+ Reply to Thread
Page 5 of 6 FirstFirst ... 3456 LastLast
Results 41 to 50 of 60

Thread: Most difficult musical instrument for Hi Fi Systems to reproduce ?

  1. #41
    Join Date: Feb 2020

    Location: Fife, Scotland

    Posts: 85
    I'm Gordon.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by anthonyTD View Post
    Aye, me too!

    I was beginning to think that a few posts had lost the jist of the original question (which was pretty fundamental), by relating the 'difficulty' of reproducing an instrument on your system to the PSL's of 'live' instruments, whether individually or grouped together in any way.

    It's fairly obvious that a domestic hi-fi system will have difficulty in producing the sound level of some instruments, and certainly groups or orchestras, especially if electrified, but I don't believe that was what the question was about?
    Technics SL1000R, DynavectorXV1t, Garrard 401, Jelco SA750LB, Decca Reference, ATVM750SH, AT33Mono, Hana Umami Red, Reimyo CDP777, EarYoshino 912, Ear Yoshino 509s, JBLK2 SL5800s, ART Dram interconnects / speaker cables.

  2. #42
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 23,764
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

    Default

    Frank Zappa was notorious in his constant dabbling with splicing guitar solos (his) from one live recording into that of another live performance, if he thought the first was better than the second, but the performance on the second by the backing musicians was superior.

    What he didn't appreciate was that the phase relationship between the two performances, and the consequence on the stereo soundstage, was different: simply splicing a guitar solo from one performance into a second just sounds wrong and artificial.
    Barry

  3. #43
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 29,176
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    But I love it when he does that. And chucks in the drums from a completely different tune. If it's weird then that's how he wanted it. Nothing is on a Zappa record by accident.
    Current Lash Up:

    *Oppo BDT-101CI* Nelson Pass DCB1 / Krell KSA100 mkII * JM Lab Electra 926 *


    'You fool! To think that your ape-brain could contain the full knowledge of the Krell!'

  4. #44
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 23,764
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

    Default

    But Zappa hated mistakes - I've seen him 'wince' when he has heard one of his fellow musicians play a 'duff' note. He was a perfectionist - but what was perfection to him was not to others, as I have mentioned. His 'splices' sound like splices: different miking, different acoustic and soundstage positioing.

    It is as if someone has pasted a new photograph of a performer over the same in an older photograph that was taken in a different location.
    Barry

  5. #45
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 7,156
    I'm Steve.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    But I love it when he does that. And chucks in the drums from a completely different tune. If it's weird then that's how he wanted it. Nothing is on a Zappa record by accident.
    I once got a boulder burn on a Zappa record, by accident Only kidding, I would never do that, strictly T shirts only
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

    T/T: Inspire Monarch, X200 tonearm, Ortofon 2M Black. Phono: Yaqin MS-22B CD: Marantz CD6006 (UK Edition); Headphone/pre: Myryad Z40; Amp: Audion Silver Night 300b stereo
    Speakers: Zu Omen Def. Cables: Atlas Equator interconnects, Atlas Hyper 3.0 speaker cables

    T'other system:
    Echo Dot, Amptastic Mini-1, Celestion 5's, BK XLS-200 DF

    A/V:
    LG 55" OLED, Panasonic Blu Ray, Sony a/v amp, MA Radius speakers, REL Storm sub

  6. #46
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 7,156
    I'm Steve.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    But Zappa hated mistakes - I've seen him 'wince' when he has heard one of his fellow musicians play a 'duff' note. He was a perfectionist - but what was perfection to him was not to others, as I have mentioned. His 'splices' sound like splices: different miking, different acoustic and soundstage positioing.

