Cheap upgrade for michell gyro

[gwernaffield]

review off simonthepieman off wam


Ok so pete's pylons fitted.

As everyone has said, everything is better, timing key everything is crisper, stop starts are better, image higher, wider, deeper, bass without a doubt deeper and even more control, responsive, tighter.

Overall amazed , the bounce of the suspension has gone of course in fact quite rigid, may settle a little?

If you haven't done this mod do it £185 plus 10 postage so £195 but its a transformation, Vocals more real , on KD lang, Diana Krall, Damian Rice

Cowboy junkies, Daft punk synths amazing, all the usual suspects, pink floyd , Dylan,eagles etc

More captivating and emotional,musical most would say.

Then pure pop as the photo above its tay tay, Tazer, call her what you like shes a genius , taylor Swift latest, superb precision and low notes on some tracks really amazing , with Taylor well up front , recorded & produced using ATC's and in this case, the Kitchen system , Gyro SE with SME iv, Eat jo no.5 Goldnote phono stage, Auralic G2,with quality non digital analog input, then balanced out to Active ATC 40's

Records never sounded this good on Kitchen system, possible records are getting close to the serious record player SME Model15

Love this upgrade, very highly endorsed, don't falter, just do it !

simon

[mad-moon]

:popcorn:

[gwernaffield]

Stuarts review which he sent me ,,

Well, following the implementation of Peters upgrades inclusive of the new suspension pylons, here is my sixpence worth.

As you may have previously read, it has been a very enjoyable & educational few weeks as I stumbled across this thread almost by accident & full credit & thanks to Pete for his time & vision in raising (what I thought was an excellent product) to a whole new level.

I won’t dissect the Michell Gyro / Orbe & highlight their historic manufacturing errors of which we all know now (it sure was an education for me).

All I can do is share my experiences & if I go over old ground, please forgive & skip.

The motor housing upgrade for me was a revelation; I upgraded to the DC with HR PS & was never happy with the motor noise (after all we are not talking small change).

Since installing the cistern seal, I have silence which extended to the platter & given a more clear but calm reproduction – defies logic to me how it works, but it does.

I changed the bolts in the arm plate from steel to nylon, I also changed the bolts which secure the arm to the arm board from steel to nylon (if you do this, do not forget to earth).

Again to a lesser extent the noise floor has gone down & relaxed the presentation.

The 3 Bearings to the suspension towers changed to Delrin with sorbothane pads.

Main bearing changed from steel to Zirconia Oxide ceramic.

Bearing oil changed to Audio Origami ptfe version.

Following the above changes (& very little money expended) things were beginning to be positively noticeable & very quickly.

Audio image more focused, separation of instruments, more information – I thought “this guy is on to something here”.

I left things to settle in for a few days before I ordered the Pylons....it was supposed to be a couple of weeks but I could not hang on.

Following the order & speedy delivery I installed the pylons & left to settle for a day.

Well I was in for a pleasant surprise, there was MORE of everything.

More air & space around the instruments, bass control, a nice mid range but how much information was I missing (& I thought I had most of it). Acoustic instruments, especially Violin, Cello & Guitar wood resonance can be heard, almost tangible.

The amount of information came straight out from the background, scary stuff on some compositions (I will list another time).

Female vocals were a joy to listen to whomever the artist.

All I can say this upgrade is a no brainer – I have previously implemented all of the Michell upgrades one by one, but none have made this much of an improvement.

I will round off by saying thank you to Peter for all of his hard work which has certainly paid off to us the Gyro / Orbe owners.



PS: anyone know where I can get a “quality “ replacement drive belt.........................

[gwernaffield]

Analogue Seduction for authentic Michell drive belts

[gwernaffield]

Hi All with regards to the belt , i had a gentleman who had fitted the pylons and is very happy with them but he uses a Tachometer , and is not happy if the speed in not virtually 33.3 , he sent this email with regards to the belt he is using, i have sent him a new belt ,but i don't think he will need it ,

I think I have got the speed down perfect now, can't believe all it took was cleaning of the sides of the platter were the belt drives it. So simple! A little dust or oil is enough to cause fairly major speed fluctuations, cleaning the platter is a tweak I recommend for all belt driven turntable owners. And you never hear anyone mentioning it. They obviously don't have tachometers attached to their platters. Once my speed stabilizes after a minute or two after turning on the motor, I am now +/- 4/1000th for a entire record side. That's pretty damn good for a $5K record player.

i would always do the above now , after all it is easy to get oil off your fingers onto the belt,

pete

[gwernaffield]

the platter was cleaned with isopropyl alcohol with a Q Tip , , but he also used it on the belt , i would not do that my self , i would just wash it with soap and warm water , use a microfiber cloth to dry it ,handle the belt with a pair of rubber gloves to stop any grease off you fingers getting onto the newly cleaned surface, alcohol causes the rubber to crack ,

[gwernaffield]

so after a couple of weeks i will have a new pulley , 2x33.3 and 1x45 , i got fed up of having to remove the double pulley and fitting the old pulley ,to play half speed lps, ,

https://tsbw9g.db.files.1drv.com/y4m_mGA9RYnLM3_uLIrRyCS9xmS8v1nIDWrjaaL4ifp0ic8Osu qHH6gn_7PY1HhOZqcgilsTXYISyNIm0L4thFDR-Krd3sSDJ-7xw3wIBhSrWvPfx5RflPh4iDoOPESfoJyXLGP9Md72h2dtBeLe UDBJVhr3cH2HPXM6MUFDagvhSU-5QOC-zckB4_4uPs6sS78o05r-8CwKfgleigJmhwtDQ?width=660&height=498&cropmode=none

https://tcbw9g.db.files.1drv.com/y4mMxyJRC-2LTdsE2HNoer59hEHlO1LsXcCN-4chbW0GodPVS88vVtqc2VoV1IhVVJyDEwz_wmSMz8tig7LkPe_ tOiWYiyuHBhHSNQI_XBsZUuUqeFucjjAaAfzbwf9CWeH_MTSjq xLfwxh3PjajHsia5aAM6X7nrC36hLeL3OpQ2AOI42xfGHHF0Lr B7gytjnHNNqfkCqdiuKlCDH3ssUiSQ?width=621&height=466&cropmode=none

[gwernaffield]

HI All just an update on a few things that have been tried and not used,since this thread started ,and some things that are in use , and some future upgrades,

i tried to make a PTFE ball plate that went on top of the bearing , this was working great , but i could never manage to get the correct size for the bearing and the hole in the correct position , this idea was scrapped, and should not be tried, the ptfe can move off the top of the shaft and jam the bearing ,

the delrin and ptfe bearings are no longer used, instead a ceramic bearing is used, the delrin balls were fine , the torlon micro cracked, the ptfe bearing just worn away ,
the spacer on top of the bearing was scrapped as it would cause the platter to wobble if not positioned properly on the top of the outer part of the bearing ,

things that have been used and are still in use,
i have used extralub zx1, Warning ⚠ only use this if you can adjust the speed on the power supply , because it will speed the platter ,
3 ceramic bearings to be placed in the suspension adjuster replacing the steel ball bearings,
1 ceramic bearing for the main bearing
Pete's pylons, which are used every day ,
a new tripple Pulley , which has just been made,
Made to order Arm Boards, and made to order solid Acrylic platter,
A New Modification for the power supplies, which is on trial , to replace the speed adjuster with one that is more accessible and user friendly , more news about that when it is back at home, pictures will be posted , and no i am not Mr True-point , the owner of the company is Mr Charlie Melling , he has been upgrading and making parts for audio for a long time, his company has been the best place to get the work done to a high standard , they were the only company i could find that would machine a set of pylons one set at a time, with the bases totally bespoke to sizes sent by the user ,
i do not work for them , but they put up with all my ideas , they will make most of them,,, charge me accordingly,
don't expect them to rush , they are busy with orders all the time, Jonathan Melling ( charlies son ) is the guy for cnc and his dad does everything else ,

ATB
pete

[gwernaffield]

so True point are making a new power supply , controller for the gyro , it will change the speed with the push of the button, and not need to use the double pulley , i think it will even have a 78rpm but not quite sure if that is needed, , i have seen the trial , but as yet not had hold of it ,,
it is the same one they do for the pink triangle ,hopefully this will be here next week , along with some pulleys,

[gwernaffield]

This is what i have been helping with ,you do not need to change the motor , it is a bit cheaper than the HR , price is from Charlie in True point ,seeing the gyro at 78 is quite a sight ,
https://gez49q.db.files.1drv.com/y4mhZdNYf1hdWMlPLfWz4giREnjnP0Szel6P5xz9xoWraRnuQH T5yPlw-DGJgNWVyhsn37-iJ5mNdu6bRbm0dvPl0J6nYFFoOIo40uulk36MehrARjvu5o3N6 mbsfmNsJ7DqNkVY4inR737o043QnpNGIAEYP0GEfpD4cSKv6Ea sA6b2tMLSBNNsL4_GKSFCLQBKXcHJZYj4EhQjwbeiXjfYg?wid th=1958&height=1352&cropmode=none
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https://dkz49q.db.files.1drv.com/y4mkDM3BnlL8VuuDyKcFcA-v65zWH90EnTP0kSKGT5oSyQzC_o7kA2UM2KMNOgwJuKREephpz gQidLhwwa6m1uuIx05MdQldvQc3TZrREKIG9gQcsmUu-icm4S8bVjL487LLy7H363NtGWIwSFHLsS8d0w69UxEm4fZbHuH h_EPeQuIwy9U3WdtHdHBrw-_IK9_FDK3VqumzszhhcJz3SROyg?width=1000&height=630&cropmode=none
https://d0z49q.db.files.1drv.com/y4m3_8loF8DeoL9bunEInfMw0VHRHShTUaUlJvwbIuWbsUo4U-dMw2hdOwPq3cglQxuiUYFKeFAGBU_8z0JuwGgIKc4eLcXOdnP0 3Ky0IRsGu7SU_rhyY60yUntzBYrTqJP1FJxl25YHRmmGj6Vblc hu_WuOZBARKU70WjwfS5mTJqqpivUR2sOu_Kb-PHH4ff7ujH3bVswAt-O8KBxoLClfA?width=1048&height=786&cropmode=none
https://fkytag.db.files.1drv.com/y4mIlJbBCsSlXcUqFAJ2F-9RoHbDp1boZv6M-MEB958hbAuBJIydI6EzTEW8zBy7uB00Y7aaX8WOdy44TRsbif1 lJOSuDtnAKQpPsdJgQIIfBGYKt8PSzSWDeq67Fjm-ChWGX0GWlbpoCbNDEAbh4IUq1hOJT1iwGWLpl9K79UKS1PTOAJ 5eme0acCesn8VV7c3dXpbCqlPK7eX5aQxiCW7FA?width=1920&height=1350&cropmode=none
https://g0z49q.db.files.1drv.com/y4mGoL7Cq_hGWZTsEIFCF1nNbbZaTN2ZhkcxAZHqKF-X5KBAf3YGqG5ZsKSxdFzhMngbspgSQP_GfdNpXwo7Q-5bxYxb3QbP-KXCHKkurlNCZePnEJUd3N_CUULHnK_N7VF5A7Ef3_jQoTAqWww j21gKFPrX5j7Y4c7k2fmfafK4r_2jqKZvHiyOHq1pLbClB_9Lx-30JVXmxMEcF7A_l_oiw?width=1000&height=750&cropmode=none

pete

[gwernaffield]

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[Made in 1968]

That a Transcriptors sweep are Peter?

[gwernaffield]

No Mate it is a transrotor imported from germany , placed in top of a piece of scaffold pipe, which has been anodized and plugged up , same brush hair as the Transcriptions i think,

pete

[Made in 1968]

Sorry mate mean to say Transrotor. . The Michell & Transcriptors sweep arms were just Anodised Aluminium..

[Made in 1968]

Always wanted a Transotor 'Golden Shadow'

[gwernaffield]

yes i want a 'fat bob ' tt, but that means money i have not got , the transrotor brush was nearly £100 imported , it is chromed brass, with an earth wire attached some times it works to get rid of static and some times it dont , Transrotor used to do Michell TT until they fell out , now you hardly ever see a transrotor TT for sale in the uk , or a michell in germany ,

[Made in 1968]

Aye. The Michell 'Synco' over in Germany seems a lot chunky looking than ours.. Real nice tho the Transrotor decks.. Lotta money goes into the finish tho i guess.

