Rip off British Hi-Fi Industry

[Mike]

http://www.homehifi.co.uk/main/main.html

HTH

And currently it's being used in my system,making a Perpetual Technologies DAC and upsampler redundant.

Ahh! Right, I see, I've seen that before and now I know why there's a new version every other week or so!

[Marco]

Tell him to sell it on ebay - forget the dealers, they screwed him the last time.

What are you like?

Not every bugger wants to buy their hi-fi from Fleabay!

Marco.

[WikiBoy]

Hi Richard,

You say it as you see it and I like that, don't get me wrong I am not against ebay. I myself have sold hundreds of hifi related items on ebay to all corners of the globe (username "matodono1").

Not only that but I have helped a number of my web clients market on ebay including a stonemason client of mine trying to sell gravestones (which almost succeeded if you can believe that).

Arthur K of the funk firm has sold loads of Achromats and Achroplats on ebay with listings that I designed, but that is as far as he can go. If he starts selling TT's direct he risks losing all of his dealers.

Unfortunately most people who spend more than £500 on a hifi product want to try before they buy and for that you need dealers. Selling new and unknown products on the internet (even if they are backed by positive reviews) is a big ask.

So the dealers are needed and ebay and dealers don't mix.

If your experience is different then I am all ears as I don't wish to miss any marketing tricks.

Thanks again,

Matt.

It is all in the archives.

The future IMO is web, forum, bakeoff, customer / enthusiast based. Retailers are dying ducks and anything dying will try to protect its territory during its death throws.

It is not there yet but this current recession should accelerate it.

Arthur should bite the bullet and go direct, what is the point in trying to compete with Linn BS and their dealers NLP, they are dying and will strike out at anything to protect themselves (as I understand he is experiencing). Start now and he can grow with the new way.

[WikiBoy]

What are you like?

Not every bugger wants to buy their hi-fi from Fleabay!

Marco.

You know perfectly well ebay is a channel not the principle.

It is the principle I am pushing, ebay will have to change to meet customer asperations, and it seems it sees this and is changing. It is a very convenient and easy channel at the moment but if you want more work then do it via your own website and make the promotion and marketing *customer* based as opposed to retailer based. Price is premium during recession.

You know it makes sense.

[WikiBoy]

BUMP!

Come on anyone not voted yet.

Yer read the argument, you have your own experience so

It is running neck and neck *you* can decide the outcome

[Steve Toy]

I'd certainly like better channels than Fleabay. We need dealers and they need to be good by adding value.

I'd certainly like to be rid of the box-shifty dealers.

[Marco]

In some ways it undoubtedly makes sense, Richard, but it's by no means a universal panacea for manufacturers selling their products.

There is without doubt still a place for good knowledgeable dealers who know their (carefully selected) product range inside out and who can thus offer customers excellent advice and service. Trust me, places like this do exist!

You'll love this (not), but it's my belief that Ebay buying is responsible for why many people are unhappy with their hi-fi systems, and are constantly changing their equipment, chasing 'audiophile nirvana'. There is a lot of dissatisfaction out there amongst hi-fi enthusiasts, which is obvious from reading various forums, and it's because people are seeking a 'quick fix' as cheaply as possible. Well, unfortunately, it's not always as simple that!

Assembling a synergistically-matched musically rewarding hi-fi system is not just a matter of buying equipment cheaply from Ebay and flinging it together hoping that it will work - it's about knowing what components synergise musically with each other, and what cables, stands, and any other essential ancillaries bring out the best in those components to make a system work. Furthermore, it's about knowing how to set it all up correctly to ensure everything performs as it should do.

The fact is that a good dealer (such as I have described above) is in many cases much more able to carry out the above effectively than someone who doesn't have the necessary knowledge and experience, and this quite rightly reflects the premium you pay for such service and expertise. Don't get me wrong, the ones that actually offer this type of service are sadly in the minority, as so many will sell you anything and just see you as a pound sign, but good dealers do exist and they are more numerous than you think.

Remember also that many people enjoy the facility of being able to listen to equipment at a dealer’s premises, and then obtaining a home trial of said equipment, if it suggests promise when auditioned - all without being charged a penny first, before buying. This facility is quite normal for a customer once a rapport has been established with a particular dealer. In those circumstances it is indeed how I always do business, and I expect and have no problem with being charged for it.

