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Thread: Major sound upgrade

  1. #21
    Join Date: Jun 2015

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    I'm Lawrence.

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    I found this on the Mission website, it's not quite what I thought.

    In traditional Mission style, the standmount LX-1 and LX2s tweeter is positioned below the mid/bass drive unit, in order to aid time-alignment. By placing the treble unit lower than ear level, the path length from the treble unit to the listener is longer than that of the mid/bass unit. As the treble unit dome is physically forward of the mid/bass unit cone, the difference in path length helps to equalise the acoustic distance.

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  2. #22
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

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    I'm Steve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lawrence001 View Post
    I found this on the Mission website, it's not quite what I thought.

    In traditional Mission style, the standmount LX-1 and LX2s tweeter is positioned below the mid/bass drive unit, in order to aid time-alignment. By placing the treble unit lower than ear level, the path length from the treble unit to the listener is longer than that of the mid/bass unit. As the treble unit dome is physically forward of the mid/bass unit cone, the difference in path length helps to equalise the acoustic distance.

    Sent from my BKL-L09 using Tapatalk
    It all sounds like a right load of tosh, or maybe it's just me being thick - it's making assumptions about stand height, seat height, how tall the listener is, and how gullible too.

    My step dad used to have a pair of these Missions, which he had on wall brackets high up on the wall, probably undoing all of Mission's R&D
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

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  3. #23
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Norfolk, UK

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    That reminds me of a chump I used to work with. His mate has in-ceiling speakers and they were apparently the best speakers in the world.

    I asked him if when he went to a concert the band were hanging from the ceiling of the stadium. He was completely stumped as to what I was talking about. Thick as two short planks that one.

  4. #24
    Join Date: Feb 2013

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    maybe he was high when listening
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  5. #25
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

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    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Filterlab View Post
    That reminds me of a chump I used to work with. His mate has in-ceiling speakers and they were apparently the best speakers in the world.

    I asked him if when he went to a concert the band were hanging from the ceiling of the stadium. He was completely stumped as to what I was talking about. Thick as two short planks that one.
    Probably still better than that crappy PA at the NEC. That hangs from the ceiling. Don't know if they still have it, last went there in about '96 and swore never again. Totally soulless venue and shit sound.
    Current Lash Up:

    *Audiolab 6000CDT* Topping E30 * Philips 22AH380 pre-amp * NAD C320BEE power amp * JM Lab Electra 926 *

  6. #26
    Join Date: Jun 2015

    Location: London/Durham

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    I'm Lawrence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigmy Pony View Post
    It all sounds like a right load of tosh, or maybe it's just me being thick - it's making assumptions about stand height, seat height, how tall the listener is, and how gullible too.

    My step dad used to have a pair of these Missions, which he had on wall brackets high up on the wall, probably undoing all of Mission's R&D
    Most good speaker designers will make some assumptions about the listening position when they model the (three dimensional) polar response, I think Mission (and most) assume an ear height around the level of the top of the speakers.

    I did read that when Kef designed the 104/2 the crossover was designed to make the image higher than the speakers. I assume this was done by making a slight phase difference between the top and bottom mid range cones. This was important as if you took the fronts off to refurbish them, putting the wires back the wrong way round would push the image towards the floor!

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  7. #27
    Join Date: Oct 2017

    Location: Manchester

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    I'm Peter.

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    "In traditional Mission style, the standmount LX-1 and LX2s tweeter is positioned below the mid/bass drive unit, in order to aid time-alignment. By placing the treble unit lower than ear level, the path length from the treble unit to the listener is longer than that of the mid/bass unit. As the treble unit dome is physically forward of the mid/bass unit cone, the difference in path length helps to equalise the acoustic distance".

    I am not persuaded by that explanation. Even if the treble unit is lower than ear level the path length from the tweeter to the ear can only be a metter of a few 10s of millimitres longer than that of the sound from the mid/bass unit at most in a domestic setting. Given the speed of sound in air is about 340m/s, even if the listener is seated 10m away from the speaker the time difference between sound leaving the treble unit versus sound leaving the mid/bass unit is going to be miniscule - measurable but I would doubt detectable to the human ear in a domestic setting. I understand the theory but in a domestic setting I would be surprised if placing the units in the way set out would make any real difference. I suppose if the listener was sat at the back of the o2 arena and the speakers were on the stage there might be a discernable difference but otherwise...................

  8. #28
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Norfolk, UK

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    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    Probably still better than that crappy PA at the NEC. That hangs from the ceiling. Don't know if they still have it, last went there in about '96 and swore never again. Totally soulless venue and shit sound.
    I remember it from the motor show days. Appalling sound; barely useable!

  9. #29
    Join Date: Jun 2015

    Location: London/Durham

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    I'm Lawrence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by peterdh View Post
    "In traditional Mission style, the standmount LX-1 and LX2s tweeter is positioned below the mid/bass drive unit, in order to aid time-alignment. By placing the treble unit lower than ear level, the path length from the treble unit to the listener is longer than that of the mid/bass unit. As the treble unit dome is physically forward of the mid/bass unit cone, the difference in path length helps to equalise the acoustic distance".

    I am not persuaded by that explanation. Even if the treble unit is lower than ear level the path length from the tweeter to the ear can only be a metter of a few 10s of millimitres longer than that of the sound from the mid/bass unit at most in a domestic setting. Given the speed of sound in air is about 340m/s, even if the listener is seated 10m away from the speaker the time difference between sound leaving the treble unit versus sound leaving the mid/bass unit is going to be miniscule - measurable but I would doubt detectable to the human ear in a domestic setting. I understand the theory but in a domestic setting I would be surprised if placing the units in the way set out would make any real difference. I suppose if the listener was sat at the back of the o2 arena and the speakers were on the stage there might be a discernable difference but otherwise...................
    Actually short differences in arrival time are noticeable and can lead to a blurring or lack of focus on the image. The ear and brain are quite remarkable instruments.

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  10. #30
    Join Date: Nov 2020

    Location: Leics

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    I'm David.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Filterlab View Post
    I remember it from the motor show days. Appalling sound; barely useable!
    My old fella took me to the NEC motor show in the 80s. There was a beautiful Ferrari 512BB sat near the entrance with a barrier round it and the window half down. A young lady was offering onlookers a piece of paper and a pen and inviting us to write our name and address, fold the paper into an aeroplane and try and get it through the window to win the beast.
    It was hard. However, a guy down from me hit the target, went batsh1t crazy, only to watch as our hostess reached through, picked it up and added it to the sack of (I'm guessing) 500 other "winners". That sack was then returned to the pile of others.
    Still, got to be in it to win it I guess.......
    Mark Levinson 390 CD & Audiolab 6000 CD Transport / Soncoz SGD1 DAC / Croft 25RS Preamp / Croft 7R mono Amps / Neat Ultimatum XLS Speakers

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