[gwernaffield]

no they fell out the guy who owns transrotor was the apprentice in michell but went back to germany so i was told by Werner , an started to sell michell decks and the made his own ones, i dont no why they fell out but to this day as far as i am told you have problems buying a michell deck in germany and a transrotor in the uk , although i have seen some for sale in the UK , there is a video of transrotor on you tube , they use maglev bearings , alot , the weight is in the platters transrotor uses ,every one is double checked for bearing noise according to the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L38cZ0Bj-Ys

[gwernaffield]

second version of the new power supply controller so now you have a choice
https://geytag.db.files.1drv.com/y4mdbw5u5SxBFSqSUsvku9yDyYgAvJtCbFjVgWB7Xv1BbGTEQ6 AFMn_4icHMpN_Cj7QkDnAlE25SCtUuJASYQR1AtmG9_j163j3T YoXRr0mnnaUJu81oqKUWoPr5r8y3FLU0tBw1-vDU1fxBN2Ofve10SVcMxRXHyrEpoFpzRiOFhEl4QmY8jVQzFHl gdGDI0SFOoFs95RvVZDoa3oDTRJYbg?width=823&height=552&cropmode=none

[gwernaffield]

today i installed a new dc motor a better version to the michell ,, it fits straight into the rubber sock , has twice the amount of torque than the original motor ,, can be run on the new TPA ,, but not with the HR that is set to only use the lower version ,, it was easy to install and with the use of a soldering iron , and a couple of spoons to hold the rubber sock back to get the old motor out ,, easy to do and worth it ,, so now the speed does not miss a beat ,

pete

[gwernaffield]

i was asked the size of the -o-ring used,, O ring size for the pylons is 29.8 x 2.68 or 30x 3 ,, will do in epdm , the 29.8 is imperial ,, with a 2.68 cross section , all now EPDM ,

pete

[gwernaffield]

the new motor is quiet , with no vibration into any part of the deck , The problem was i have had to get the power supply upgraded as well , due to the now 7 watt dc motor being used, the draw is more then the HR would handle,, i could not trim the speed down on the HR , but Could on the TPA, i just do not under stand why the HR would not run the motor as they are both the same voltage but a higher watt and more torque on the 7watt , can some one explain why ? i did talk to some one about the HR but he said i may have trouble with getting the correct speed, or worst of all the thermal fuse may pop,, the fuse was fine but the speed was 8 rpm too fast ,, has any one got an explanation to why this is the case,

pete

[AJSki2fly]

the new motor is quiet , with no vibration into any part of the deck , The problem was i have had to get the power supply upgraded as well , due to the now 7 watt dc motor being used, the draw is more then the HR would handle,, i could not trim the speed down on the HR , but Could on the TPA, i just do not under stand why the HR would not run the motor as they are both the same voltage but a higher watt and more torque on the 7watt , can some one explain why ? i did talk to some one about the HR but he said i may have trouble with getting the correct speed, or worst of all the thermal fuse may pop,, the fuse was fine but the speed was 8 rpm too fast ,, has any one got an explanation to why this is the case,

pete

Well I cannot explain myself but this might help if you focus on the Design#2: PWM DC Motor Control with IC 555 section https://www.homemade-circuits.com/dc-motor-speed-controller-circuits/ from my understanding the issue with trying to use the HR controller is that pot just may not be sufficiently lowering the Voltage enough to slow down a more efficient 7W motor.

[gwernaffield]

one of the differences in the TPA was a better pot inside the box, you adjust that and set the speed on 45,, you can then use fine adjust the speed with the buttons on the front to set all 3 speeds,, ,, the HR only as a small adjustable pot on the rear their is no other adjustment available,,

[gwernaffield]

The New power supply will work directly with the gyro ,with the ability of changing speed , and not have to move the belt , speed seems more stable, i have been asked for graphs to prove this i cannot as all i have is my ears, but i have just borrowed a wow and flutter meter to check the speed against the speed set by the laser meter and also allow me to see what the wow and flutter has become with all the changes, now to learn how to use the wow and flutter meter that is out of the arc ,

[gninnam]

Well, you have plenty of time to work out how to use - or should I say we have plenty of time.....
Be interesting for the Gyro peeps to see how the PSU works out - fingers crossed it does the job!

[gwernaffield]

yes i know ,boredom is setting in being stuck in all day ,and now this to play with , should be fun
https://d0ytag.db.files.1drv.com/y4mwA6Mqa8VQJMJd8x7_WB_WwhEJPieeFIOPyxleG5_vZXklc_ nFIuYB88u-V6Ri1s6W8Ia1-Dh9_JNaoOrXUyorP-tdjJwF_JALPl27afGWefVroRaM9GIIrLGhzdBp_53UuBDd9wVg-8L_8DrUSfEt-UmYf2O8cIfJ6h8JCd1rD6FUz3ns7SV-BMdeWhVdRXYcSEXP1-KLQ6SXFsIaMFZyg?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none

[Gazjam]

Peter,
no longer a Gyro enjoyer, but just want to say thank you for the (genuine) service your doing for others.

You sent me some Ceramic ball bearings to try with my own deck a while back, improved my listening experience so thank you for going to the trouble for that.
Keep doing the good work Sir.

People appreciate it.




yes i know ,boredom is setting in being stuck in all day ,and now this to play with , should be fun
https://d0ytag.db.files.1drv.com/y4mwA6Mqa8VQJMJd8x7_WB_WwhEJPieeFIOPyxleG5_vZXklc_ nFIuYB88u-V6Ri1s6W8Ia1-Dh9_JNaoOrXUyorP-tdjJwF_JALPl27afGWefVroRaM9GIIrLGhzdBp_53UuBDd9wVg-8L_8DrUSfEt-UmYf2O8cIfJ6h8JCd1rD6FUz3ns7SV-BMdeWhVdRXYcSEXP1-KLQ6SXFsIaMFZyg?width=768&height=1024&cropmode=none

[gwernaffield]

Hi Gaz thanks,for the kind words,,
i am just waiting on scott nagle to send the test lp ,i can then get stared , i wanted to see what if any the difference in the change of drive motor has done to the gyro , taking it from a 3 watt to a 7 watt motor , also the power supply , the motor can be bought only if you are in the Trade, in the uk but in the USA that are $99 or $96 direct from the manufacturers,
all of the changes to the gyro have been done to save money and to get the very best out off the gyro and surprisingly the orbe,
my disappointment was i had to give up the pylons to TPA, so i was not getting accused of fiddling ,, any thing or any body , TPA has been around for years, but in another name, Turepoint precision engineering , i think truepoint audio started a few years ago
they are 35 miles from me,they have been doing parts for audio for the pink triangle TT, repairing most hifi stuff or know of some one who will help , they also had an upgrade to the pink triangle a new dc motor and power supply , the power supply works on the gyro , with 3 speed settings, no need to change the motor , it will work with the std Michell DC Motor , it is also rock steady , and will not cost as much as the HR , but all prices are through True Point ,, and not me,
the meter was borrowed from TruePoint audio, because the new motor i had fitted they made the pulley ,i want to check the wow and flutter , if it is higher than the stated by Michell, i would like to find out how to stop it, with all the talk that the belt is to blame, which i think it may be another part , more to follow at a later date,

all the very best keep safe and weep well to all AOS Members
pete

[Gazjam]

Sounds great Peter.

One thing I’d maybe mention...

Be strong in protecting your own intellectual property.
It absolutely looks like your taking the Gyro to a different level, so you really have something here.
Secure it when you can, many instances in the hifi game of “No good deed going unpunished”.
Company’s jumping on someone else’s good ideas and ripping them off for profit.

If you haven’t already mate, I’d take legal advice on this.

Just sayin’.

[gwernaffield]

gaz
the pylons have been registered in my name through the government IP SCHEME ,nothing was registered for the IP and took ages to get through , the power supply is a known power supply , so there is no problems, i just passed the pylons onto truepoint , it was never my intention to take the gyro to another level , it has just happened, however TPA always state the parts are made by them and not by Michell,, i do ask advice from Michell , you will notice their are no feet or any other parts that Michell supply , accept an already made power supply which drives the same make motor in the upgrade for the pink triangle , everything i have done Michell know about , down to my platter made of acrylic ,

i suppose if TPA supplied the exact same platter that Michell make they would be taken to court , and i would stand by Michell for doing that,,, as the pylons have been sent to Michell on several occasions , which they always will not acknowledge , and no way they would use them,,, because they are registered in my name for the IP , they are not like any other on the market , as proven by the IP Certificate issued , The PSU it is down to TPA , to do their own ip on that ,
The challenge is to better the way the pylons work , that is the only way to make the deck better , than i can , if you remember it all started a while ago , with hooks being used and small o'rings, then the slots , is there other ways of doing the pylons /suspension ?, yes their are,,
also i would not supply at the time 3d printed versions,when i had some 3d printed all failed on either the base or the nut , hence the need to get them made by an engineering company , TPPE ,, who have continued to make them to this day , with my blessing, and it would be upto TPPE and TPA to defend the pylons, they make and supply them not me ,

all the best
stay safe

pete
p.s
True point precision engineers , and true point audio just make and sell and supply parts to everyone who needs them too, i don't work for them .

[Gazjam]

All sounds like it’s in hand, good stuff.

[gwernaffield]

cheers gaz
,i am still making things in the shed ,need something to do whilst Scott Nagle sends the test lp, which may be next week or the week after according to the reviews about him , as he was the cheapest person to buy the AP ultimate test album off , i don't mind the wait , although it has stopped the wow and flutter testing of the deck until it arrives,
all the best and keep safe to all
pete

[Gazjam]

I know Scott personally, stays close to me.

Have bought A lot of vinyl from him, but always from taking the 20 minute drive to his premises.
He has online baggage Going back many years over many forums, what I can say is that I’m confident he is not out to rip anyone off.
Running a business though you need to be 100% down the middle, personal issues aside.
If you choose to put yourself in that bracket...then live by it.

In this world of Amazon Prime next day delivery it’s a hard sell, and Scott doesn’t always help himself (but as I say it’s never deliberate on his part) and he has a genuine passion about the hobby and music.

The LP will come, from experience if there’s any delay it’s that “In stock” on his Site means he needs to order it.
Which is fine as I’m sure he’s communicating with you every step of the way...or maybe not depending.

[gwernaffield]

HI Gaz , i would not of ordered it if i was in a rush , he has now put out of stock on the item and tells me he is waiting on 12 to arrive, the way covid19 has slowed all the post down to a crawl,,if they are arriving from the manufacturers they may take a long time, but not worried, i don't believe in all the things i have read on the forums, so now back to the little bit of tweaking i am doing on the gyro , which if works will help with the springs as well,,
pete

[gwernaffield]

so the test lp arrived now to try it out , and find out how to read it the instructions are not that good, depending on which button you press , the scale is from .03 to 3 % on the buttons, so if i put it on 3% it hardly moves , on 1% it will only move to .017
not sure if that is correct, does any one no how to use this ,?
pete

[gwernaffield]

to all gyro users please make sure the belt is level to the grove in the pulley , it has a big effect on the wow and flutter and sound of the deck , it is very hard to achieve this , you can level the spider then the chassis , than the platter you may find you have to lift the motor pod up with some packing , it was not a problem on the first gyros , due to the fixed motor which was on the chassis , now the motor is n a pod you has to be level ,
pete

[gwernaffield]

Hi All when fitting the pylons please remove the felt washer , the o rings hang down beneath the pylon base, it means the clearance is only half a mm between the felt washer and the o'rings ,this will stop any movement in the pylons, when the deck is leveled
due to the differences in the levels obtained, fit the pylons level the chassis , making sure their is clearance , fit the platter and check that is level ,i have had a couple where the chassis is not level to the platter , according to the owners, this is an engineering problem where the thread in the chassis is not true to the bearing shaft , so the platter is not level , there is noting i can do about that , except to level the platter only,
please remove the center rubber bands when fitted , they are there to stop you playing o ring pickup ,
keep safe and well

pete

[gwernaffield]

does any one know the diameter of the Michell belt , ??

[AJSki2fly]

Can you not measure it with a micrometer?[emoji4]

[gwernaffield]

no it is too big i should of put inner diameter , cross section is about 1.5mm

[AJSki2fly]

no it is too big i should of put inner diameter , cross section is about 1.5mm

Oh I get you now:doh:

[gwernaffield]

so i had the truepoint power supply upgraded this was because i had put a 7watt 24volt core-less motor in the pod, i asked charlie to change the button lay out also the color of the front , which he has done,, the button led lights have been made dimmer ,
although the first power supply would drive the motor the new one has been made just for the 7 watt version ,

https://e9e13g.db.files.1drv.com/y4mLwCc7FyThG80hTmofC7h8fCA0C3I2ayCiy7_Eb8uN8SOei8 1tMuW87hz_k6Zu-IQdEbB_NgyDqUvLcnY6b9pcUN8vez1I7LNqsi02ap7eQH-C8TEPTZZCQQcdqKdqJ2-00aq_U-AlvcFkzb5qhCpqXvkvQIhrGApwa62e9qZm2Op7n_gPxAgGwPir XPeNZWxNAVdsl_jNe6hLBLDKyrCUg?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none

[Transparent67]

Looking good Pete!
Hope its sounding sweet.

