

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

Jamtoasts changes with my revisions

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/9647/58066510.jpg

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Like!

And here's my last crack at it:
http://jamtoast.net/bucket/bushmaster2-minimalist.jpg

Now time for me to go to bed.:zzz:

Clive,

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Originally Posted by Clive

How about dropping the 1 2 3 4 and placing Optical Coxaxial where the numbers were?

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I suggested this a few pages earlier in this thread. Stan thinks the numbers are required.

Werner.

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Originally Posted by MartinT

No, I don't agree. Using the same font as in the logo (which is often a customised design in the commercial world) violates the rule that the corporate logo is always sacrosanct. I had lots of marketing training when I was with both NEC and Xerox and both those companies came down on anyone misusing the logo in any manner like a ton of bricks. Horrible instances of the 'X' logo in Xerox being used as the first letter in the distributor's name, or the stylised font in 'NEC' being used for other words.

So I think that the 'Beresford' logo and 'Bushmaster DAC' text are correctly shown by Stan in different fonts.

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I agree. Beresford is a trademark, so should always be treated as a graphic rather than text.

And in silver?

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/8...veroldlogo.jpg

and alternative text (better?)

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/4...ldlogotext.jpg

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/1448/27860314n.jpg

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

And in silver?

http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/8...veroldlogo.jpg

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Really like this, great design best one yet IMO, it's clear, neat and professional. Works really well in both black and silver....silver still gets my vote though, can't wait now whichever it ends up as. I think it's very special to be able to get this kind of preview and input/comment on a products design.

all good ideas Werner.

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Originally Posted by Werner Berghofer

Graham:

• This is not the original Beresford logo. Think about the further consequences: Web site, business letters, business cards, other audio equipment from the same manufacturer …

• Although – with the exception of “Beresford Audio” – only fonts from the Helvetica family are used, I think there are too many font variants.

• The placement scheme used for the descriptive words and their corresponding elements is inconsistent. This creates a lot of unpleasant visual agitation and noise. “Auto” is placed above the red LED, “Optical” and “Coaxial” are placed below the LEDs, the headphone icon is located on the right side of the jack.

• Almost the complete text is centered, but the description “24/192kHz Fully Passive DAC” is aligned flush left. Don’t want to sound picky, but there’s a blank missing between “24/192” and “kHz”. Also I think that this description is dispensable, but I feel under no circumstances should it be placed immediately below the “On/Off” button.

• I still don’t like the use of an uppercase letter as first character in the descriptions. Is this the Holy Bible? Then I don’t understand why “ON/OFF” is set in uppercase letters only, but for the other words mixed case is used.

• I don’t like the appearance of the model name BUSHMASTER. I think similar to the Caiman front plate a semibold italic Helvetica variant (or another semibold, non-serif, maybe slab-serif typeface) in mixed case letters would look better.

• The circular pits around the LEDs, the “Select” button and the headphone jack are different in size and depth. I see the technical reasons for this, but I feel the front plate would look better without these pits.

• I think instead of the black/gold colour scheme (gold on the headphone jack and the edge of the volume knob) a combination of black/metal or black/aluminium would work better. The four blue/green and the one red LED still make me unhappy.

• Don’t like the inconsistent mixture of icons and descriptive text. Either use icons for all, or words for all. Guess an icon-only solution would work better. The “Beresford” logo and the model name would be the only words in this variant.

• Better use a simple dot on the volume knob like on the the TC-7520 and the Caiman DAC.

No offense,

Werner.

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Originally Posted by DaveK

That is very true but its not very nice to say things like that to Lee - he can't help living in Somerset :lol: :ner: .

Sorry Lee, I can only apologise for my rude ex-friend from the uncivilised north of our island ;) .

Dave.

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nice deflection there Dave, see how quick you'd daub someone else in it???? :)

Taking Jamtoast's horizontal line approach, change of position of the headphone graphic....

Think it works better in this position?
The power and source buttons are now "grouped" according to function and stand alone.
Headphone graphic now separate and lines up with source LEDs.
The socket now "framed" either side...adding to a strong horizontal which carries the eye across the front of the Dac from the gold Source button to the headphone socket.
Works better now imo.

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/5877/91849875.jpg
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/3906/silver5b.jpg

The silver looks so much more expensive.....if only the 1 2 3 4 could be dropped, they really are superfluous clutter.

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Originally Posted by DaveK

That is very true but its not very nice to say things like that to Lee - he can't help living in Somerset :lol: :ner: .

Sorry Lee, I can only apologise for my rude ex-friend from the uncivilised north of our island ;) .

Dave.

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Oi! I lives in 'ampshire I tell ya!

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Originally Posted by StanleyB

There seems to be a difference of opinion on a few things. So let's tackle them one by one, with me pointing out the area of interests that I need resolved.

OK, I'll start off with the power, on|off and power symbol, and let's add to that headphone, phone, the headphone symbol. Which one can we agree to as a majority? I suggest using power and headphone. It keeps in line with having only text, instead of mixing text with symbols. It also makes a far clearer statement of what it does or is for. I base my opinion on the years of answering email questions that many would find to be obvious from the beginning.

