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Thread: Could this be a 'giant-killing' tonearm cable?

  1. #301
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    Incidentally, I asked Yannis for his views on the comparison between the SPD-4 and the 423.5 Phono Litz. This is what he wrote:

    Regarding the comparison between the standard 423.5Phono-Litz and the SPD-4:

    I consider the SPD-4 to be less “edgy” than the 423.5Phono Litz. Its balance is focussed more in the Mid-range rather than the upper frequencies. I think that both cables are quite analytical in both width and depth expanding the entire sound stage but the SPD-4 is “full” and well rounded. As I mentioned earlier, I would expect the SPD-4 to have very similar characteristics with the ones you observed with your version of the 423.5Phono-Litz. So after giving such a review on the 423.5Phono-Litz I am not sure what to expect from the SPD-4. Again, their price is not an indication of performance but a direct reflection of materials/parts and labour.

    However, the SPD-4 “technically” has a superior construction adding variable conductor gauge between “send” and “return”, variable strand gauge within the same conductor for lower electro-mechanical resonance due to the elimination of strand multiplicity, and additional shielding features. As I have explained, the SPD-4 was developed to be a Hybrid design (and this would imply different characteristics). However, yours (and Andy's) versions are pure silver, so the result will be quite different than what it was initially designed for.

    In other words the Hybrid SPD-4 would be a very musical and relaxed cable (with some added colours that make it more pleasing rather than offering a cold reproduction of the recording) as a result of the inclusion of copper and Mundorf silver/gold; but the Silver SPD-4 is likely to be faster and more analytical.

    Also note that the SPD-4 uses dual shielding: a highly conductive copper and nickel coated fibre mesh which is placed between the inner insulation and the outer shield. The outer shield is a high density silver plated copper braid with 97% optical coverage (same as the one in your 423.5Phono-Litz).
    Interesting... It should certainly make for an intriguing comparison!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  2. #302
    MartinT Guest

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    Indeed, Marco, the ranking order is not a foregone conclusion. Should you find the SPD-4 not to be as good as the 'special' 423.5 Phono Litz, I wouldn't be at all disappointed ordering the latter based on what I heard when you brought it round.

    How is the bass now that you've given it a good running in?

  3. #303
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

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    No problems at all, Martin - tight, tuneful and extended; really just what's on the recording, which is all one can ask of a tonearm cable (or any cable, for that matter).

    However, it's the sheer amounts of detail it pulls out of the mix, which I find astonishing (in comparison with any other tonearm cable I've used), but with a complete lack of grain or 'edge'!

    It'll be very interesting to see if the SPD-4 can improve upon those traits and/or add any enviable ones of its own.

    Btw, what are you doing about those heavy metal plugs on the TQ cables, connecting your SUT to your phono stage? I'm convinced that you're only hearing about 85% of what the cable is capable of. Fitting WBT 0110Ag or Eichmann silver Bullet RCAs, would sort that out

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  4. #304
    Join Date: Apr 2011

    Location: Surrey

    Posts: 4,157
    I'm Mike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Btw, what are you doing about those heavy metal plugs on the TQ cables, connecting your SUT to your phono stage? I'm convinced that you're only hearing about 85% of what the cable is capable of. Fitting WBT 0110Ag or Eichmann silver Bullet RCAs, would sort that out

    Marco.
    Unless we find a way of super heat soldering we're stuck aren't we ?
    TAD CD / DAC / Pre, Technics 1210, MCRU PSU, Mike New Bearing & Platter, Stillpoints LP1 weight, Speedy Steve Ebony armboard, Fidelity Research FR64FX arm, Ortofon SPU. Aurorasound VIDA Phono Pre Amp, TAD Power Amp, TAD E1 speakers. Coherent RTZ 3 Grounding box, Coherent grounding cables, Creaktiv racks. Coherent Mains Cables. SR Blue Fuse. Interconnects : Coherent and Yannis 223.5 Connect Litz. Coherent speaker cable. Audio Magic Transcendence Conditioner. Coherent mains socket. Mains Filters : , PS Audio Harvesters, Russ Andrews Purifiers, Tacima, Vertex. Black Ravioli and RDC supports. Electric Beach S1NX platforms for TAD CD and Technics. Ferrite chokes everywhere except the above. Ears, brain

    Mike

  5. #305
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Hi Mike,

    It'd be a return job to the manufacturer. Martin was going to speak with Colin about it.

