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Thread: Industry Insiders And Their Nonsense

  1. #1
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,932
    I'm Martin.

    Default Industry Insiders And Their Nonsense

    I'm not entirely sure when it was that I bought my first Hi-fi magazine but I think it must have been about 1989

    I already had a system bought from Richer Sounds and was looking to upgrade so I got a copy of What Hi-Fi (AKA 'WTF?') in the hope of getting some guidance.

    (I didn't and in the end I randomly bought some giant speakers from the 8 page 'Hyper-Fi' advert in the middle of the magazine, but that's a different story).

    I carried on buying magazines, mostly Hi-Fi Review, Choice, Hi-Fi World up until about 2014 when I realised it was an expensive way to just read one speaker review and skip past all the cable reviews and adverts.

    Now in 1989 I was a youth of twenty and knew nothing about pretty much everything. I'm not sure when I had the realisation that the magazines were not intended to serve the potential customer with useful consumer advice, but to serve the hi-fi industry by ensuring a constant supply of punters, but I suspect to my chagrin that I was in my late thirties when the penny dropped.

    Now of course it is all on-line but the more things change, the more they stay the same.

    Take, for example, this fairly brief article from Enjoy The Music (dot com) - https://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazi...The_Future.htm

    It's a great example of just why these sites are not a good source of impartial advice

    The topic is essentially the age-old editorial about how 'The Industry Is Dying.' Well they used to do articles about this back in the 1980s. Like Hyman Roth in 'Godfather II' the hi-fi industry has been dying from the same heart-attack for the last forty years.

    The writer is concerned that the rise in interest rates will mean young people won't have the money to move out of their parents house and into their own house, and so will never graduate from using smartphones and headphones as their source for listening to music. No more customers for the 'High-end'.

    Oh dear, how sad. So what?

    Well he tackles that question and it's quite revealing:

    ''Simple: Audiophiles and members of the industry that serves us (count me on both sides here) have long been concerned about the fate of our hobby.''

    Okay so back up a minute. The hi-fi 'industry' exists to serve us? That's funny, I thought that, like any company, a hi-fi company's purpose is to make money for their shareholders. Of course he knows that, he just doesn't want us to think that.

    We (or at least a good many of us) therefore thought "Aha! Every kid has a cellphone; every kid loves music; every kid will get "get into" good sound through his cell phone; and at least a majority of those kids will go on to wanting good sound at home. Voila! A new "us" and an ongoing market for our industry
    .

    Again 'Our industry'. Whose industry now? I make a living in the motor trade, mate, hi-fi isn't 'my' industry nor is it likely to be the industry of 99.999 percent of the people reading your article, given it's an industry that employs comparatively few people. You've got problems finding punters for expensive tat, talk to your marketing department, it's nothing to do with us.

    So yes, he's worried that in 10 years or whatever there'll be no-one interested in spending big money on hi-fi. The usual story we've been hearing for half a century. Why is it this time?

    ''not only do younger people tend to have less money than older ones, but they also tend to live in different places: Depending on their age, they may still be living "at home", with their parents. Or they may be in school, grad school, or working at whatever kind of job. Whatever their circumstances, though, it's likely that they're not going to be living in their own house, but in a room or an apartment, not only limited in space to set up a system or a listening room, but also subject to restrictions on how loud and when they can play their music.''

    But wait a minute! I had the box room at my parents house, tiny room, still had a hi-fi system in there. Then went to University and lived in a little breeze-block cell for three years - still had a hifi system in there. Then to a box room in a shared house - still had a hi-fi system there too, with big speakers. Err.. the trick is just not to play it so loud.

    And as for money - I was as poor as a church mouse but you could always get discounted bin-end kit and second hand kit if you wanted a change or an upgrade on a tight budget. And I still managed to get a mortgage somehow anyway.

    Really I'm fed up with reading about things being difficult financially for young people. It was always that way unless your parents were loaded.

    What he's really worried about is that these youngsters are never going to be in a position to buy expensive hi-fi. Because that's where the big margins are.

    Well you can't blame them for trying I suppose. But how about making some good affordable products and writing about them. Or writing about second-hand bargains instead of reviews of ten grand streamers, cables and other expensive, magic-powered nonsense that surely has the effect of putting off impecunious youngsters looking at getting into the hobby?

    Industry Insiders Bollocks. Self-serving and - ultimately - counter-productive.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  2. #2
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    probably all true mate.. luxury products look good in glossies, and are paid for mostly by the product placement, not the selling of mags. if it were with the buying of mags, there would be a topless bint carressing each speaker
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
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    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

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  3. #3
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 32,042
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

    Default

    All true. I haven't read a 'Hi-Fi' magazine for at least 15 years. I got fed up with the likes of Ken Kessler or Michael Fremer raving about the latest "Veblen" product or of the latest hi-fi audio fad.