[gwernaffield]

it seems better than the HR , i dont have to disturb the belt to change the speed, and the 78rpm will snap your fingers if caught in the platter weighs, although i have no 78lps, sounds really good ,

[gwernaffield]

so i have just had an email off truepoint with regards to the PSU , here is a copy which i agree with

Hi Charles,

I promised you a short review of the True Point Audio PSU for my Michell Gyrodeck SE so here it is.

"I recently purchased a True Point Audio PSU for my Michell Gyrodec SE which I did after a little research to see what was available as an alternative to the Michell HR Power supply. I wanted to upgrade as the power supply that comes with the Gyro is quite basic and I found it to be not so stable as I had to quite regularly adjust the turntable speed and to do this you have to unscrew the PSU to adjust a small screw which controls the speed. The reviews of the Michell HR PSU were all mainly very good but I read that once again there was a little adjustment to be done on the speed which meant accessing a small speed control screw at the back of the PSU which is better than having to take it apart as you have to do with the supplied PSU. Given some thought to this I decided to look around for alternative solutions which is where I came across the True Point Audio PSU for the Michell Gyrodec. Truepoint make some mighty fine upgrades for both Pink Triangle and Michell TT’s and their PSU’s where plug and play with the fabulous advantage of being able to adjust the TT speed from 33.3 to 45rpm or 78rpm at the push of a button with no fiddling about with the TT belt.

Having spoken to Charles at True Point Audio I took the plunge and ordered the Truepoint Audio PSU, which was quickly delivered and you also get to choose which colour lights you would like on the PSU. The PSU was a simple swap for the original one and the belt on the TT is set on the 45rpm position on the motor pulley and that’s it you do not have to touch the pully again as the PSU will now do every thing for you. Press the 33.3 button and away you go the RPM is rock steady and after a few weeks the PSU and my Gyrodec sound absolutely superb no hint of wow or flutter from the turntable, the sound has tight deep base and great overall clarity and detail to the sound, I could not be more happier. This really is a great product and a great improvement for the Gyrodec, which I would highly recommend as an alternative to the Michell HR PSU, with the key advantage of being able to adjust TT speed at the press of a button and I can now also now play 78’s on my Gyrodec SE if I have a mind to. The True Point Audio provide a great product, great service from Charles and I would highly recommend this upgrade to anyone."


Please use as you see fit Charles, I hope that you are well.

Kind Regards

Kevin

[Mr.Ian]

Thsi thread is a long read but its well worth persevering as even some of the simplist of things mentioned make a noticable improvement. and they are all easily removed for orginality.

A big thank you to Peter for taking the time and trouble to post on his research and his helpful guidance on what works best and where to source.

[gwernaffield]

Thank you Ian , for the kind comments, i am not sure the thread will stay , i just cannot afford to keep up payments, i am not a dealer and never have been , how ever i have paid to keep the thread going which i have now ended, although i will always voluntary subscribe to AOS,
enjoy the small upgrades you have done, and you know they can always be removed, as you own a mk1 gyro ,a very good mk1 is hard to find, and you wanted to stay with the originality of the deck , we just upgraded the bearings ,changed the solid adjusters to split , leaving room for you to decide if you want to change to Pete's pylons at a later date or not ,, the new type bearing may need you to change the platter as well, if you want to stay with originality i would not change due to the cost £380 platter , £155 bearing ,, all the best
pete

[Mr.Ian]

Hi Pete, the deck has a serial number in the low 4000, so it must be pretty early but has the later inverted bearing. The great thing about your mods, is they work well. Are cheap, fully reversible and easily fitted

I never realised you were classed as a dealer, you certainly didnt make any money out of me, but, and have to pay for this thread, it will be a loss to others if it dissappears.

[gwernaffield]

Hi Ian there was an argument a while back and in order to protect this thread i had agreed to pay a fee, to stop it being removed, the fact it was helping owners did not mean a lot,just to get some one shouting you are a dealer ,
Marco has been great ,and i paid the yearly fee,
how ever i just cannot keep paying for this, i never have made money out of this thread and never will do , it was never intended for that , i was sick of being asked to pay £10 for a ball bearing , and also did not want to see the deck lagging behind the newer turntables,the turntable was starting to do that ,

so i just put my experiments on here ,with the help off other members the pylons were made, that is when i was accused of being a dealer , which is far from the truth , anyhow that is last year and a new year has started, so now i can help owners were needed,
Mr Ian enjoy the deck , you still can go further at a later date, that is entirely up to you , all the best pete

[gwernaffield]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZYQBJuTXhQ&feature=youtu.be

above is a link to my TT ,job done pete

[gninnam]

Respect Pete, looking and sounding v.nice :)

[gwernaffield]

just have to get the platter back , the extension on the music is beyond what i thought was possible , as it was only recorded on a phone, it sounds very good , i may change the spiders to some that are 20mm thick ,which are being made, how ever it sounds fantastic , even with the wrong armboard , i messed the wood top one up , trying to fit the rubber isolating dampers , i made the holes too deep , so that is out for a rework ,

pete

[Gazjam]

Even over "compromised" Media, can tell that sound has more 'truth" that what I heard with my Michell turntable.

Good work Pete, your work is making a huge difference!
SPEAK TO MICHELL, YOUR IMPROVING JOHN'S DESIGN. :eek:

[gwernaffield]

Hi Gaz , Michell don't want to know, it is their design and they are sticking with it ,,it is up-to Michell if they want to change anything and no any outside help is needed,, i have sent them stuff which they will never acknowledge,, i understand , they have now started to go down the selling of upgrades, including a impedance matched platter, but i was always told the platter was the nearest to vinyl they could make, so why the impedance one?

i found an old Review on the first gyro , the one with the motor screwed to the chassis , it was a very good review,the change in removing the motor to a stand alone one may be the problem with the Belts and not the belt it self , before the motor was fixed to the chassis and the belt had a solid fixed point of contact , with the Pod version you can be 4mm out of center of the hole , stretch the belt or not enough tension , so every one blames the belt , what i did was to use some sorbothane pieces place them between the motor pot and the hole in the chassis , 3 pieces , when the pod is central,simply remove them the pod should be central and the belt have the correct tension , now the belt is correct and the wow and flutter is way down on std ,
all the best
pete

[gwernaffield]

https://fde13g.db.files.1drv.com/y4m2dDJS46ofr2oGgGXeo7NyqqkP4_T2v85QX1HUBOZpFyofYJ BGtE-VcAOBWW1ZEpyxY7WgrqQHgoF2j0z3ee9-9mbBDtCHIGFr5vmJmZlYsqo-gFQJbX2vkm-J75yqU8k1l_U-eIhiv1yRmnjMwZch1Ln4KZhB5wnxhJ02ON5JXeU4M5dJ63qlFO dvyCCHvEaCu4CzlCYRHFYBNWG1coNQA?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none

i did not get the weights put into the platter, as the CNC Mill is still broken down , i did call in to true point to pick this up along with one for MR Moon , and 2 others that are for test only, they would be considered grade be ,i had bought some 50 acrylic off ebay and apparently it arrived with small holes in the faces, they cannot be sold,the small 3mm x.5mm deep holes have been filled in,,, how ever they will only be used to set up the cnc mill , when i know it is working , in the mean time, i had 2 that were fine,
one has been sent to Mr Moon for him to try ,
pete

[gninnam]

Love the look of the platter - hope it makes a difference to the replay of the music to justify all the hard work and expense :)

[gwernaffield]

i will send you one to try , i have a couple of grade B ones, which have marks, in them,i will send one to you soon , pete

[gninnam]

Cheers Pete

[mad-moon]

Managed to snag me an acrylic platter..I was shocked by the physical weight of the thing when it arrived in the post...what a lump..I thought it was my birthday. I eagerly opened the box and behold a thing of beauty.
I wasted no time at all and set my turntable away, after I'd warmed up my gear. I listened to three Lp's with the original platter and no surprise they sounded great, my deck has already had extensive upgrades, and to my ears, this was going to take something special to better the sound..

I stripped the original platter off and put on the new platter, which took very little time, first let me say the platter is beautifully machined and is an exceptionally nice snug fit. I put the anniversary mat on and tried the first LP..Queen II.. Immediately on first impression, the Stereo immage is brilliant and the soundstage is astounding. The bass being reproduced is snapping into place, the music is fast, very musical and tuneful..It was before with the original platter, but this lump is bringing more out of the vinyl..I had to keep playing parts of tracks over and over again, as I was hearing stuff not heard before...a guitar here a drum beat/cymbal there ..this is probably because the image is placing the instruments far better..Dire Straits is superb as is Aha..The Aha LP is the fastest I've heard the music in my system..It's a very busy album too as they do a lot of mixing/tracking on there Lp's..all in all a much nicer listening experience altogether..i confess, I love the look of the original platter with those lovely brass weights hanging down, which are mesmerising, when you watch them, but I love the sound of this platter..which is one solid piece of acrylic,with just enough room to fit over the bearing housing..I've also been able to remove some of the isolation from under the deck, as it was overkill, the platter has superb damping.. I'm a happy bunny and pleased I was able to get my hands on this marvelous piece of acrylic...I can recommend this with no fear...contact Truepoint Audio for more details...I'm glad I did...

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50116353577_44b2c8eda8_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50116131776_dd46c49b01_b.jpg

[AJSki2fly]

Hi Alan, have you tried one of these? ISOLATE IT SORBOTHANE HI-FI AUDIOPHILE GRADE 3 mm TURNTABLE MAT, they are supposed to be very good, it will give you direct contact with the vinyl, use a good record weight with it to ensure good contact, you should find even more bass control. :)

[gninnam]

Looks great and glad you can hear the benefits. Looking forward to hearing how it works on the Orbe :)

[User211]

Managed to snag me an acrylic platter..I was shocked by the physical weight of the thing when it arrived in the post...what a lump..I thought it was my birthday. I eagerly opened the box and behold a thing of beauty.
I wasted no time at all and set my turntable away, after I'd warmed up my gear. I listened to three Lp's with the original platter and no surprise they sounded great, my deck has already had extensive upgrades, and to my ears, this was going to take something special to better the sound..

I stripped the original platter off and put on the new platter, which took very little time, first let me say the platter is beautifully machined and is an exceptionally nice snug fit. I put the anniversary mat on and tried the first LP..Queen II.. Immediately on first impression, the Stereo immage is brilliant and the soundstage is astounding. The bass being reproduced is snapping into place, the music is fast, very musical and tuneful..It was before with the original platter, but this lump is bringing more out of the vinyl..I had to keep playing parts of tracks over and over again, as I was hearing stuff not heard before...a guitar here a drum beat/cymbal there ..this is probably because the image is placing the instruments far better..Dire Straits is superb as is Aha..The Aha LP is the fastest I've heard the music in my system..It's a very busy album too as they do a lot of mixing/tracking on there Lp's..all in all a much nicer listening experience altogether..i confess, I love the look of the original platter with those lovely brass weights hanging down, which are mesmerising, when you watch them, but I love the sound of this platter..which is one solid piece of acrylic,with just enough room to fit over the bearing housing..I've also been able to remove some of the isolation from under the deck, as it was overkill, the platter has superb damping.. I'm a happy bunny and pleased I was able to get my hands on this marvelous piece of acrylic...I can recommend this with no fear...contact Truepoint Audio for more details...I'm glad I did...

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50116353577_44b2c8eda8_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50116131776_dd46c49b01_b.jpgWhy didn't you just get an Orbe platter from Michell?

[mad-moon]

Why didn't you just get an Orbe platter from Michell?

No thanks...I'll stick with the solid piece of acrylic

[gwernaffield]

the acrylic platters were made because it is solid 48mm when completed in thickness, and NOT like the michell orbe doughnut , with a large hole in the center that means the platter is reduced from 60mm to 20mm, also we were told over years that the Michell Platters were as close to vinyl as possible , but now they have to be impedance matched ??? , the acrylic platters are machined from a solid block , this also means their is a choice in the market place, you have the opportunity to buy a product that is solid or one that is glued and melted together and machined , like the suspension , the PSU , and the Armboards there are now choices, some people will always want to know why you did not go to michell, but also cannot answer what is impedance matching ,and why all of a sudden the old platter which is supposed to be as close to Vinyl as possible now needs to be upgraded , with one with a piece of cork to hide the new way they have been machined,

there is a trick to the oil i have been using on my odyssey, i mixed the zx1 with SYNTHETIC SILICONE GREASE WITH TEFLON,50g TIN 2HT PLASTIC SAFE LOW FRICTION, it makes a Vaseline type lubricant , that ends up thin enough to go up the hole, but still lubricates the bearing , i also used to pack the rear of the bearing ball in the cone part , to act like a vibration absorbent , it seems to make the bearing a lot quieter , although it is very quiet now, i know of several people who are trying this , the bearing no longer starts up dry ,

[phonomac]

....... Delrin is used for making all kinds of stuff including gears also delrin balls are grade one the highest grade you can get for roundness and smoothness, the ceramic balls are grade 5 , the steel balls are normaly grade 10 , unless it is aspecial order and 4 times the cost of grade 10 .......