    It's not an issue, though, if you're happy with how the cables sound 'as is', and they do indeed sound very good, but I believe that there is still more to come, with better plugs fitted

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  6. #306
    MartinT Guest

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Btw, what are you doing about those heavy metal plugs on the TQ cables, connecting your SUT to your phono stage? I'm convinced that you're only hearing about 85% of what the cable is capable of. Fitting WBT 0110Ag or Eichmann silver Bullet RCAs, would sort that out
    Already on the case, Marco. I've asked Divine Audio to request a new one from TQ with better plugs.

  7. #307
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Nice one, Martin. If you could retain your existing cables, for comparison, that would be interesting!

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

  8. #308
    Join Date: Apr 2011

    Location: Surrey

    Posts: 4,157
    I'm Mike.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MartinT View Post
    Already on the case, Marco. I've asked Divine Audio to request a new one from TQ with better plugs.
    How does that work ?
    Can you swap or do you have to buy another ?
    TAD CD / DAC / Pre, Technics 1210, MCRU PSU, Mike New Bearing & Platter, Stillpoints LP1 weight, Speedy Steve Ebony armboard, Fidelity Research FR64FX arm, Ortofon SPU. Aurorasound VIDA Phono Pre Amp, TAD Power Amp, TAD E1 speakers. Coherent RTZ 3 Grounding box, Coherent grounding cables, Creaktiv racks. Coherent Mains Cables. SR Blue Fuse. Interconnects : Coherent and Yannis 223.5 Connect Litz. Coherent speaker cable. Audio Magic Transcendence Conditioner. Coherent mains socket. Mains Filters : , PS Audio Harvesters, Russ Andrews Purifiers, Tacima, Vertex. Black Ravioli and RDC supports. Electric Beach S1NX platforms for TAD CD and Technics. Ferrite chokes everywhere except the above. Ears, brain

    Mike

  9. #309
    Join Date: Apr 2011

    Location: Surrey

    Posts: 4,157
    I'm Mike.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Hi Mike,

    if you're happy with how the cables sound 'as is', and they do sound very good, but I believe that there is still more to come, with better plugs fitted

    Marco.
    Hey !
    Have you forgotten where you are or summat ?
    TAD CD / DAC / Pre, Technics 1210, MCRU PSU, Mike New Bearing & Platter, Stillpoints LP1 weight, Speedy Steve Ebony armboard, Fidelity Research FR64FX arm, Ortofon SPU. Aurorasound VIDA Phono Pre Amp, TAD Power Amp, TAD E1 speakers. Coherent RTZ 3 Grounding box, Coherent grounding cables, Creaktiv racks. Coherent Mains Cables. SR Blue Fuse. Interconnects : Coherent and Yannis 223.5 Connect Litz. Coherent speaker cable. Audio Magic Transcendence Conditioner. Coherent mains socket. Mains Filters : , PS Audio Harvesters, Russ Andrews Purifiers, Tacima, Vertex. Black Ravioli and RDC supports. Electric Beach S1NX platforms for TAD CD and Technics. Ferrite chokes everywhere except the above. Ears, brain

    Mike

  10. #310
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,994
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Soz, you've lost me there, matey....

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & regulator mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat with Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight. Isonoe feet & boots. Ortofon RS-212D tonearm with Denon DL-103GL in a Denon PCL-300 headshell, fitted with Funk Firm Houdini and Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp and Denon AU-310 SUT.

    Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.

    CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.

    Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.

    Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp, fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.

    Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.

    Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.

    Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.

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