Calling all SL-1200/1210 owners!

[Marco]

Thanks, John, but it's cool now since I've fitted the new 18g Audio Techinca headshell (see the 'Headshell Rolling' thread). The extra mass has moved the goalposts somewhat, so the C/W is now nicely butted up against the pivot point using the two main weights

Did you ever hear from your man on the boat, btw? If you've got any news on that front pop me a PM

Marco.

[thrunobulaxx]

Hi Marco, thats a good outcome then, just as well we didnt alter it after all.
When are you going to update your avatar then

Havn`t seen the sailor in a long time, i guess he`s voyaging somewhere. sometimes i dont hear from for years at a time and just when i think i wont see him again he pops up.

[Marco]

No worries mate. He'll turn up one day I'm sure. What I'm trying to do is to get hold of the old Mana forum database so we can add it to here. There are loads of guys who used to post there that I'm sure would be interested in AOS

Kevin must still have it somewhere I reckon.

Yes I must update my avatar. I could also do with some new system pics. I'll need to wait until Steve or someone else comes along with a digital camera, though!

Btw, just to run something past you quickly, would you be able to fit other tonearms to an SL-1210 just like Johnnie does?

It's far from definite yet, in fact I'm just toying with the idea, but apparently Pro-ject are thinking of importing high-mass 9" and 12" Ortofon tonearms with detachable headshells into the UK and I thought that I might try one on the 1210 and compare it to the Technics arm.

Marco.

[thrunobulaxx]

No worries mate. He'll turn up one day I'm sure. What I'm trying to do is to get hold of the old Mana forum database so we can add it to here. There are loads of guys who used to post there that I'm sure would be interested in AOS

Kevin must still have it somewhere I reckon.

Yes I must update my avatar. I could also do with some new system pics. I'll need to wait until Steve or someone else comes along with a digital camera, though!

Btw, just to run something past you quickly, would you be able to fit other tonearms to an SL-1210 just like Johnnie does?

It's far from definite yet, in fact I'm just toying with the idea, but apparently Pro-ject are thinking of importing high-mass 9" and 12" Ortofon tonearms with detachable headshells into the UK and I thought that I might try one on the 1210 and compare it to the Technics arm.

Marco.

Last time i saw him he was done with technology, so not so shure he has still got files, if he emails ata ll i will ask.

As for the technics question, i just recently made a armboard for "i should coco" on the wam, he has got himself a slate plinth and base and wanted a peculiar shaped armboard with cut out to mount an SME arm to fit the slate.
I`m shure he wont mind my posting a pic of it, you can see his plinth here.
http://www.hifiwigwam.com/view_topic...475306#p475306.

This is his board posted off today.



So anything is prolly possible.

[Marco]

Wow, that's a nice piece of metal-ito, amigo!

I doubt that was a quick 5 mins cut and buff job!

Good news about the arm. I'll be in touch if I need your services.

Marco.

[Peter Stockwell]

With Mucho Thanks to John and his Garden shed I've got one of dem shiny Three part Counterweights.

Those weights make a significant difference in bass performance of the Technics tonearm. The coffee table that sits in front of the sofa really rocks now.

I don't think that I’ve got everything adjusted right. I recently bought “Jim” from Jamie Liddell; it’s interesting because the drummer plays bass pedals at the same time as playing the drums. Yes, downright weird! Well, the bass pedals come across just fine. But, I can’t help feeling I’ve lost some top to bottom integrity in the sound and that the timing has gone off.

I think the extra counterweight mass has given a more stable platform for the cartridge, but the 1.8g tracking that I have been using for the mystery Grado is now too much, and I need to back off tracking weight.

John has already suggested that I should be using the big weight closest to the arm pivot.

What do you think?

[Marco]

Hi Peter,

I would first of all try what John has suggested, and also back off the VTF and set it to the minimum of the manufacturer's recommendation, perhaps even less if it works. If that doesn't fix it, it could be that you've got too much mass on the arm. I had a feeling that might be the case with the Grado. You need a decent MC to take full advantage of the brass C/W & Sumiko combination.

If it's the case you've got too much mass, in the short term, try using just the main C/W (if you can balance out your cartridge that way) and/or if possible using lighter screws/Allen bolts, etc, on your headshell. This should help reduce the arm's 'effective' mass to suit the Grado better.