Just need to make a slight correction here, Delrin balls are graded in thousandths of an inch, so a grade 1 ball is round to within 1 thou, which is approximately 25 microns. Ceramic balls, certainly silicon nitride ones, are graded in microns so a grade 3 ball is round within 3 microns.

[gwernaffield]

you are welcome it also depends on what you are willing to pay ,, https://theppb.co.uk
the way the bearing ball works is just to sit in the cone part of the bearing , and not rotate in the cone , it is only a pinpoint bearing , so only rotates on the smallest point , and Not to fully rotate like a bearing in a housing , the contact area is microns, if any wear occurs it will save the top of the shaft , if a torlon or delrin beaing is used, if the grade is grade 10 it would not matter , the bearing ball Never fully rotates in the cone it self,, the oil only laps the very bottom of the bearing , it is the same for the bearing balls used in the suspension , it is a pin point contact ,that is needed,.

[gninnam]

Received the acrylic platter today to try on the Orbe so thanks Pete.

Underneath you can see the difference:

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20200717_191050.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds (https://app.photobucket.com/u/gninnamag/a/8d7af6f8-1bfd-48c6-a1df-cdde45b84bb8/p/0d56d9b5-1b12-4d61-81da-f361f356c8cc)

[mad-moon]

Click on the image to watch the all new Disco Gyrodec...

https://live.staticflickr.com/31337/50124307697_fef70114a8.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jnjbnF)20200717_223853_54704266023141 (https://flic.kr/p/2jnjbnF) by Alan Moon (https://www.flickr.com/photos/181639036@N04/), on Flickr

[struth]

The phitostream pic will have an arrow at bottom. Select bb code and use that in the tree box which adds the IMG info for site
. You had the info up just wasn't in the IMG and brackets that the tree box gives St top of box for reply.

[struth]

https://live.staticflickr.com/31337/50124307697_fef70114a8.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jnjbnF)20200717_223853_54704266023141 (https://flic.kr/p/2jnjbnF) by Alan Moon (https://www.flickr.com/photos/181639036@N04/), on Flickr

Good vid alan

[gninnam]

Listening impressions so far:

Played many albums/12 inches and have to say it has improved the SQ no end.

The first album I played was an old fav of mine and probably played the most out of all of my collection (Dead Can Dance - In to the Labyrinth).
First thing I noticed was how detailed it appeared to be with the high hats especially sounding a lot clearer than they did previously.
Each instrument seemed so clear and easy to place and I noticed that the percussion on this album seemed to stand out in a way it didn't before.

After this I played some soul from Barbara Mason - 'A Piece of my Life'
The production stuck out for me as everything seemed so crisp and clean, here voice sounding like she was just in front of me and trying to seduce me (oh err).

There are 2 negatives
1. I knew my turntable speed wasn't bang on but got used to it, the new platter is slightly smaller in diameter which moved the speed closer to what is should be (it was out by about .3 RPM) so I could pick up the slight change but I could always alter the speed, but being the AC PSU/Motor it requires some major surgery (hence why I haven't bothered to change it yet....)

2. The recess for the nut appears to be slightly lower than the original platter - this means the nut is lower than before so when you tighten the clamp it no longer pushes the record down as much. This can be address with a washer which I will check my stash for the right sized one.

But, the SQ has improved - will continue to play a few more records tomorrow and make a final assessment

[gninnam]

A few pictures:

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20200717_171656.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds (https://app.photobucket.com/u/gninnamag/a/8d7af6f8-1bfd-48c6-a1df-cdde45b84bb8/p/8e892a84-e2e7-4772-a78c-068d57a93636)

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20200717_171643.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds (https://app.photobucket.com/u/gninnamag/a/8d7af6f8-1bfd-48c6-a1df-cdde45b84bb8/p/c895ec3d-fd08-41c0-972b-6e48b3eca342)

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20200717_171629.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds (https://app.photobucket.com/u/gninnamag/a/8d7af6f8-1bfd-48c6-a1df-cdde45b84bb8/p/d2891034-1499-477c-ae01-d07a55527fdd)

[mad-moon]

Your deck looks Great Andy..The new platter looks so much nicer than the black imho..but more importatntly the sound quality and listening experience has been upped ten fold..It certainly is a wonderful platter..anyone with an Orbe or Gyrodec should definitely give this a run out on their decks, again another upgrade that just works..isn't hifi a fun?

[gninnam]

Your deck looks Great Andy..The new platter looks so much nicer than the black imho..but more importatntly the sound quality and listening experience has been upped ten fold..It certainly is a wonderful platter..anyone with an Orbe or Gyrodec should definitely give this a run out on their decks, again another upgrade that just works..isn't hifi a fun?

Cheers Alan - yes, another brilliant idea started by Peter and seems to just work :)
As Pete would say, he does not make these or sell them so if you want to bag one, then give Truepoint a ring (not affiliated with either Pete or Truepoint but know a good upgrade when I see/hear one :))

Regarding your light show, did it make any difference to the sound? Another worthwhile upgrade :lol:

[phonomac]

.... you are welcome it also depends on what you are willing to pay ,, https://theppb.co.uk
,.
Still haven't seen anything that offers me a 1 micron tolerance plastic ball of any kind - best they can do is 5 microns

[gwernaffield]

well it does not make any difference , the turntables are not built to that high standard , the bearing is only point loaded, about a pin points worth , sitting on a surface that should be very smooth but is a rough as sand paper , and the cone it sits into is not a very good finish either ,
the ball could be 20microns out of shape you just would not see it or hear in , the bearing is located by the shaft and not the ball , i hope this helps
i have talked to Michell over the cone part , not sure if they have done anything about it the ball cannot sit properly due to the roughly machined cone , if my facts have been wrong in the past my apology, but it makes no difference , we stopped using Delrn and torlon , a while ago, torlon is very hard and can micro crack , Delrin was used and still can be used in the pylons, i use a aluminoxide ball, and not the black ball as i was told by Werner that the Black Ball can also crack ,
as all the bearing balls are made to different standards it is up to the user to check , i don't supply parts, but will help if possible,
pete

[mad-moon]

Cheers Alan - yes, another brilliant idea started by Peter and seems to just work :)
As Pete would say, he does not make these or sell them so if you want to bag one, then give Truepoint a ring (not affiliated with either Pete or Truepoint but know a good upgrade when I see/hear one :))

Regarding your light show, did it make any difference to the sound? Another worthwhile upgrade :lol:

It's different to watching the weights fly round on the stock Gyrodec platter..but just a bit of fun Andy...It'll make people smile....:D

[gwernaffield]

made me smile :)

[Gazjam]

SUPERB! :eek:


Click on the image to watch the all new Disco Gyrodec...

https://live.staticflickr.com/31337/50124307697_fef70114a8.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jnjbnF)20200717_223853_54704266023141 (https://flic.kr/p/2jnjbnF) by Alan Moon (https://www.flickr.com/photos/181639036@N04/), on Flickr

[Gazjam]

Werner really knows his stuff, over on VinylEngine he really helped me when I was getting my Gorbe deck together.


well it does not make any difference , the turntables are not built to that high standard , the bearing is only point loaded, about a pin points worth , sitting on a surface that should be very smooth but is a rough as sand paper , and the cone it sits into is not a very good finish either ,
the ball could be 20microns out of shape you just would not see it or hear in , the bearing is located by the shaft and not the ball , i hope this helps
i have talked to Michell over the cone part , not sure if they have done anything about it the ball cannot sit properly due to the roughly machined cone , if my facts have been wrong in the past my apology, but it makes no difference , we stopped using Delrn and torlon , a while ago, torlon is very hard and can micro crack , Delrin was used and still can be used in the pylons, i use a aluminoxide ball, and not the black ball as i was told by Werner that the Black Ball can also crack ,
as all the bearing balls are made to different standards it is up to the user to check , i don't supply parts, but will help if possible,
pete

[gwernaffield]

yes werner is the boss when it comes to michell, he has his own psu and different motor , he was a good friend to J A MICHELL, knew factory well, he has helped ,,with pointing me in the wright direction on somethings,i did not know the chassis could twist ,until werner mentioned it , when talking about Gert's Mods , so he is the real Michell Man ,

[blake]

Still haven't seen anything that offers me a 1 micron tolerance plastic ball of any kind - best they can do is 5 microns

Not plastic but ceramic. Grade 3 Silicon Nitride will get you there. Surface finish is .003 microns and sphericity is .08 microns.

Is it audible in a Gyrodec? Very. I've been running Grade 3 Si3N4 balls in my Gyrodec for more than 3 years now. I've done one oil change in that
time period and just changed to a new ball with the oil change as the balls are ridiculously inexpensive. Under $5 a ball from Boca Bearings.

One of the biggest bang for buck improvements you will make to a Gyro or Orbe.

[gwernaffield]

it does not matter how smooth the bearing ball or how round , until Michell sort the main problem , the smoothness of the components that make up the bearing it self , with the top of the bearing looking as thought it was done on a hand grinder and not a mirror finish , and the cone has the same problem , if you can feel the top of the bearing shaft with you finger it is too rough , the bering having to bed in which takes a long long long time, the ball sitting in the cone that is like tram line finish cannot sit properly ,

[blake]

it does not matter how smooth the bearing ball or how round , until Michell sort the main problem , the smoothness of the components that make up the bearing it self , with the top of the bearing looking as thought it was done on a hand grinder and not a mirror finish , and the cone has the same problem , if you can feel the top of the bearing shaft with you finger it is too rough , the bering having to bed in which takes a long long long time, the ball sitting in the cone that is like tram line finish cannot sit properly ,

Nothing is perfect Pete, but it does make sense to me to put in the roundest possible ball to ensure that any platter "rocking" would be reduced in the cone area as much as possible, as well as one that could also reduce friction & further vibration at the top of the bearing shaft, regardless of any limitations in the stock bearing. Or, as they say, two wrongs don't make a right.

I've been using silicon nitride balls now for more than 3 years with excellent results. It makes no sense to me that they should be more prone to cracking than any of the other non-steel balls-there's a reasonably strong argument that they should be less so. Personally, I feel that
the purported problems with micro-cracking are a bit of an urban legend going back to when John Michell was alive and ball bearing technology was
a bit more primitive and there may have been some problems. But that was a long time ago.

I believe a number of very high end table manufacturers are also currently using silicon nitride balls in their bearings and can't see them doing so
if there were serious problems with the balls.

In any event, it is cheap to simply pop in a new ball every time you do any oil change, which I think is a good thing every few years.

I could never go back to a steel ball, any more than I could never go back to the springs now either :)

The silicon nitride ball will, in my experience, sound significantly better than the steel ball right out of the box and it will take probably 30-45 days
to bed in (possibly less with a lot of use), at which point it will be even better. Anecdotally, I felt that the last time I did an oil change and changed the ball there was very little change in the sound of my table. Prior to that whenever I rotated a steel ball or changed it I felt that the new ball had to bed
in entirely all over again and that the sound from the table was a bit edgy/strident for a few weeks.

Proof is in the listening as they say and it's $5 and easily and instantly reversible.

