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Thread: Yamaha NS1000M - Tweaks

  1. #261
    Join Date: Jan 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by sq225917 View Post
    Stock lytics in the xo for the ns1000m has esr of just over 1ohm.
    The only lytics in the stock crossover are the two in parallel across the bass, all others are film caps.

    What frequency did you measure these at?

  2. #262
    Join Date: Sep 2014

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qwin View Post
    "with this in mind im not touching my ns1000's especially as the caps are glued in."

    Yes, I had to rip mine apart removing them, that's how I first discovered they were not electrolytics.
    if its the same glue they used on the binding post plates i thought about hot water to soften the glue up,a hair dryer worked wonders on my binding posts also.
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  3. #263
    Join Date: Jan 2013

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    The glue almost looks like evostick contact cement, but may be a hot melt of some kind.
    A couple of mine just cracked out of the glue without a problem, the rest ripped apart under the pressure.

  4. #264
    Join Date: Jan 2013

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    Just as a guide for folks, ESR is talked about a lot with re-capping projects, the picture below is of a 1uf electrolytic measured using DATS v2 software.
    Notice the massive difference in ESR dependent upon the frequency it sees.
    PP caps do not have any where near the same level of ESR and strapping a fixed resistor in series with it will only work for a fixed frequency and is not going to give the variable level due to frequency change. This is why we change like for like with caps.


  5. #265
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    Again, I'll put this up for reference.

    This first plot is of the NS-1000m bass, measured near field to avoid room effects.



    I've not shown the trace, but there are no phase changes. You can see the elevated bass around 65-115Hz which gives them the punchy feel, then it falls off rapid from around 60Hz (f3 just over 50Hz), pretty much identical to the Yamaha results and also those of Troels Grevesen, when he said “the NS-1000m doesn't do much below 50Hz” he wasn't wrong, however.........





    This plot from my listening spot shows the room taking effect and bass re-enforcement down to 40Hz. This explains why at a NEBO meet, in a very large room, with the speakers well away from the corners and rear wall, there seemed little bass, they would be working more like the near field response. Drop them back into my smallish listening room and they sound totally different. You can also see a suck out centered around 65Hz, there is a phase change centered here which will account for this and is probably down to room reflections/cancellations, so you win some, you loose some.

    So although on paper, the bass output is pretty weak, the reality in your average size listening room is somewhat better.
    To my ear, I always thought this was the case, it's nice to be able to confirm it.

    Note: Measured using REW, my mic is calibrated down to 5Hz.
    Last edited by Qwin; 06-01-2018 at 12:59.

  6. #266
    Join Date: Feb 2008

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qwin View Post

    I've not shown the trace, but there are no phase changes. You can see the elevated bass around 65-115Hz which gives them the punchy feel, then it falls off rapid from around 60Hz (f3 just over 50Hz), pretty much identical to the Yamaha results and also those of Troels Grevesen, when he said “the NS-1000m doesn't do much below 50Hz” he wasn't wrong, however.........
    The NS1000M was produced over several decades, and I have always questioned the frequency response between the earlier and later versions.

  7. #267
    Join Date: Jan 2009

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    The level controls need to be in the circuit, if you bypass or remove these, you will have to alter the design accordingly to compensate. Don't ask me how, as I didn't measure the L-Pads, just leave them in circuit and you will be fine.
    It’s not difficult to measure the L-pads and they can be replaced by two resistors (you might need more than two to get exactly the right values). If one does measure them the pots can be seen to be less than ideally matched and do not present an even impedance. Of course, once they are bypassed it doesn’t allow you to adjust them so easily.
    Last edited by YNWaN; 06-01-2018 at 16:43.
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  8. #268
    Join Date: Apr 2012

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    That's correct. 'L' pads have an insertion loss. Their bypass or removal adds a couple of db or so to the output of each affected driver. Without correction, this would be output over and above what would be achieved at max 'L' pad setting. So probably resulting in a very bright, forward sound (nasty).
    Last edited by walpurgis; 06-01-2018 at 16:22.

  9. #269
    Join Date: Jan 2013

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    Quote Originally Posted by walpurgis View Post
    That's correct. 'L' pads have an insertion loss. Their bypass or removal adds a couple of db or so to the output of each affected driver. Without correction, this would be output over and above what would be achieved at max 'L' pad setting. So probably resulting in a very bright, forward sound (nasty).
    Yes, this is what I was getting at.

  10. #270
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    Quote Originally Posted by StanleyB View Post
    The NS1000M was produced over several decades, and I have always questioned the frequency response between the earlier and later versions.
    As far as I am aware, the design/components never changed, so the response should have been the same throughout its production life.
    Never seen anything to suggest otherwise.

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