Next is the logo and the font for the model name. Can I assume that most of you agree that the logo and the model name should be the same? Keep in mind that the font used in the logo should have been the same as on the Caiman. I am not sure that the word Bushmaster would look nice in the logo font. I still prefer using the same font and style that I used in the word Caiman on the Caiman DAC.

Again on the name Bushmaster, and the underlying text: would it be better to just put Bushmaster DAC, and leave out any text underneath that?

I prefer to use optical and coax to indicate what exactly they are for. I have to deal with people who don't even speak English and often don't quite know what something means. And then you have the first time buyers who are taking their first venture into owning a DAC. They too can feel lost with abbreviations and symbols that they are not familiar with.

Then there is the question of the numbers that indicate which input is active. Leaving them out could cause confusion when trying to work out which input is actually connected up and in operation.

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http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/7504/bushmaster2.jpg

In my mind Gaz's mockup looks just about right except the headphone icon would look better underneath the headphone socket IMO.

I also think the Bushmaster looks terrific in silver even though I will be ordering one in black as most of my equipment is black... :cool:

EDIT: This is just about perfick ;)

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/1448/27860314n.jpg

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Originally Posted by synsei

In my mind Gaz's mockup looks just about right except the headphone icon would look better underneath the headphone socket IMO.

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I agree although I woudl prefer to see the headphones logo replaced by the text on the same line as the power/on/off/select buttons

'Power' and 'Phones' text would work just as well Ian although I don't see the need for 'On/Off' anywhere on the facia. If a punter can't get to grips with how a power switch operates they are going to struggle with the rest of it I reckon... :D

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Originally Posted by webby

Oi! I lives in 'ampshire I tell ya!

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Sorry Lee, I had you located in Weston Super Mare :doh: . Have you moved lately or am I just plain wrong?
Dave.

http://img717.imageshack.us/img717/1951/53667645.jpg
http://img444.imageshack.us/img444/4922/silver5c.jpg

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e3...s/silvercm.jpg

http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/1001/70969800.jpghttp://img841.imageshack.us/img841/3900/silver5e.jpg[/URL

That's the ticket Gaz, remembering that Bushmaster will be in the same italic font as Caiman ;)

So many Photoshoppers, so little time...

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Originally Posted by synsei

That's the ticket Gaz, remembering that Bushmaster will be in the same italic font as Caiman ;)

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don't have that font on my system!
anyone any idea what it is?

Looks a bit like Agency FB Bold Italic.

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Originally Posted by DaveK

Sorry Lee, I had you located in Weston Super Mare :doh: . Have you moved lately or am I just plain wrong?
Dave.

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Always been in Southampton, as per my location up there _____________^

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/2833/68533467.jpg
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/7784/silver5fo.jpg

last one for the night :)

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Originally Posted by MartinT

Looks a bit like Agency FB Bold Italic.

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spot on martin, ta.

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

spot on martin, ta.

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Lose the colouring of the LEDs and it looks pretty good....

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Originally Posted by StanleyB

As a small fish in a big pond, it is extremely expensive to make two versions. But I am experimenting with a removable front fascia. I am not sure if anyone else has tried that option in manufacturing of this type of procedure in large sized audio equipment. But it has been a common process with mp3 players and the like for many years. I felt that there is no harm in giving it a go with the Bushmaster.

I am even thinking of making the control software opensource, or at least publish the function of the pins on the microcontroller. So those far smarter than me can come up with some alternative coding and added functionality.

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Ah a removable front fascia! So you could have a camouflage option (very Bushmaster) or perhaps glossy piano black (for me).

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Originally Posted by synsei

'Power' and 'Phones' text would work just as well Ian although I don't see the need for 'On/Off' anywhere on the facia. If a punter can't get to grips with how a power switch operates they are going to struggle with the rest of it I reckon... :D

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I wasn't at my usual desk so could only see I screen and some how had forgotten i could scroll down and see the thread - I couldn't remember what the power button was actually called - totally agree don't need both

It is probably too late for this to be implemented but the perceived problem with the naked LED's could be solved by recessing them behind a dark tinted bezel. This could work particularly well on the black Bushmaster and would have the added advantage of cutting down the glare from the blue LED's.

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/2833/68533467.jpg
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/7784/silver5fo.jpg

last one for the night :)

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That last one is my favourite so far.
Poor ol' Stan,not even for sale yet and everybody has already redesigned it.
Good job he is thick skinned..:lol:

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/2833/68533467.jpg
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/7784/silver5fo.jpg

last one for the night :)

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Personally I think this is almost there - I think the text 24/192hz etc looked better under the Bushmaster Name, not only does it link with the product there but it also keeps the Beresford Logo clean.

If input numbers are needed as Stan indicated these might need to go back on - actually I preferred them in place it seemed to balance the facia for me

Just need some spray on chrome paint for that black knob on the silver version ............