[gwernaffield]

hi Blake i do get your point , how ever until michell sort out the bearing you will always have more noise in the bearing that is necessary , the surface finish is very , poor ,to the top of the being , where it sits in the cone is also that rough the ball does not sit properly , due to the ridges left after the use of what looks like a center drill, to get the ball to fit properly, it will either need to be lapped into the cone or the cone needs to be ground properly , i did the latter made the ball fit the cone , but only the bare minimum contact is needed, in my opinion this helps stop wobble, how ever i have not real proof only what i hear , also the ball NEVER rotates like a normal bearing ball, the pressure holds it into a fixed position , and rotates on a pin point contact only , the ball could be 20microns out of shape it would not make any difference at all, with the pinpoint contact may be half a micron out of round and then lapping it self into the tram line top of the bearing ,

may be if the top had been finished the same as the shaft it would be even less wobble and more central ,, with less rumble , as the ball is forced over the poor finish ,

[gwernaffield]

Hi all if you are tempted to buy a Michell Odyssey 2004 turntable , it should have a badge and also numbered , the chassis has a hidden number , which must correspond with the badge , or paper work , their was only 100 of these turntables made,
they are easy to copy , but it must have the chassis number engraved in a certain place , as proof it is a real Odyssey

[gwernaffield]

more experiments using the synthetic silicone grease with ptfe , and zx1 with oil, this seems to work very well, it stops the bearing from being dry on startup ,i also packed the rear of the bearing ball to help reduce any noise off the ball it self ,
thank you to Blakep for the bearing ball i have not tried it yet , as soon as i do i will send you a PM , it has taken a couple of weeks to get used to the platter , now i have better high notes, the bass is faster and controlled,( plenty off bass with out bass buzz)
i just wish i had the extra weights fitted, how ever they may have caused damaged to the bearing , with the extra weight , no plans now to do anything else at this moment except to enjoy the music ,
pete

[gwernaffield]

I have kept the grease oil mix , it was thought off after seeing that project use a grease oil for their inverted bearings, that is a bit thicker , as the michell bearing acts like a pump,it seemed the best thing to try , so i mixed my own , the deck went faster , now if you slightly push on the platter it will move very very easily,

[gwernaffield]

Hi This problem keeps happening the position of the acrylic screw holes which hold the pylons and should be central to the chassis holes , or you will have to remove the bush out of the center of the pylon , this only allows for the pylon position to be out by 1mm , so if you measure the triangle it should be equal ,
i have one that is way out with 302 302 300, a special set of bases have to be made to get the pylons to work , all because Michel never centralized the pylon posts in the first place which would mean the spring suspension would have to Bend to work but out of spec , you wound never get the Michell bounce correct as one spring would be pulling against the other 2 , which i then have to get truepoint to remake the bases so the pylons work , were it is a manufacturing error by Michell the other way is to re drill the hole in the base , or the spider , using the chassis to get the position and the base ,
place all the bases into the chassis with out the orings and on the adjuster on 2 , the other is the one that is out mark the center of that hole and drill the acrylic to fit

[nuff]

I have been very lucky in getting 1 of Petes Acrylic platters.
Pete was kind enough to let me try his and said if I like it I can then buy it.
I’m not the greatest in sharing thoughts on how the improvements sound but I would like to say Yes this has made quite a big difference to my ears. Don't get me wrong, It sounded excellent before and I love watching the gold weights spinning around but I do like to try improving things further.

The music playback seems to have all been pulled together and tightened. The bass was great before but now it seems very solid.
I did have to adjust the speed slightly but thats nothing.

In the next few months I will trial a few different mats. I have a cork/Nitrile, Plain cork and a leather mat to try. I’ll also try Petes recommendation of a rubber mat.

I just want to say a big thank you Pete! I’m very very happy with my new Gyrodec and I look forward to trying out some of your Pylons in the future.

Heres a few pics with the platter in place.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50280512773_5449e09537_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LGD)IMG_3323 (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LGD) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50280512943_6e6ca3f3fc_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LKz)IMG_3319 (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LKz) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50281355737_99de27c549_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6hv)IMG_3318 (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6hv) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50281355642_336287769c_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6fS)IMG_3321 (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6fS) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

[gwernaffield]

Hi Nathan thanks for the kind words, it was the last B grade i had, now they are bloody expensive, as i dont make them i just managed to get the B grade to let go , so now they are all A grade direct from TP , that one i was using , and have nicked one for my self on monday last week , Just hope Charlie does not knock on the door for his money i use an ORACLE GROOVE ISOLATOR The original special compound rubber mat it is sorbothane , sticks to the platter , i have a anniversary mat , but not the beer mat version , mr moon has the gold spot and he has the same sme arm a 309 , ,sorry you had to fight with the packing LOL :) better safe than sorry ,
pete

[gwernaffield]

please note over the pylons , the following , please check the distance from the center of the small post to the center of the other 2 , they should be equal but to stop these being made i think they are 2 mm out on one point , i know how to do these , if they are 2mm out but please let me know before they are sent , so i can work Michell's new design which twists the springs out of shape, pete

[mad-moon]

I have been very lucky in getting 1 of Petes Acrylic platters.
Pete was kind enough to let me try his and said if I like it I can then buy it.
I’m not the greatest in sharing thoughts on how the improvements sound but I would like to say Yes this has made quite a big difference to my ears. Don't get me wrong, It sounded excellent before and I love watching the gold weights spinning around but I do like to try improving things further.

The music playback seems to have all been pulled together and tightened. The bass was great before but now it seems very solid.
I did have to adjust the speed slightly but thats nothing.

In the next few months I will trial a few different mats. I have a cork/Nitrile, Plain cork and a leather mat to try. I’ll also try Petes recommendation of a rubber mat.

I just want to say a big thank you Pete! I’m very very happy with my new Gyrodec and I look forward to trying out some of your Pylons in the future.

Heres a few pics with the platter in place.

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50280512773_5449e09537_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LGD)IMG_3323 (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LGD) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50280512943_6e6ca3f3fc_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LKz)IMG_3319 (https://flic.kr/p/2jB7LKz) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50281355737_99de27c549_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6hv)IMG_3318 (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6hv) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50281355642_336287769c_k.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6fS)IMG_3321 (https://flic.kr/p/2jBc6fS) by Nathan Rose (https://www.flickr.com/photos/186252557@N07/), on Flickr

Deck looks fabulous. I'm pleased the platter is doing the business...I'm using the Anniversary Ringmat, which just seems to work on my deck..have fun playing with other mats, but I have a feeling you will like myself, keep going back to the Ringmat..atb...Alan..

[nuff]

Deck looks fabulous. I'm pleased the platter is doing the business...I'm using the Anniversary Ringmat, which just seems to work on my deck..have fun playing with other mats, but I have a feeling you will like myself, keep going back to the Ringmat..atb...Alan..

Thanks Alan,
Yes it’s a good mat. Do you use the clamp with yours? On the ring mat sleeve they say don’t use it but to be honest I can hear any different with it on or off.

[mad-moon]

Thanks Alan,
Yes it’s a good mat. Do you use the clamp with yours? On the ring mat sleeve they say don’t use it but to be honest I can hear any different with it on or off.

I did buy a Michell clamp from Peter...but I find the Anniversary mat is better without it....

[gwernaffield]

Hi Alan and nuff , i wish i could take pictures that good, i have poor eyesight , and could not take a decent picture if i tried, i will retry the ring mat i have , hope the platters are working well , still no mk2 , and never will be , as the weight on the bearing may have been too much
enjoy the music

pete

[gwernaffield]

Hi all please note all the Michell upgrades are made BY Truepoint Audio and not by me, also the pylons use o rings similar to SME, AVID , AND GERT PEDERSON and not Cotton,

[gwernaffield]

i seem to upset SA with the above but this was unintentional after are remark on facebook i will not repeat , all the upgrade solutions have drawbacks i should off put waxed thread and not cotton my apologies for that , my pylons are made of acetal /delrin . SA ones i think may be , Black African wood i think that is what the set i have are made off it may be a harder wood, they are very well finished,

i don't talk about how pete's pylons work ,i will even send you down a dark alley as the secrets are kept in my head , and i very really talk on how the Acetal /delrin ones work accept on wham as you all No i had help off this community to eventually to get them to work,
i then gave them to TPA who has never said anything Bad against another company , so before this i was asked in a PM to change the name and put the price up , so i gave them to TPA to become TPA PYLONS ,job done, they put the price up but included the bearings and some sorbothane parts , in that price , job done , i have left it up to the owners all around the world to leave feed back , job done,

but i will NOT stop TPA from making them,as the are the innocent party that now make them , if people start to have a go on forums you should contact them and ask them to stop , in both ways as this is a two way street , with better things to come,

after all i completed the design with the help off the HIFI COMMUNITY that are benefiting from them , like all systems, not are perfect , i have the IP certificate for this final design , lodged by the government off the UK ,
so i am sorry that some one feels grieved, but i did everything asked in the PM , and do not make them

[mad-moon]

Is that not like MacDonalds asking Burger King not to make and sell Burgers?? or am I missing something here?

[gwernaffield]

NO you are not , UK I P CERTIFICATION NUMBER 605573 under this agreement CEASE AND DESIST in contacting True point engineering ,

[gwernaffield]

TPA have changed the design a little bit to get around the acrylic being out , and also the need to measure both holes, all TPA needs now if the size off the center hole, which is normally 28+

pete

[Pegwill]

What more can I say, Peter (gwernaffield) is very helpful, provides great advice and generous. Having moved my Gyrodec from abroad to the uk it needed new o rings. The new o rings provided more support and provided me with something that I had only read about and that is a 3 D sound stage, I was quite taken back. It also now has all the other things that you read about, best summed up a wider and deeper listening experience.

If you have a gyrodec and not tried the pylons then I suggest you do, and best of all if you don’t like it, it’s reversible back to the original configuration without ant tell tell signs.

I have also carried out the other tweaks, like changing the support bearings again, just a few quid and totally reversible and I’m sure all contributes to the sound in their own way.

So thank you Peter, keep up the good work.

Best regards

Bill

[gwernaffield]

Thanks Bill, the latest ones don't need measuring now, as for the acrylic with the holes that are 2mm out that is sorted too,

pete

[Vince]

Every upgrade that I've had from Pete has wrought serious upgrades in sound quality. Clever, clever man and a gent to boot.
Hope you are keeping well Pete.
Take care
Vince

[gwernaffield]

Cheers Vince i try and help where possible, the pylons have just had one hole opened up so no need to measure now,simple but still the same, it was done with the help off True Point Audio, so now they will not stick ,
keep well , Vince , this covid is not going to disappear ,
stay safe all off you

pete

[gwernaffield]

The pylons can now be bought with out measuring the holes now, after all the holes sizes i know what size they should be made, also one hole has been made a bigger to take into account the acrylic points being out ,

pete

[gwernaffield]

Merry Christmas and a happy new year to every on on AOS ,
pete

[Gazjam]

Same to you Pete, :)
All the best mate.

Gary.

[mad-moon]

yeah +1...all the best Peter and family..and here's hoping for a nicer, more healthy and peaceful new year..x..hope you are enjoying your new speakers bud...they look superb..

[33na3rd]

Merry Christmas, Pete!

And a Happy New Year to all!

[gwernaffield]

Happy Christmas to you and happy new year to all off AOS , and far better one, fingers crossed and every other part if possible, time to remember loved ones,

[AJSki2fly]

Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to you and your family Pete.:santa:

[gwernaffield]

Have a happy new year and keep safe to everyone and your families

ATB
pete

[TAD12]

Dear Peter,
A Happy, better and safer 2021 to you and your family.

AND to all at AoS.
Kind regards,
Tad.

[gwernaffield]

Dear Tad all the best to you and your family i hope it is not too cold in Canada , keep safe
pete

[gwernaffield]

i have been using the TPA psu , with out a doubt a good piece of kit , the cost is about the same as the HR , but with more control , it has fine adjustment to the front via 2 buttons,marked fast and slow, the 3 speed buttons mean i no longer have to move the belt, i had TPA make a single pulley now i don't need to flip the belt from one grove to another ,

TPA are busy with the making of bespoke HiFi gear , don't expect delivery the next day or week , all with the help of satisfied customers , i was glad i found them to machine the pylons and sell them,he has a lot to make,

[gwernaffield]

to keep this going , i have been experimenting with the same material TPA make the Pink Triangle arm boards from , it is not thick enough to make the arm board for the Michell , there are a lot of isolation devices for tone arms /cartridge devices , i have used several different pieces of material trying to decouple the cartridge from the arm for vibration purposes, not physically , but with limited success, the best i was told was the Cartridge mans isolation device, using a composite device of foam and stainless steel , the latest version used nylon pins, and threaded screws into the head shell the cartidge located with the use off the 2 nylon pins and double sided tapped to the device , i though of another way of doing this, and wanted to contact Len Gregory aka cartridge man , but sadly he has passed away last year , the idea may not go forward , it needed some one like Len to test ,and also i would not be treading on any ones fingers,

instead i have simply used the Composite carbon fiber and foam board and placed 2 2.5 mm holes at 2.7 mm center, this is now out for test , the mk2 for fixed head arms will need to be worked on a lot more , with the slot needing to be accurately lined up with the fixing holes ,

it is early days but the signs are very good for the fixed version ,
any suggestions to improve the Michell Turntables are welcome, on this thread ,

[Marra]

What an excellent idea.