Long term, you need to decide if the Grado is going to be your cartridge of choice, and if so, I'd return your C/W to John for him to shave off a few grams. If you're going to be using an MC in the near future I'd leave as is because I think the results you're getting will be entirely different with an MC at the helm.

Let us know how you get on

Marco.

[scoobs]

Peter
Glad to hear you're getting genuine results, not that we ever doubted it.
John is right, you need the greatest bulk of the weight (the big one) right up against the little stopper lug, and then use the smaller ones to fine tune the balance, if you have one, you may want to use the standard aux weight that screws into the back of the stub, this will give you even greater flexibilty. It does take a bit longer to nail the VTF, but the aching back will subside and you'll be rewarded big time.

[Peter Stockwell]

Hi Peter,

I would first of all try what John has suggested, and also back off the VTF and set it to the minimum of the manufacturer's recommendation, perhaps even less if it works.

I was going to back off some but not all the way to the min of the cartridge range. I don't actually know what that is, because I can't identify the cartridge. It was certainly only just out of the budget range in it's day, IIRC.

It could be that you've got too much mass on the arm...You need a decent MC to take full advantage of the brass C/W & Sumiko combination.

try using just the main C/W (if you can balance out your cartridge that way) and/or if possible using lighter screws/Allen bolts, etc, on your headshell. This should help reduce the arm's 'effective' mass to suit the Grado better.

I've been thinking that I had too much VTF, but the hints that you and John have thrown up will give me some room to move.

Long term, you need to decide if the Grado is going to be your cartridge of choice, and if so, I'd return your C/W to John for him to shave off a few grams. If you're going to be using an MC in the near future I'd leave as is because I think the results you're getting will be entirely different with an MC at the helm.

Can't bring myself to go down the MC route, don't want to go to the trouble of fancy MC phono stage and/or Step up devices. I'm convinced there's a suitable MM cartridge out there. I have a Nagaoka MP11 boron that's next up to bat, but there's a few others I want to try before deciding. I've been with Grados for almost 10 years. I also had a couple back in the day. I've got two Sumiko HS-12 now so I can do back to back comparisons relatively easily.

You need the greatest bulk of the weight (the big one) right up against the little stopper lug, and then use the smaller ones to fine tune the balance, if you have one, you may want to use the standard aux weight that screws into the back of the stub, this will give you even greater flexibilty. It does take a bit longer to nail the VTF, but the aching back will subside and you'll be rewarded big time.

What do you mean by the little stopper lug, is it what stops the C/W getting any closer to the pivot, or are you talking about the little plastic guide that serves to locate the standard weight ?

I had been using the aux weight before John's C/W came to town. Marco, maybe rightly, thinks that I've already got to much mass. The extra Sumiko mass and aux weight were good, perhaps Johns brass is too much, but I'm really inclined to think that this extra weight means that the cartridge does not have to be "sat" on so much. I'm going to take the VTF down to 1.5g, maybe 1.4g and give it a try. I reckon I can manage that tonight.

thanks for the input

Going away soon, so not much time to sort it. This C/W sounds like one of those mods where other adjustments have to be made.

[thrunobulaxx]

As i dont use the arm and have never actually seen one of these C/W`s on one, in the flesh, it ended up as a 3 piece affair for the flexibility after consutations with several users to take into account the different H/shells ? carts used and have a "one size fits all C/W, as fine tuning without having the whole thing in your hands is impossible.

i dont think its a case of too much mass in the C/W overall, just a matter of tuning it using the combinations possible, and it does not have to be right up to the stop if you cant balance it out using one of the combinations, but from the feedback i got it does seems preferable.

But when you think about it, very few tonearms have C/W`s that do butt right up when the manufacturers recomendation re VTF is set, in fact i fine tuned my own C/W to match the cart i`m using by gradually skimming it down untill it did go as far forword as possible this took many trips back and forth to the garage (not shed peter)

If at some point you feel that you do need it reducing, i can just send over another piece the required mass to swop over one of them, no need to go shipping it back and forth across the channel.

From your vid this morning i think you should try setting the cart with a stevensen, i know they do hang out a bit when set properly but that did look very far out