    Back in the '80s Kessler did point out that some vintage equipment around at the time was still very good and could then be bought relatively cheaply, but he long abandoned the bargain basement, preferring to salivate over stupidly-expensive 'high end' audio products.
    Barry

  4. #4
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,932
    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    All true. I haven't read a 'Hi-Fi' magazine for at least 15 years. I got fed up with the likes of Ken Kessler or Michael Fremer raving about the latest "Veblen" product or of the latest hi-fi audio fad.

    Back in the '80s Kessler did point out that some vintage equipment around at the time was still very good and could then be bought relatively cheaply, but he long abandoned the bargain basement, preferring to salivate over stupidly-expensive 'high end' audio products.
    Kessler is a good example actually. He's another one who's confused as to the relationship between the industry and the punters and doesn't grasp that they are two separate things. Audio Research's (or insert some other high end company name here) financial woes might be a legitimate concern for him but they're not my problem.

    He's an entertaining writer and a proper enthusiast though so I forgive him even if he does talk bollocks almost the whole time.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  5. #5
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,741
    I'm Steve.

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    From back in the day when most birds were happy to have several knobs on the go... The British hifi press put a stop to all that, and advocated putting a beer mat under one of your sofa legs. That's progress for you.
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

    T/T: Inspire Monarch, X200 tonearm, Ortofon Quintet Blue. Phono: Project Tube Box CD: Marantz CD6006 (UK Edition); Amp: Musical Fidelity A5 Integrated.
    Speakers: Zu Omen Def, REL T9i subwoofer. Cables: Atlas Equator interconnects, Atlas Hyper 3.0 speaker cables

    T'other system:
    Echo Dot, Amptastic Mini One,Arcam A75 integrated, Celestion 5's, BK XLS-200 DF

    A/V:
    LG 55" OLED, Panasonic Blu Ray, Sony a/v amp, MA Radius speakers, REL Storm sub

    Forget the past, it's gone. And don't worry about the future, it doesn't exist. There is only NOW.

    KICKSTARTER: ENABLING SCAMMERS SINCE 2009

  6. #6
    Join Date: Apr 2009

    Location: Near Saffron Walden, Essex

    Posts: 7,090
    I'm Dave.

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    What worries me is that the newcomer to Hi-Fi buys a copy of Hi-Fi News, reads about nothing much except £10K cartridges, £80K speakers, £100K amps, £15K mains leads etc and thinks that is what you need to buy to get a Hi-Fi system. He then moves on to another hobby he can actually afford, not realising that so little of this obscenely priced, reviewed gear is actually sold and that a decent system can be bought for far less.

    I've always sold 'high end' along with reasonably priced equipment but I've been left behind with my top ranking equipment being £10-12K and that's now classed as mid price.

  7. #7
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: West of Scotland

    Posts: 4,735
    I'm Robin.

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    I stopped buying hifi magazines over 20 years ago, although I do go on line to view the record reviews in Hifi news
    Regards
    Robin

    .....................



    Acoustic Solid Wood MPX, Ortofon Quintet Bronze
    Pathos Classic Remix Amp, dac
    Cyrus Signature phono stage
    Eversolo DMP-A6
    Cyrus CD i
    ART Stiletto 6V3. Loudspeakers

  8. #8
    Join Date: May 2016

    Location: Notts

    Posts: 2,747
    I'm Geoff.

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    I read the occasional hifi magazine for free through my local library online services: Pressreader on Libby between them cover most of the main titles

  9. #9
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,741
    I'm Steve.

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    I get Hifi Choice and What Hifi every month, but only because my neighbour buys them and passes them over the fence when he's done. Takes me about half an hour to get through both of them.
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

    T/T: Inspire Monarch, X200 tonearm, Ortofon Quintet Blue. Phono: Project Tube Box CD: Marantz CD6006 (UK Edition); Amp: Musical Fidelity A5 Integrated.
    Speakers: Zu Omen Def, REL T9i subwoofer. Cables: Atlas Equator interconnects, Atlas Hyper 3.0 speaker cables

    T'other system:
    Echo Dot, Amptastic Mini One,Arcam A75 integrated, Celestion 5's, BK XLS-200 DF

    A/V:
    LG 55" OLED, Panasonic Blu Ray, Sony a/v amp, MA Radius speakers, REL Storm sub

    Forget the past, it's gone. And don't worry about the future, it doesn't exist. There is only NOW.

    KICKSTARTER: ENABLING SCAMMERS SINCE 2009

  10. #10
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,932
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by hifi_dave View Post
    What worries me is that the newcomer to Hi-Fi buys a copy of Hi-Fi News, reads about nothing much except £10K cartridges, £80K speakers, £100K amps, £15K mains leads etc and thinks that is what you need to buy to get a Hi-Fi system. He then moves on to another hobby he can actually afford, not realising that so little of this obscenely priced, reviewed gear is actually sold and that a decent system can be bought for far less.

    I've always sold 'high end' along with reasonably priced equipment but I've been left behind with my top ranking equipment being £10-12K and that's now classed as mid price.
    Exactly my point. I am guessing you had a lot of customers start with your cheapest equipment and then move up over the years?

    But if a potential first time buyer looked in your shop window and only saw the most expensive stuff they probably wouldn't bother to go in.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

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