[gwernaffield]

The Cartridge Thing made it onto my TT, it is just the fixed version , with 2 more made and sent to 2 AOS members, to leave honest feedback on ,here or wam

[gwernaffield]

so now to the Gloop , this makes the turntable faster , contains oil , grease and oil, now in test's it will speed up the deck by upto .5rpm with one deck going from 28.8 to 33.1 . and hope when fully used it will climb just a little bit more ,

pete

[gwernaffield]

i have been experimenting with the feet and skate board wheels, now the thread on the Michell feet are 1/2 bsf and m6 , the m6 is to lock the top part onto the spider keeping the suspension in place, how ever the 1/2 then screws into the tender feet this seems to lock up in the foot , which is intended to be adjustable, you try and adjust it , it will ether not turn or will undo the M6 which inturn unscrews the suspension , to stop this,i am having a small adaptor made, to fit the rubber isolators and to screw into the feet , you just remove the top part of the michell foot and fit this , it would decouple the foot from the deck , for the first time , the suspension is now decoupled from the stand it sits on and you still can adjust the level using the foot , i will have some pictures next week ,
stay safe
peter

[gninnam]

i have been experimenting with the feet and skate board wheels, now the thread on the Michell feet are 1/2 bsf and m6 , the m6 is to lock the top part onto the spider keeping the suspension in place, how ever the 1/2 then screws into the tender feet this seems to lock up in the foot , which is intended to be adjustable, you try and adjust it , it will ether not turn or will undo the M6 which inturn unscrews the suspension , to stop this,i am having a small adaptor made, to fit the rubber isolators and to screw into the feet , you just remove the top part of the michell foot and fit this , it would decouple the foot from the deck , for the first time , the suspension is now decoupled from the stand it sits on and you still can adjust the level using the foot , i will have some pictures next week ,
stay safe
peter

:interesting:

[mad-moon]

i have been experimenting with the feet and skate board wheels, now the thread on the Michell feet are 1/2 bsf and m6 , the m6 is to lock the top part onto the spider keeping the suspension in place, how ever the 1/2 then screws into the tender feet this seems to lock up in the foot , which is intended to be adjustable, you try and adjust it , it will ether not turn or will undo the M6 which inturn unscrews the suspension , to stop this,i am having a small adaptor made, to fit the rubber isolators and to screw into the feet , you just remove the top part of the michell foot and fit this , it would decouple the foot from the deck , for the first time , the suspension is now decoupled from the stand it sits on and you still can adjust the level using the foot , i will have some pictures next week ,
stay safe
peter

Great idea Peter...I'll be employing this method very shortly.....

[gwernaffield]

these will be made soon , because the tender foot uses an outdated thread 1/2 bsf , TPA has not got the tooling to make them at the end of this month ,fingers crossed,

[gwernaffield]

309 -310 this is my 309 set up as a 310 , now the proffessors may say this is impossible, but the difference in the 2 arms in not a lot , and to those who will say it is not in the correct spindle to cartridge position that is where the prototype device comes into its own , so now you can set the arm on the piviot point and move the cartridge to were you want , you can set the 309 on the same position as the V , but i prefair the 310 setting , the device decouples the cartridge from the tonearm and allows the user to put the stylus where ever they want , the one in the arm is to prove the consept , and is a rough prototype, but it works very well

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mwgfAZDZFjGwv_1Dn9qw7pjXaH1jIlDLuJm75qgvbJ7LZ1_7 yb18pzf0To8lYYaf9bsxiOE0R4TwgZCLT8UFfDQ3tlmsV6Ptur jk1XAEZOxuw7-kq4IbDhEb8fFMacj8AAOy8Xb7_dTz47m7r6gV2KL2ytQU4wXyS i1AGEKpEZBfe4JI1HMuagq7WVoD_VZti?width=1000&height=750&cropmode=none

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mcRF9sfslz6DSTPm18PalWiTAnBOhcgywgAyguX1dc8Z07cr yUXKiThNgYRgrCXg98fwhKDt8Sagv_qJXMdyQ2uHgLuduXpp7t 2twm5_Ij113xcOY2te0woWoHJfItZAjnFzq4BsZkIXpdPID0DZ MmAQtzTEMH950SUmmkk6x5FmMA8TGovS8Lb65_kdwKIQs?widt h=1000&height=750&cropmode=none

[gwernaffield]

yes it is set on the correct position piviot to stylus, as well, checked with the sme 310 protractor ,

pete

[gwernaffield]

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mMhx3E1kiRvEZ5Gvd7zEb0liGl8htHMmv5CQy8Ov0vw35Acq h1FVwuSJGvLg4_v_HEQyJJtSr4L9HocTlB_9vN1u8PZaCg9WCe 4Cp5vJICA9RcDw7i7vQo6ZaAJ03b5_96peZhJqHXBKRLYJW5QF kWhHTs75A3qqIMhE0lQ7JJFP5016iAU4TmFHaesnO1Jek?widt h=1000&height=750&cropmode=none

this isolates the foot from the chassis , it does not touch the foot , the center part of this is seperate and held in the rubber which houses a m6 thread it will have a cover , that is still being made, a simple and effect isolation anti vibration device used in industry ,but now converted to fit the normal michell foot

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4myKYnNoXJnBJb-Z96bRBb-Y6uC06Rkp146DDWeeU2fGRC6lEN2zZwOXILb8QqNAgERm7B9jI 1fvocQ5KQLvWbmSGoVfbmSr7v5fqGw5nTdTRNYfZcgFWypVIEh CqXZNeyM3fyhAar9jU0mFuDE3kTxbvVWPL2tIJYPKUzA8C2F9y jsg_ONQAVyKjiTWtBbRXk?width=1000&height=750&cropmode=none

[gwernaffield]

the above does work , but added some wobble to the deck, that was not intended, and they have been put on the shelf with the rest of the failures ,
however it has now been sorted, with a manufacturer making the required part with stiffer rubber , they work a treat , how ? they seperate the foot from the suspension , and seem to help reduce the surface noise on the LP, and also the sound stage seems to have grown , i am waiting on a parts to be made , before the final design is posted,

pete

[mad-moon]

I've tried the prototype out of Pete's Feet. I was going to wait for the newer version, before I posted anything on the forum..however, Pete has put his thoughts up, so here's mine...As Pete says, the protoype has a wobble with the original Michell feet fitted to this new isolation piece. I'm waiting for the new pieces to arrive to rectify this problem, which I'm certain will cure this little hiccup perfectly..on first listen, there is now near silence behind the music and there is near zero surface noise from the lp, even between the tracks, I'm listening hard for noise, but hearing next to nothing..This in turn is letting more of the music through...the micro dynamics are there in all their glory, along with the rest of mids, highs and bass. I've always had a problem with surface noise, but these wee isolation devices have near cured the problem...looking forward to receiving the finished units Pete...Madaleine sounds fantastic..every element of the tracks are shining through. Sade has never sounded so good..

P.S. no pics yet, till the finished design is ready..these again are another design, which allows the user to put the deck back to spec, with little effort...these feet will also work with the skateboard feet too, but I may change back to Michell's original feet yet, although I have tried the design with both the skateboard wheels and Michell's original feet, there is very little in it...

[gwernaffield]

Hi ALan thanks for the above , i wont let them go any where until they are correct , which the mk 2 are , i have already been asked about when they will be ready , however i am relaying on truepoint to make the parts, the above were too soft , i have had to get specials from a different manufacture , and supplier , all take time, it is better to be honest when i am donig this , pete

[mad-moon]

I've tried the prototype out of Pete's Feet. I was going to wait for the newer version, before I posted anything on the forum..however, Pete has put his thoughts up, so here's mine...As Pete says, the protoype has a wobble with the original Michell feet fitted to this new isolation piece. I'm waiting for the new pieces to arrive to rectify this problem, which I'm certain will cure this little hiccup perfectly..on first listen, there is now near silence behind the music and there is near zero surface noise from the lp, even between the tracks, I'm listening hard for noise, but hearing next to nothing..This in turn is letting more of the music through...the micro dynamics are there in all their glory, along with the rest of mids, highs and bass. I've always had a problem with surface noise, but these wee isolation devices have near cured the problem...looking forward to receiving the finished units Pete...Madaleine sounds fantastic..every element of the tracks are shining through. Sade has never sounded so good..

P.S. no pics yet, till the finished design is ready..these again are another design, which allows the user to put the deck back to spec, with little effort...these feet will also work with the skateboard feet too, but I may change back to Michell's original feet yet, although I have tried the design with both the skateboard wheels and Michell's original feet, there is very little in it...

The mark 2 has landed....a stiffer version, which combats the wobble which has now gone all together. There is still ample flex in the unit to retain the perfect isolation, keeping the deck standing firmly in place..The new isolator kit, has had a nice face lift too...all will be revealed soon...The sound from my deck is wonderful to start with...I can now hear incredibly detailed vocals right forward and sweet..the drummers kit is snappy..pianos and the Hammond organ sounds are smooth...Guitars, saxaphones and brass placed nicely so you can here where they are and last but not least, the bass is fat, fast and tight. The sound space is quite amazing and the music is even more wonderful...another fabulous inexpensive isolation upgrade for the Gyrodec..The Orbe version is in the pipeline...watch this space.....

[TAD12]

cannot wait to improve my Odyssey.Well done guys.

[gwernaffield]

Thanks alan for the update, i am now waiting on Truepoint to produce them ,
pete

[gwernaffield]

this week i changed the Motor out of the deck for a stronger motor the cost was £150 , the problem then is finding a PSU to drive it , the HR psu would not , the motor is a promotec 9904-120-16706 24v , 7 watt higher tourque motor , i was wondering why a change in motor would result in a dramatically different different sound, more clear and more defined , after all it is just doing the same job, at 33.3 rpm ,

[mad-moon]

Just received my psu/speed controller, new motor and pulley...the motor is 24volts and has a lot more torque compared to Michell's standard motor...The speed control side of things gives you 3 speeds..33 1/3, 45 and 78. It also has a speed trimming facility via two buttons on the front of the unit (see pics)..this is plugged into the household 240v supply and stepped down via the psu's internal adapter to the correct voltage to run the motor. The original twin pully is replaced via a single solid brass pulley..My Gyrodec now spins straight up to speed in a flash and is steady as a rock, with the extra torque from the motor, the platter is spinning without effort and is a lot more stable. This just adds again more to the listening experience, with the speed being perfectly controlled via the new psu/speed control..It's a pleasure also being able to switch speed without having to remove the belt and contaminating it with the natural oils in the skin..Everything is housed in a nice alumininm enclosure, with acrylic front and back panels and is built with high quality components..all in all an excellent addition to the Gyrodec, to yet again, enhance the turntables capability as a reference turntable...anyone wanting further information on this psu/speed control unit will need to contact Truepoint Audio..

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51130812985_599f0d8115_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51129701046_2f46bc0c65_c.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51129756249_b71791be58_b.jpg

[gwernaffield]

Hi MR Moon that looks good, i have now got an upgraded TPA PSU , the ease of use is fantastic , and no need to get dirt on the belt , it is rock soild, for speed ,

[gwernaffield]

arm board isolation is it possible on a gyro or orbe, in the past i have tried all kinds to do this, with sorbothane and rubber bobbins to replace the michell standoffs, they work well at £7 for 4 off ebay , but i use what i would consider to be an expensive cartridge , i was worried if any movement was happening ,that i could not see, so i use a sold acrylic armboard , with dots of grungbuster which the armboard sits on , i was also concerned that if this armboard or the michell was not perfetly level it would mean the channel separation, channel balance, and signal direction may be wrong , the only way to check that is by using the appropriate equipment , Test lp , and fozgometer , i took the decisson to use a solid platform and also protect the cartrdige and the vinyl from and damage .but then if you wish to try the bobbins they work , and i may yet go back to them , 3 off the male to feamale bobbins where £7 for 3 in M5 , they worked but i did not have any thing to double check the effect on the cantileaver ,i now have a fozgometer and test lp , i may retest this at a later date ,

[gwernaffield]

these are the businness for armboard isolation , https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/373068142167?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&var=641847062643&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.
they are an industry standard isolater , the M5 x 10 mm x 16 mm diameter the bolt is seperate to the female part , so the board is isolated, . the cost £16

[mad-moon]

Another wonderful turntable utilising o-rings in its construction. It Just goes to show it's a concept that works a treat where isolation is concerned...

https://www.vertereacoustics.com/rg1

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51143440854_36e2febe7a_b.jpg

[gwernaffield]

The old AC motors have two sintered bearings. If they have dried out then they can be oiled but they won’t be the same as before they dried out, you might get a year or two before they will need doing again. You really need to strip the motor down to lubricate it because if you oil it from the top, it could make the motor noisy, as you will be lubricating the series of washers on the top of the motor and they can then begin to vibrate. You can try using something thin like ZX1 or WD40.
The best thing would be to send it Michell , so they can then replace the washers and circlip etc. and give it a good clean out and lubrication.
If you are using a QC power supply with it, make sure you turn the QC off when not in use. The QC has a current path to keep the motor warm, over a long period of time this will speed up the bearings drying out. received from MIchell engineering in 2019

[mad-moon]

the Final cut...This is my Gyrodec, with the new version of Pete's pads...The cup has been shortened, so the need for an internal spacer is not required..These are really exceptional for total isolation of the deck from the feet..The inner workings of the pad, see that there is no connection between the aluminium cup and the spider. As an added bonus, these look stunning too, which was an important factor in the later design stage...The set I had previous to these, were just a bare version with a carbon fibre jacket. the half inch thread which takes the foot, was a stub machined from mild steel..This version worked very well, but the newer aluminium cup version, has the half inch threaded stub machined directly in the design of the new cup, making these units something quite special....an impressive piece of work TPA...The noise floor has been lowered even further with this unit and is another modification for the Gyrodec, that lets you here more of the music..a marvelous little piece of design and engineering..

