Any Denon 103 fans here? I have one on the way to me...

[blake]

Barry, Marco: As the cartridge I sent off to Soundsmith had 1000 hours on it and I already had another in use with minimal hours, I wasn't really that concerned.

Nonetheless, I did share your trepidation with respect to going to the line contact stylus and losing that "Denon" or conical stylus magic.

I'll admit that with a small minority of recordings (maybe 10 per cent) the increased high frequency extension with the line contact can tilt the tonal balance up a bit and be a bit excessive. In that sense, the conical stylus is "more forgiving" of less than stellar recordings; you'll get no argument from me there.

But on the vast majority of recordings the LC'd Denon simply sounds significantly better through the midband and lower frequencies as well. Ironically, though, it is most notable in the midband where, on many recordings, the line contact stylus simply reveals information that the conical is not just presenting with "less detail" but missing entirely. The LC has an ability to unravel complex passages and not get bogged down or congested which, once you've heard the LC you realize the Denon conical is doing in full force.

And, as I said, all of this happens without the loss of the musicality and overall coherence that many users value with the Denons. Provided, of course, you get the setup right and, as much as it needs to be "right" with the conical, the LC is even more unforgiving of improper setup with respect to VTA and VTF.

Do it! You will not be disappointed!

[Marco]

Hi Blake,

Thanks for the added info - like I said, I'll give your recommendation some consideration in due course

I'll admit that with a small minority of recordings (maybe 10 per cent) the increased high frequency extension with the line contact can tilt the tonal balance up a bit and be a bit excessive.

Ah, so there is a downside after all?

That's rather important, and for me would cause problems with a significant part of my music collection on vinyl, as a lot of it is rock/pop music which are not exactly 'high-fidelity' recordings. Therefore, for me, the percentage is likely to be more like 70%.

In that respect, I think the type of music one listens to must therefore also be taken into consideration. I'm not saying you are, but I'm certainly not someone who listens almost exclusively to audiophile recordings of jazz/classical or female vocalists.........

Incidentally, what T/T, tonearm, phono stage and preamp are you using with your 103? Forgive me if I've missed you mentioning this somewhere else before.

Marco.

P.S Barry, that sounds like a plan

[blake]

Hi Marco: I don't do much in the audiophile weenie recording stuff. My main interests are hardbop jazz from the '55 to '65 period and blues and rock from the '67 to late 70's time period. That would comprise about 95% of my collection and listening.

I'm using a Michell Gyrodec with a Jelco 750D with a custom ebony and carbon fibre headshell and running fully balanced from cartridge into an Aqvox phono stage and from there balanced to a Jungson integrated amplifier. Speakers are Elipson 1313's.

I would say that fully 90% of what I listen to sounds significantly and outrageously better using the line contact stylus and the remaining 10% sounds quite abit better with the caveat that the LC stylus shows up some of the short comings of the recording engineer at those sessions not quite getting things right, mainly with respect to tonal balance. Even within those less than stellar recordings there is, generally speaking, a fair bit of improvement. I'm doing a bit of nitpicking to try not to mislead you

Nothing's perfect, but those are numbers that I can live with. I have another wood bodied Denon here with the stock stylus with 400 or 500 hours on it. Do I ever think of putting it back on (I even have a stock Jelco headshell I could mount it to for easy switches)? Never.

But I will be sending it off to Soundsmith at some point.

[horace]

By way of a small bonus, it transpires that my OC9 is not dead...

It was merely very, very filthy.

I've cleaned the stylus and it sounds fine again.

But I prefer the Denon! It has a certain robust joie de vivre about it.

Happy ending - and I have the OC9 as a spare.



Martin

[jandl100]

But I prefer the Denon! It has a certain robust joie de vivre about it.



Martin

Spot on, Martin - the Denon 103's make music both interesting & fun!

.... now all you need is a Technics 1210 tt!

....... and why not sell the OC9? - a spot of spare cash to buy yourself an Eva2 passive pre.

[horace]

Spot on, Martin - the Denon 103's make music both interesting & fun!

.... now all you need is a Technics 1210 tt!

....... and why not sell the OC9? - a spot of spare cash to buy yourself an Eva2 passive pre.

Aha! A cunning plan indeed....

Cheers

Martin

[DSJR]

There's a chap in Germany who does superb retips at a fraction of the cost of Soundsmith. Axel is especially good on the classic B&O carts and restored the saphire cantilever/diamond stylus of an MMC20CL to a result at least as good as the original. With regard to the Denon, I suspect an HE or current Shibata stylus/cantilever may be possible with great results..

http://www.schallplattennadeln.de/

It's in German, and you'll have to drill into the MC Systeme and then Denon, after which you can translate (Axel types good English on emails...)

Well worth a try.

[blake]

There's a chap in Germany who does superb retips at a fraction of the cost of Soundsmith. Axel is especially good on the classic B&O carts and restored the saphire cantilever/diamond stylus of an MMC20CL to a result at least as good as the original. With regard to the Denon, I suspect an HE or current Shibata stylus/cantilever may be possible with great results..

http://www.schallplattennadeln.de/

It's in German, and you'll have to drill into the MC Systeme and then Denon, after which you can translate (Axel types good English on emails...)

Well worth a try.

I've heard good things about this retipper as well but "fraction of the price"? Unless I'm missing something, on the closest apples to apples comparison, the above vendor's price on a shibata stylus with a born cantilever is 265 Euros or $338 U.S. at current conversion vs. $250 for the LC/ruby cantilever at Soundsmith.

I didn't do the math on the lower end retips but Soundsmith will do an elliptical stylus on an aluminum cantilever for $150 which I would expect to be very close to the schallplattennadeln price for a similar retip as well.

I've also heard very good things about Expert Stylus' paratrace retip on the Denon. Not sure of the price but would expect it would be in the range listed above as well.

The big drawback with Soundsmith is the wait. You will be without a cartridge unless you have a back up for 3-4 months.

[DSJR]

EsCo take ages now as well - victims of their success.

This latter re-builder do fantastic things to Troika's, both for me decades ago and recently too. I have an AT OC30 minus its diamond that sounds more like the 33PTG (a bit more powerful in the bass), and shall have it done when funds and turntable permit.

[kcc123]

I remember 2 years ago, it only took 3-4 weeks for the re-tip from Soundsmith, but three months from Garrott Brothers (Decibel Hi Fi) to return the cartridge. The retipping time from Van Den Hul a few years ago was not too bad, though the cost is very expensive now.