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Originally Posted by alan47

That last one is my favourite so far.
Poor ol' Stan,not even for sale yet and everybody has already redesigned it.
Good job he is thick skinned..:lol:

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I suggest that you rad through the thread again ;). I asked for suggestions with regards to how to improve the front fascia appearance. Unlike those faceless big budget companies who think they know best and let the buyers "take it or leave it", I am more open to input from customers. It's so much fun to know that you had a hand in helping in some way with a product.

Gaz did some work on the text layout of my previous DACs by the way.

I don't mean to upset the applecart, but the bit that says "Fully Passive DAC" is giving me the heeby jeebies, because only the output is passive. The DAC itself can't be, it needs power at the end of the day..

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/2833/68533467.jpg
http://img189.imageshack.us/img189/7784/silver5fo.jpg

last one for the night :)

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Just noticed that the numbers are missing above the LED's (1 - 2 1 - 2)

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Originally Posted by StanleyB

I am even thinking of making the control software opensource, or at least publish the function of the pins on the microcontroller. So those far smarter than me can come up with some alternative coding and added functionality.

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Way beyond my technical skills but sounds ultra interesting, I am sure that some fantastic ideas could come from this

Assuming for a minute that they did and you wanted to incorporate them is there any way the control software could be updated by users in previously sold units - its there a computer access point on the rear or inside the unit or could there be ?

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Originally Posted by Mr.Ian

Assuming for a minute that they did and you wanted to incorporate them is there any way the control software could be updated by users in previously sold units - its there a computer access point on the rear or inside the unit or could there be ?

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The control chip is in a socket. You'll need a PIC burner in order to do a "firmware" update. But maybe one day I'll find a better solution.

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Originally Posted by Reid Malenfant

I don't mean to upset the applecart, but the bit that says "Fully Passive DAC" is giving me the heeby jeebies, because only the output is passive. The DAC itself can't be, it needs power at the end of the day..

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That was just something I stuck in there myself...
Can be anything..or nothing!

This point though I guess its just getting the layout right, before fine tuning by Stan. :)

any vacuum metalizing specialists on here that could advise on turning the power button silver ?

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Originally Posted by synsei

Just noticed that the numbers are missing above the LED's (1 - 2 1 - 2)

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Yeah, just showing my £0.02 worth of different options until Stan can make a final decision on various aspects of the design.

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Originally Posted by Gazjam

Yeah, just showing my £0.02 worth of different options until Stan can make a final decision on various aspects of the design.

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Fair enough ;)

Excellent job Gaz, t'is almost the finished article. I like the change from 'Select' to 'Source' too, somehow it gives an increased sense of gravitas :cool:

EDIT: Perhaps replace the word 'Fully' with 'Semi' re: Mark Reids comments ;)

The final silver version looks great.....APART from that bloody black on/off knob, which stands out like a sore thumb! ;)

The silver version should have a chrome or brushed silver on/off knob, the same as the big (volume control?) on the right. THEN it will be perfecto!

Marco.

My couple words. In old days inputs was CD, Tape, Tuner, so we know what is where connected. Caiman has three types of inputs - usb, optical and coaxial. I usually look for a name of input when selecting, I have different equipment conected to different type of input. If we have only two types and they are two of each, name of input type does not help much. I will need a number or I just remember where what is. We can keep a name of input type for aesthetic reasons if we need, but it will not help to identify particular input.

You don't have to remember where what is. You can put the Bushmaster in the auto mode and it will look for an input that has a valid audio signal available.

i still think you should keep the led's the same colour.

do you need to have '24/192 khz fully passive dac' on it? too much script i'd say......

The LEDs can all be blue. No problem with that.
The extra text is an input from Gaz. Others have made various alternative suggestions, and so have you with yours ;).

1)
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/1408/70661295.jpg
http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/6733/silver6.jpg

Text moved to bottom left corner...
http://img864.imageshack.us/img864/650/82789435.jpg
http://img840.imageshack.us/img840/2897/silver6a.jpg

Text top centre, silver button just for giggles
http://img407.imageshack.us/img407/799/silver6c.jpg

I have to say the silver one looks far more expensive than the black!
As some others have said, what about silver lettering on the black one? I think it would enhance it's appearance.

I too believe that the design is now so much better.

I prefer the silver finish; agree that the Power button ought to be grey/silver too.

Why not : "24/192 Passive DAC" under the (too large?) volume knob?

A pedantic point but "Phones" is an abbreviation of 'Headphones', so should really be < 'phones >.

Looking forward to the reviews - and my own purchase.

BW

Richard

Phones is an abbreviation of Headphones but I've seen it used on masses of equipment without apostrophe's so to use one would verge on pedantism.

I also think it is very important to keep the 24bit/192khz on the fascia because to the best of my knowledge this is the first DAC that Stan has produced that is capable of this resolution.

Digital To Analogue Converter isn't really necessary either, it takes up too much fascia real estate and looks a bit messy. DAC is well understood these days ergo, 24bit/192khz Semi-Passive DAC gives the customer all the info that is necessary ;)

I prefer it on black, but with silver knobs. The gold is quite uglish.