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51192557785_e4540b2d8b_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51191494421_02fca88b3a_b.jpg

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51192263854_44e18785c8_b.jpg

[33na3rd]

Very nice!

[gwernaffield]

hi alan thank you for the above, i have sent some out for test and review by other people, as with the pylons i wont tell you what i think , i would only be blowing my own trumpet , i may have some more as test parts , how ever i dont know yet if that is possible the cost is quite high , for the parts due to the maching involved, By TPA , short batches cost alot more , due to the same set up ,

the reson why they are called Pads was becuse i wanted to use a the tender foot of the gyro and orbe,it is also a nod to the design features on the gyro ,and past decks , i did not want to add a big spacer this would push the cost up , i think the difference in height to the std foot is 7mm, there are plans just to put a piece of acrylic 7mm thick to lift the motor to keep every thing on the same height , they will also be anodised , they seperate the small post inside the suspension from the tenderfoot ,
that is all you need to know,
pete

[gwernaffield]

hi all i hope you are all safe and well, i need to know the thickness of the spider / plinth , if you order the pads, this is becuse over the years Michell has changed the thickness of the Acrylic and reducing the amount of thread you screw the pads onto
so insted of having 9 mm off thread you will only have 6 mm off thead that hangs down under the acrylic , i just have to adjust the height to compensate for this, it is an easy thing to do

pete

[gninnam]

Changed the bobbins under the arm pod as per Pete's recommendations tonight - so far so good :yay:

Pics of the bobbins in situ:

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20210614_201039.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20210614_201031.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds


And new versus old (new on the left):

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/(edited)_20210614_201126.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/20210614_201149.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds

[nuff]

A good little upgrade! Have you a link to where you bought the bobbins please, Just to make sure I buy the correct ones.

[mad-moon]

A good little upgrade! Have you a link to where you bought the bobbins please, Just to make sure I buy the correct ones.

See post 639

[gwernaffield]

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mhk-U9L35kzc6JjTLJiCgPEq5j82pemY630g5EbL2_wGMYiT00hjpj n-wQ7mgmdxHZzMXfCBgX5noW_3Gi2aEL44AbZZ4aUVQcIaGV7LcU XIvcse1wL6Wo5nJeDkcLn9Jcirz6jRhUEOdtU-O-Npr36AxyVax345LS8mCIECFL4MKPJN-LGI39zT7nxVWCc15?width=222&height=575&cropmode=none

for those of you who may buy the petes pads , the michell foot come in two parts , you simply remove the michell foot and unscrew the post leaving you with the tender foot to screw into the pad, and screw the pads into place on the spider , on the plinth you just have to screw to the plinth on a orbe set up , on the gyro you have to hold onto the small post inside the suspension ,

[gwernaffield]

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mgJpXXT6NVVl00Cb_EMPb-gtAIyIg9MXlVRWbkCWIRWqI3iiAMh99wYgrrqIq--soclSLxYjEkTWE5blXgofmRfpx8B2KA1wF0h1LdSYpIKK4PoI8 1h0zDEvPYM8fwflDh-a_TrrBvbCXOHuKcepRDT1jc3ScgyogFn9j68b7sJ4pTu1QM3Ot E-gjQsyKvcz4?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none

[gninnam]

Look great do those Pete :smoking:

[nuff]

See post 639

How did I miss that :scratch:

Thanks for the reply :cool:

[gwernaffield]

they are out getting anodised , according to TPA, the black ones where painted, with Ral 9005 , jet black same as the deck ,

peter

[gwernaffield]

so far the pads have 3 fans and one who does not like them out of the test ones, the problem is if the LP is poorly produced they will show that up a lot , but i guess that is hfi , pete

[gwernaffield]

so now he has changed his mind, and kept them , as i said that is hifi , 4 fans 100%
pete

[gwernaffield]

Thank you for being honest in your opinions, i would not have it any other way , good or bad is always welcome, it helps me to make stuff, TPA are the only engineering company that now produce and distribute these, i dont get anythng but pleasure of reading if they work or not , TPA have now run out of the stock they made 6 weeks ago , i beleive there will be a wait for the next batch to be made, due to Brexit and the import of parts needed, in the mean time they have made some in Black and some in silver , waiting on parts, i have sort of been trolled with a emoji of a monkey which meant monkey see monkey do , as he supports a different manufacturer that has now had to cut their feet down to size,

you all know i had designed them months ago it is no a case of Monkey see monkey do , these where out far before the others, you all can make your own minds up , the pads had to be designed to match the deck ,they even use the michell tender foot , i could not see the point of throwing a perfectly good part in the bin or cupboard , any movement in the foot is bad it would cause the belt to slacken off , and more wow and flutter as a result ,

https://patents.justia.com/patent/6402118
https://www.avforums.com/threads/turntable-support-using-magnets.1311282/

keep safe pete

[gwernaffield]

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4md3XcXVzhk6jN7yr19XAQA-b58_YD4mseHGJQsZRMPqSmziEMebzpkqZVu-MU1iVgcOeZDoT2ODrJvfCAF-P8xE6oHx3mnJoBWjQ41PfdJaHkHlzXbeQEa7a2MDj0J_fxkLAf 0JSFk8o4x-9PRVK7ZsJqfFnHk15IusUNHkija3Fqh0oQIq5ATn4tkyUI94y2 ?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none
https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4m4aPmg3ZCDD7jL0pS1JqCOg1YtsfMXXX7P1TlnLA_wYEAQqF Ubj9FsQCQwCPSpvPuPeMxERwCkXWb7aN0uFeVQHz_8z_EPshBL E9fVrSVKk8unLNshLUn6p2tc420gA-KqHPWyeD53k8QFcUm2IpccdoeNxuL2ioPSkKqd6L6p2ONnOo-WvrXOedpKCKrhgxR?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none
https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mfzDAfGSzX04RzAIC3y7qLYez2gphyiIC9RLp3p2ABOPKedq qzRfKoDj1g0tKNUDP53fTOVUdFyTZOqefUu-LE4JR-ajakp5VjVwbiXgY-Fua6djTZWWwPmwwQS_4ZO3kIFURrs-tYmSYDOKbgGjX2C32m1R7q1PL3UkLeBHwGMVQnlbxWYg-83M2AEq7kzDn?width=495&height=660&cropmode=none
this is a friends deck , it has most of the upgrades fitted , atb peter

[gwernaffield]

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mjdMhYX58VvmyWn9VTwuoyAMx-fuzwthpRE1eC2HTcpGzeehVZG72AVygqZ3KwFjK9NJ9jImSG-HaFrBCqZEafxtbSrrcNM2LAcy7fSxl6Qi0pyUF_BwTJGHX7mfW RZqI5hE6BCCjOCichQTNCG92NxRYkd000BXpPgXnNKkCt7QJw1-7ki2HDUboeGgM5PfV?width=2384&height=2370&cropmode=none
this is a conversion from AC to DC , using the original top , By Truepoint , as Michell only supply a new top and motor , TPA can make the DC motor fit the original AC housing to keep the gold look or bronze or silver ,

[gninnam]

Friends TT looks really nice and like the mod by TPA :smoking:

[gwernaffield]

Gninnam , yep the mod for the motor is something Charlie thought off , it has alonger pully , the other part is screwed to the top of the motor , i think they use sorbothane somewere along the line , then it is held in place with the original AC nut , it works very well, and he seems to make a lot of them ,

pete

[TAD12]

Hi all,
Have now upgraded my Odyssey to Pete's pylons, armboard with brass inserts and new feet. What follows is ALL subjective, with the benefit of late 60's ears. All these mods have been very welcome, with increased and better defined bass output.Overall soundstage has improved. DSOTM by the Floyd has never sounded better. Instruments played in a chamber setting appear to have improved separation. Probably a function of improved midrange.
Thanks to Peter for all his efforts. Now it's just the motor and housing to tweak and the project is finished. Time to go through my Edizione Vivaldi on vinyl, which sounds wonderfull btw. Yes, all 10 boxes !!!!
For anyone still sitting on the fence re: these upgrades, go for it. You will not be disappointed. Back to the cool of my basement.

[gwernaffield]

has any one ever had a VC psu for the gyro , it was produced up until 2003 then replaced by the HR , which in theory should be better ,

[Transparent67]

Hi Glad your happy with Pete's great upgrades, as we all are.
do you have any pictures you wish to share?

[Transparent67]

Hi Everyone, For the present time, my turntable not only looks a thing of beauty, but sounds amazing.

Forget the politics of which camp you wish to sit on, it does not matter, what is important is how the music makes you feel when your in the middle of a listening session, smiling through the realism which can be achieved without spending telephone numbers.

As my late, great, father used to say "if you do not have anything positive to say, do not say anything"
ANYWAY.......

As I've previously posted (not many I admit - being a novice at this stuff) the journey & enjoyment, I have had with the amazing upgrades & benefits from the stables of the genius that is Pete.
His insight, design ideas, generous help & enthusiasm have done more to vastly elevate this turntable than the actual manufacturer (sorry John if your looking down).

It is a fact that I was considering to purchase a SME 15, but in all honesty, the performance I have now negates the need to spend nearly £9K - I know all is subjective but that's how it is so thank you again Pete!

I plan to post a few little things, about my upgrade path which will probably mirror others experiences & would like to share with you some pictures of the evolution of my vinyl spinner, when I have mastered how it is done..

Have a great weekend.

[gwernaffield]

Thank you for your kind words, i have no more to add to the Turntable, the final part was the feet , enjoy the Turntable, all the best pete

[33na3rd]

Hi Pete,

My budget finally allowed me to order the acrylic Rega armboard for my Gyro SE, to accompany your wonderful pylons!

Charles at True Point was very helpful and made the whole process very easy.

I am really looking forward to this next step up!

Jeffrey

[gwernaffield]

Hi Jeff Charley will sort it , i am taking a back seat at this moment , want to get members to use this thread and put there thoughts on here ,

pete

[blake]

I received a set of Pete's Pads earlier this week and have had a chance to listen to a fair bit of music now following installation of the pads so my impression of them follows (I'd be happy to hear from others who have them installed their thoughts as well).

I've had the Pylons installed for two years as of next month, and I'd have to check but I think I've had the armboards at least a year, perhaps longer. I essentially played a bunch of records I'm very familiar with, some of which I've listened to for 30 years or so.

Firstly, what I definitely know that I heard and secondly, some impressions on what I also "think" I might have been hearing with the pads installed.

Definitely:

Noticeable increase of separation of instruments and increased clarity. No doubt about this one. In many cases you can hear different instruments with the pads installed as opposed to a more "combined" sound of that combination of instruments. There's both a separation and increased focus and clarity at the same time. Bass lines go slightly deeper, but they stop and start with much more authority. It does not sound clinical in any real sense of the word and the presentation remains imminently musical; if it didn't I would comment on that.

There's an ability to hear more into the recording as a result: in situations where there is an instrumental solo, there is heightened clarity on the instrument but it is also easier to follow other musicians that might be comping in the mix at the same time.

In terms of voices, overall the same increase in clarity in both lead and background vocals with that increased focus and clarity mentioned. There's also just more room or venue sound that I'm aware of as a result of the increased focus and clarity in many recordings.

All of this comes without an increase in "edge" or an introduction of any glare. Just the opposite in fact. I played a mono Sundazed reissue of Booker T's "Green Onions", which I've always found to sound a bit aggressive and nasty, and the pads very definitely and noticeably cleaned up what I did not know was a bit of distortion being introduced by my table sans Pads to both the leading and trailing edge of the guitar.

Possibly:

I'd have to do a switch and go back to test this one out but can't be bothered but I believe that soundstage width and particularly height may have expanded. I could be imagining this but don't think so. I wouldn't say that it's as noticeable and dramatic as the increase in clarity and it is not a huge expansion in the soundstage but I think it is there. But it might just be me interpreting the improved imaging as a result of the increase in clarity as providing a slightly larger aural picture.

Surface noise. My system is pretty decent in this regard, but I feel that the pads may also be lending to a slight reduction in surface noise.

Frankly, I wasn't expecting as much from the pads as I received. I've waited a long time to order them as I just couldn't get my head wrapped around how something that simple would make much of a difference and I've also tried to isolate my table from vibration as much as possible as seen in my photos. But my Gyro is also a full plinth version (as opposed to SE) with the motor mounted directly-and feeding noise directly-on to the plinth, so the pads may have even more of an effect on my version of the table than the SE.