The best things in life are worth taking time over. One could say buy in haste, repent at leisure...

Marco.

[Marco]

I'd certainly like to be rid of the box-shifty dealers.

Me too. They give everyone else a bad name and do bugger all to help genuine enthusiasts.

Marco.

[Filterlab]

...You'll love this (not), but it's my belief that Ebay buying is responsible for why many people are unhappy with their hi-fi systems, and are constantly changing their equipment, chasing 'audiophile nirvana'....

I have to agree with Marco here. I watch certain ebay selections (search criteria) quite a lot and I'm amazed at how many usernames I see and recognise as repeated buyers and sellers. I sold my Audiolab pre-amp some time ago and within 5 days it was back on sale, chap didn't like it and was going to try something else. Thing is if he'd have listened to it first he could have saved himself all the bother of buying and selling etc etc. I've known a few circumstances of that.

It's great if box swapping is a hobby (like Jerry's), but most audiophiles want a system they're happy with - and a dealer is the only way to experience that BEFORE parting with money.

Saying that I've bought a lot of hi-fi from ebay and it's a great place to find unusual equipment that one would probably have a hard time finding otherwise. However I've always listened before purchasing.

Richard I know you have your full moneyback guarantee which shows the faith you have in your products, but most manufactures and sellers don't offer this and so the risk increases that one will be unsatisfied in the long run.

I stand in both camps, I can see where Marco is coming from and I can certainly see where Richard is coming from - both have their merits. However with most folk (non-audiophiles) choosing convenience over outright quality, web purchasing makes a whole lot of sense.

[WikiBoy]

In some ways it undoubtedly makes sense, Richard, but it's by no means a universal panacea for manufacturers selling their products.

There is without doubt still a place for good knowledgeable dealers who know their (carefully selected) product range inside out and who can thus offer customers excellent advice and service. Trust me, places like this do exist!

You'll love this (not), but it's my belief that Ebay buying is responsible for why many people are unhappy with their hi-fi systems, and are constantly changing their equipment, chasing 'audiophile nirvana'. There is a lot of dissatisfaction out there amongst hi-fi enthusiasts, which is obvious from reading various forums, and it's because people are seeking a 'quick fix' as cheaply as possible. Well, unfortunately, it's not always as simple that!

Assembling a synergistically-matched musically rewarding hi-fi system is not just a matter of buying equipment cheaply from Ebay and flinging it together hoping that it will work - it's about knowing what components synergise musically with each other, and what cables, stands, and any other essential ancillaries bring out the best in those components to make a system work. Furthermore, it's about knowing how to set it all up correctly to ensure everything performs as it should do.

The fact is that a good dealer (such as I have described above) is in many cases much more able to carry out the above effectively than someone who doesn't have the necessary knowledge and experience, and this quite rightly reflects the premium you pay for such service and expertise. Don't get me wrong, the ones that actually offer this type of service are sadly in the minority, as so many will sell you anything and just see you as a pound sign, but good dealers do exist and they are more numerous than you think.

Remember also that many people enjoy the facility of being able to listen to equipment at a dealer’s premises, and then obtaining a home trial of said equipment, if it suggests promise when auditioned - all without being charged a penny first, before buying. This facility is quite normal for a customer once a rapport has been established with a particular dealer. In those circumstances it is indeed how I always do business, and I expect and have no problem with being charged for it.

The best things in life are worth taking time over. One could say buy in haste, repent at leisure...

Marco.

Sorry but this is complete and absolute nonsense. There are far more people who buy on ebay who have had far more opportunity to get a good system. Some of them even make a hobby out of the process like Jerry. You buy - you no like - you sell - in some case for loss in some for profit. It is just swings and roundabouts. Buy from a retailer and find it is a mistake and try to sell it and you will probably get half of what you paid for it - because that is its true value

Dealers no longer serve a purpose, they used to be a necessary evil but are slowly becoming redundant. You are stuck in the past Marco.

Service will be provided by manufacturers and choice will be a function of community. You are doing it here already, you are taking the function of retail and magazines in providing information and community. It is just a couple of steps further, steps that are being taken at wigwam and others will follow.

Who do you think will give you accurate information, an enthusiastic or not user, or retailer who hasn't had his daily slurp. It's a no brainer.