The modified SL-1200: understanding the dynamics of 'synergy'....

[chris@panteg]

Hi Marco

Yes , no problem

If you read my post further back , i have a found raising the arm height beneficial , its much better ! Though i still think it is just a tad exaggerated , just been listening to "My Room" off Still life ,which has some serious bass ! And I'm happy with the way it sounds now

The bland tonality , i think can be overcome with the right choice of cartridge , the AT is just something i tried on impulse and actually sounds pretty good for such a peanuts cartridge , all good fun and i should be praising it really .

Marco , i think if you can somehow get your act together with some needledrops of your own , i for one will be keen to hear them and contrary to what some might think , i feel my efforts do give a good representation of how my deck sounds at the moment , and i don't use any fancy soundcard or special cable.

[Beobloke]

The Funk Firm FX-R is another (albeit more expensive) candidate, which I honestly feel would piss all over ANY SME.

[Marco]

So you disagree? If so, don't be shy and say why!

Marco.

[prestonchipfryer]

Hi. I have used a SME M2-9 on my modded Technics (Mike New bearing, T/S power supply, SME V, Oyaide mat/weight. Currently using a 2M Black mm. I am very happy with the sound of this combination. At one time I had the TS bearing but on installing the MN bearing it was obviously vastly superior to the stock/TS bearing and makes the turntable so much better. When I changed from the M2 9 to the V there was no question that it was an improvement, but not as big as I expected, and certainly not 1500 quid or so extra that it costs over the M2. My point is that the M2 9 is indeed a fabulous arm and suits the Technics very well, so I would agree with Marco that it is a good choice. I have also used a Denon 103r and at one time I thought that the V took it well, however, mainly on reading about Marco's advice to use a headshell weight, intend to do just that and hope it improves the sound. I should add that my modded Technics is no way 'plummy' or 'lacklustre' in its sound. Would suggest to Chris that he invests in the MN bearing and be astounded at the improvement wrought.

Regards

John

[Marco]

Hi John,

At one time I had the TS bearing but on installing the MN bearing it was obviously vastly superior to the stock/TS bearing and makes the turntable so much better. When I changed from the M2 9 to the V there was no question that it was an improvement, but not as big as I expected, and certainly not 1500 quid or so extra that it costs over the M2. My point is that the M2 9 is indeed a fabulous arm and suits the Technics very well...

Thanks for that, and your experience is most interesting. The M2, quite simply, ticks all the right boxes for use on a Techy, but the problem as I see it is threefold:

1) SME dealers, keen to secure the most profit, will unlikely encourage potential customers on a budget to buy it when they can instead sell them a 309.

2) Potential SME customers, on a budget, unfamiliar with just how good the M2 is, will generally ignore it in favour of the 309, often because the latter looks 'sexier' and is considered as a 'proper' SME tonearm.

3) SME themselves don't go out of their way to promote the Series M2, and so it's not largely showcased in the public domain.

However, the question that begs to be asked is that if the improvement between a Series M2 and a Series V isn't dramatic, then what is the likely difference in improvement between an M2 and a 309?

In my view, the Series M2 is where the real 'SPPV' lives in the SME range (and the new version of the 3012, above it), but it seems to be largely the preserve of 'those in the know'............ And the Japanese certainly come into that category.

I think it's time the fact that the M2 is a hidden gem was 'outed'!

Marco.

[prestonchipfryer]

1) SME dealers, keen to secure the most profit, will unlikely encourage potential customers, on a budget, to buy it, when they can instead sell them a 309.

2) Potential SME customers, on a budget, unfamiliar with just how good the M2 is, will generally ignore it in favour of the 309, often because the latter looks 'sexier' and is considered as a 'proper' SME tonearm.

3) SME themselves don't go out of their way to promote the Series M2, and so it's not largely showcased in the public domain.

However, the question that begs to be answered is that if the improvement between a Series M2 and a Series V isn't dramatic, then what is the difference between an M2 and a 309?

In my view, the Series M2 is where the real 'SPPV' is in the SME range (and the new version of the 3012, above it), but it seems to be largely the preserve of 'those in the know'............ And the Japanese certainly come into that category.

I think it's time the fact that the M2 is a hidden gem was 'outed'!

Marco.

Yes I would say that SME would prefer to sell 309's, IV and V's, it's more lucrative for them, but of course this is business and no bad thing when you know that their customer service is A1. Also the M2's have a detachable headshell, which is not the easiest to change, but a definite plus for those (like me) who *play* around with different carts; the headshell is not cheap (at £100+) but still a lovely piece of engineering. As for looking 'sexier', then yes the 309 onwards probably do. It seems (to me) nonsensical to 'tart-up' some other well known arm when the M2 has so much going for it.

Regards

John

[Marco]

Yes I would say that SME would prefer to sell 309's, IV and V's, it's more lucrative for them, but of course this is business and no bad thing when you know that their customer service is A1.

Sure, I get that, and SME's customer service is undoubtedly superb. However, a good dealer should always advise on what's in the best interests of his customers, and not always his profit margin

As a businessman myself, I know that if you successfully attend to the former, the latter will usually take care of itself....

Also the M2's have a detachable headshell...

Yup, and so do 309s...

It seems (to me) nonsensical to 'tart-up' some other well known arm when the M2 has so much going for it.

Indeed. However, just for clarity, which other "well known arm" are you referring to?

Marco.

[Beobloke]

I think it's time the fact that the M2 is a hidden gem was 'outed'!

Marco.

Now that I am happy to come right out and agree with! I have long been of the personal opinion that the M2-9 is a better arm than the 309.

[Marco]

Good! I of course agree.

So tell us now why you think an FX-R is sonically inferior to, say, an SME IV or V? And no, Adam, I'm not going to let you wriggle out of this one!

Marco.

[prestonchipfryer]

Indeed. However, just for clarity, which other "well known arm" are you referring to?

Marco.

Well okay, you know it's the Rega arms. Not saying they are bad or good - it's a personal thing really, as I don't like them. Don't like the headshell arrangement, no standard VTA adjustment (yes I know there are after-market products), but not for me.

John