In any event, I feel the pads represent very high value. I was really dumbfounded with what Pete's suspension modification did for the table and pleased with the acrylic armboards. I would definitely not go back to the standard Michell armboard (advertised it for sale actually but had no bites) but having done all three modifications now over the course of a couple of years I would say that from my perspective the hierarchy would be:

1) Pylons
2) Pads
3) Armboards

This might be influenced by the fact that I have two arms (and hence two armboards), but the individual armboards are I believe even more expensive than the Pylons (I'm not aware of the current Pylon pricing-having purchased directly from Pete just before they went into commercial production with True Point). But to me the Pylons should be the first stop among the 3 products: to me they offer the most dramatic improvement-I'm still amazed at what they did for my table.

The Pads come in at a significantly lower cost than the armboard and might actually offer more performance, so on that basis I would say they offer a significantly bigger bang for the buck (or pound/Euro as it may be) than the armboard and the combination of Pylons and Pads is definitely a huge bang for the buck IMO.

But others might have a different opinion and YMMV of course.

https://img.canuckaudiomart.com/uploads/2021/11/7/user_2507_large_deecd690d60f5bfdc6207f5bde4cf04f.j pg

https://img.canuckaudiomart.com/uploads/2021/11/7/user_2507_large_88485bc7a3e5383d17a3365636f0eed5.j pg

[gwernaffield]

Thank you blake , Merry Christmas and a Happy New year to everyone

[mad-moon]

All the best Peter...Have a nice day bud..:christmas:

[gwernaffield]

thanks alan , we ended up with Covid over Christmas , gave me time for a redsign of the pylons that now support 8 o rings, and are on trial on my deck ,

[gwernaffield]

the 8 orings are working well ,

[mad-moon]

the 8 orings are working well ,

Magic...how are they sounding pete??...

[gwernaffield]

they are really good, seem to centralise the pylon a bit better then the 6 orings, bass is very good and so is voicing , also the background seems to be a bit more quieter , with 8 Orings,

[gwernaffield]

the old pylon price should be £189 plus post , as a kit , i have nothing to do with truepoint , who will not be making the new design,https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4mzfgQwSgjCjcu-lfeoSUpjaGrqmOBlJHRWUzkuDoQKqWQ5-A31R44Ief-lqBQVt7Em87YzZqeGVuT99L7BkWUjEFhpnaXDF5Ntw3t3COyqY UfGXp0-2y5L4F8B1kkjevbP6gV0errtqvVlTlbbAJmzoDUGUTaioyb7Mv eh7274Py2w-kMtl9LA2ypOFWOg1y6?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none

https://db3pap006files.storage.live.com/y4myC1z9IMLzmBkv7Gr5kHGwxOyZzycVioI9EkdXElC-9aUhS6_N-S2vLsEY95ahmbx9gTDgN_dqzR5y_XzD0YQL48kWP6fi7hlDZ8U gKhLZ9dwDhMIEfd74sTUeQlT8YGqOL7yZD8BC0YTN1kV1wpfRs WlYplf3uhR08v17PqpNBSQbZ-Ou2Q_SJWmeFuPydld?width=660&height=495&cropmode=none

[I.D.S.]

Any plans to put the new style pylon in production for sale Peter?

[gwernaffield]

No , it is just a hobby to me, these have been on test for the past 3-4 years , thare are 3 sets in existance , all of them have been on show on all the turntables over the past years, they are different becuse they use an 8 point support system unlike the rest on the market , The 6's are still the best that you can buy , but i have nothing to do with them, unless there is a problem or some one cannot understand how to fit them

The 8's do not need any measurment of the holes and the extra support system with the extra 2 orings, due to all the knowledge gained by the older 6 system ,
means they can be made one size fits all, they have never been copied from another design , only mine and i have 2 other users that can confirm this,

so what does this mean , i will no longer have anyone saying i copied a design , i the design is unique, it is also date stamped, on all the web pages, it menas now all of the ones that have been copied will be out of date, do not try and 3D print them the Crown points will snap off an fail ,normaly after a couple of months, also people who copy them will steal the sweets of a child ,

[gwernaffield]

NO , i reserve the wright to change my mind , People who will make them do not have all the information i now know, even down to the standard of the Orings used, if they will have sorbothane or a bush ,

ATB Pete

[Mr.Ian]

Thinking of doing an oil change on my inverted bearing, used mobil one in the past, anything better about in small quantities or affordable prices, mobil dte 25 for example

[Mr.Ian]

Mobil shc 625 looks interesting

[rocking kid]

Hi Ian i have not used that mix i use a mix of mobil 1 zx1 znc 2ht ,

seems to work well ,
pete

[rocking kid]

so i have had a rethink on the Pylons and will have more news on that , still using , 0rings put in suspension pods , which have been made for the past 4 years ,i just could not work out how to use them on a gyro or orb , would they need 4 ,
More to Follow ,


pete

[mad-moon]

Yo Peter....nice to see you back mate....

[rocking kid]

Hi Alan hope you are well, i am working on some pods to place the gyro onto , but of course suspended, took a while to get back (gwernaffield is no more ) lol now rocking kid

[rocking kid]

Wanted broken Kef NT25 tweeters , in the quest to help , i have manged to repair the kef NT25 with new voice coils and re ferro fluid, i am looking for any broken ones that i can practice on ,

pete

[rocking kid]

well it is a long time since the pylons came about , with a lot of help from the Michell Community , the use of Orings in the construction , has now been copied, by several manufactures , it is not new , with the 6 now in True point audio for good, when making the pylons , they went from 3 orings to several small types, using red o rings, the compound used in the o rings was changed , due to the UV light effect on rubber , i have not done much else since they were made, i hope the Pylons keep Going in the Hands of True point Audio , who make parts for HIFI for every one, they make the Bearing For the Pink Triangle Dec , and can supply and upgrade that , to what ever spec you need , they make custom spiders for the Gyro which look great , my association with them has now come to an end , and i wish them well for the future , as they will still produce the pylons , i hope, this came about due to continuing ill health on my behalf , ATB Pete

[rocking kid]

the word 'Pylon is not copyright ' it is an engineering term , used by the whole world

Figure 1 – Anchor pylon.
Figure 2 – Branch pylon.
Figure 3 – Tension tower pylon
Figure 4 – Wood pylons.
Figure 5 – Concrete pylon.
Figure 6 – Steel tube pylon.
Figure 7 – Lattice steel pylon.
Figure 7 – Single-level conductor arrangement.
Electrical pylons, i did not name the product ,

[mad-moon]

the word 'Pylon is not copyright ' it is an engineering term , used by the whole world

Figure 1 – Anchor pylon.
Figure 2 – Branch pylon.
Figure 3 – Tension tower pylon
Figure 4 – Wood pylons.
Figure 5 – Concrete pylon.
Figure 6 – Steel tube pylon.
Figure 7 – Lattice steel pylon.
Figure 7 – Single-level conductor arrangement.
Electrical pylons, i did not name the product ,

you missed one out Pete.....Pete's Pylon...;)

Just bought the o-rings Pete...150 of them...looking forward to trying this out thanks...

[rocking kid]

Hi Mr Moon that will get them thinking 150 orings how?? secrets that we keep .

[rocking kid]

Hi All just wanted to wish everyone a better Christmas and a Better New Year , hope every one is fine, all the best pete

[TAD12]

Peter, Happy Christmas and New Year to you and your family, Tadeusz.

[rocking kid]

Happy Christmas and new year to you Tad, i hope it is not too cold, were you are in Canada,and you were not affected by the Storm , all the very best peter

[rocking kid]

i was asked if i still use Delrin bearing balls, the answer is NO , the spindle they sit on in the michell suspension has a rough part on the top this caused a flat spot on the delrin , that is why i changed to ceramic bearing , but even this may get damaged by the poor surface finish on the suspension spindle, the PTFE bearing was the best but again this worn out and flat spots appeared, this was discontinued, i continue to try different things with the gyro ,and will up date accordingly ,

all the very best to every one, and a happy and lucky new your to all off you ,

[BendBound]

Question for others who have the Gyro SE. I've noticed lately that the weight below the chassis on my kit has play in it. I've attempted to tighten the bolt, but it will not tighten. Then I tried to remove the bolt so that I could shim the weigh with a fiber washing. Well, I was not able to get it to back out. My attempt have slightly dinged up the bolt, and I am concerned about doing more damage.

So, have any of you had experience, moreover success in withdrawing these fasteners?

Thanks in advance.

[rocking kid]

do you mean the weighs on the platter ?

[gninnam]

Still got the old girl :)

https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/a373/gninnamag/mrousavy5718028422743018056.jpg?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds

[BendBound]

do you mean the weighs on the platter ?

Yes. The Gyro SE has a two sets of lead counterweights on the underside of the metal chassis. One set in the front, a second on the back. These are a bit leftward, looking straight on to the turntable. These weights are held down by a bolt (I think three) with a Philips head.

I cannot find an email for Michell UK, just a telephone number. So I sent a note to Artech Electronics (NA Michell dealer) in Canada from whom I've purchased parts. Their reply yesterday was:


"Normally the weights are held in place by dabs of silicone sealant and the screws provide mechanical retention. If your deck is very early, there might be no silicone and the shoulders in the holes of the soft lead, has been bottomed out, so the bolts are no longer retaining. I didn't think they used and thread locker.

You might want to contact Jonny at Michell Engineering for a solution."


I asked if thread lock had been used because my efforts to break the bolts loose with moderate force was not successful. I want to install that dab of silicone and perhaps install a fiber washer under the bolt. Artech asked the age of my Gyro SE. I'm guessing 2005 or 2006. I purchased it gently used in 2007. I would not have discovered the loose fit if I had not moved my hand under the chassis and felt the weight move.

[BendBound]

Next question:

Has anyone tried this product from Michell?

https://www.analogueseduction.net/michell-engineering-upgrades-parts-accessories/michell-engineering-densodamp-chassis-damping-compound-for-gyrodec-gyro-se.html

Maybe its available in the US.

[AJSki2fly]

Next question:

Has anyone tried this product from Michell?

https://www.analogueseduction.net/michell-engineering-upgrades-parts-accessories/michell-engineering-densodamp-chassis-damping-compound-for-gyrodec-gyro-se.html

Maybe its available in the US.

Yes when I owned a Gyrodec about 5 years ago I did fit this to the chassis, it did dampen it to some extent, but in my opinion the chassis is a proverbial bell with resonant frequecies.

I also did quite a few of cheap upgrades in this thread, the biggest improvement gains were in the replacement suspensions kit designed by Pete. I subsequently along with him replaced the feet using skate board wheels with a push fit rubber bush in the centre for the feet bolts to fit into, this improve isolation greatly. I also experimented with sorbothane isolation 1mm sheet as a grommet under my SME arm, which gained better definition and detail. I replaced the platter with a Orbe one, which helped a bit in low end definition.

I got it to the point where I felt no further improvement could be gained.

[rocking kid]

just lock it all back in with silicone , it will dampen and retain as well

[BendBound]

Thank you all.

[rocking kid]

https://www.ebay.co.uk white caravan sealing tape £10 eBay item number:192740513384

[BendBound]

Suggestion for putting under the chassis counterweights?

[rocking kid]

hi i just put the weights back in with silicone, like Michell have done for years and then any space filled with the caravan sealing tape, also added this on top of the black stuff to give the chassis more weight

[BendBound]

Terrific. Today I finally received a package of ten 2BA x 1/2 Inch Countersunk Pozi Plated screws. These precision British screws used by Michell hold the counterweights onto the chassis, and several on my Gyro were no longer in perfect condition. Now I can make these improvements.

[rocking kid]

Hope it all works and improves your experience with the gyro ,

[rocking kid]

New Review on TNT regarding the pylons and feet ,

[rocking kid]

been quite on here , just had a new orbe , to be the next upgrades too , changed the pylons to '8's no springs, and the color will change from silver to candy apple red , to make it pop ,

[02GF74]

Ok, I'm a bit late to this party. I'd be looking to upgrade the suspension towers om my Gyro.

BUT I notice that Peter, user gwernaffield, had not posted since February 2022.

Anyone knows if Peter still is making the parts?

[33na3rd]

Ok, I'm a bit late to this party. I'd be looking to upgrade the suspension towers om my Gyro.

BUT I notice that Peter, user gwernaffield, had not posted since February 2022.

Anyone knows if Peter still is making the parts?

Peter's new user name is "rocking kid".

Pete's Pylons and other Gyro/Orbe goods can be purchased from "True Point Audio".

https://www.truepointaudio.com

[rocking kid]

yes i am ..https://www.maverick-hifi.com/post/michell-audio-owners-club-12811484?trail=80

[rocking kid]

but this time they wont appear before i am ready

[rocking kid]

so the reference series of the pylons has been done, i must say thank you to mad moon and Vince for using them over the past 6-7 years , i would not let them be made with out testing , all the best pete