    It is as if someone has pasted a new photograph of a performer over the same in an older photograph that was taken in a different location.
    Or a foreign film dubbed into English. I imagine Zappa would have been well aware of this, but didn't care - quality of the performances trumped everything.
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

    T/T: Inspire Monarch, X200 tonearm, Ortofon 2M Black. Phono: Yaqin MS-22B CD: Marantz CD6006 (UK Edition); Headphone/pre: Myryad Z40; Amp: Audion Silver Night 300b stereo
    Speakers: Zu Omen Def. Cables: Atlas Equator interconnects, Atlas Hyper 3.0 speaker cables

    T'other system:
    Echo Dot, Amptastic Mini-1, Celestion 5's, BK XLS-200 DF

    A/V:
    LG 55" OLED, Panasonic Blu Ray, Sony a/v amp, MA Radius speakers, REL Storm sub

  7. #47
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 29,176
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    But Zappa hated mistakes - I've seen him 'wince' when he has heard one of his fellow musicians play a 'duff' note. He was a perfectionist - but what was perfection to him was not to others, as I have mentioned. His 'splices' sound like splices: different miking, different acoustic and soundstage positioing.

    It is as if someone has pasted a new photograph of a performer over the same in an older photograph that was taken in a different location.
    Anything the artist does is artistically valid. I just don't get the point you are making with this. It's like audiophiles banging on about recording quality. Would we really want every recording to be shiny and polished, to be as accurate as possible to real instruments in a real acoustic just so it 'sounds' better on our systems? Not me. The purpose of recorded music is not to make hi-fi systems sound good. Cart before the horse.
    Current Lash Up:

    *Oppo BDT-101CI* Nelson Pass DCB1 / Krell KSA100 mkII * JM Lab Electra 926 *


    'You fool! To think that your ape-brain could contain the full knowledge of the Krell!'

  8. #48
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 6,835
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    Anything the artist does is artistically valid. I just don't get the point you are making with this. It's like audiophiles banging on about recording quality. Would we really want every recording to be shiny and polished, to be as accurate as possible to real instruments in a real acoustic just so it 'sounds' better on our systems? Not me. The purpose of recorded music is not to make hi-fi systems sound good. Cart before the horse.
    Hi Martin,

    As you say music canít make our systems sound better, unless it is engineered to do so. However some musicians do go to great lengths to get as close as possible to the original so the listener gets as good as possible listening experience. For example Ruggiero Ricci did a stunning recording of Paganini pieces in a studio with high end equipment that was recorded live and direct cut, the result is stunning. Alan Parsons as producer, engineer and musician has said he has always striven to get how it sounds and how the artist wants it sound to the listener on the end result. There are many others who have similar high standards.

    So I think there are musicians who just put it out as it is, and you either get it, like it or donít and then there are those that refine and polish it up to hope that it gets a better response, and as in my previous examples artists who want the listener to get the most they can from what they put out.

    Sadly though with modern recording techniques a lot of crap is done to make music sound more commercial and airwave friendly, although aspects of that has probably always been done.
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs:
    Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm
    Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges
    Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:-
    Sony 3d blu-Ray for CDs to Caiman SEG
    RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi to Beresford Caiman SEG DAC
    Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:-
    LFD MMC special phono stage & Rothwell MCX SUT
    ALLNIC T1500 MKII SET 300B amp
    Schiit MAGNI 3 Heresy amp

    Output:
    Wilson Benesch Vector speakers
    KLH Ultimate One Headphones

    Cables:
    Furutech AG-12-R4 High Performance Phono Cable
    Eccose Conductor CA1
    Belden 8402 with Switchcraft 3502A Audiophile High-End RCA
    Chord Epic speaker leads, & signature links


    I think I am nearing audio nirvana, but donít tell anyone.

  9. #49
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 29,176
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AJSki2fly View Post
    Hi Martin,

    As you say music can’t make our systems sound better, unless it is engineered to do so. However some musicians do go to great lengths to get as close as possible to the original so the listener gets as good as possible listening experience.
    I think they all do this but aiming for the most accurate and unadulterated recording is just one approach. Many/most artists apply all sorts of studio techniques to get the sound they want us to hear, and that can take the recording a long way from 'accuracy to real instruments'. But all approaches are valid.

    I have the remixed and re-mastered version (SACD) of 'Let It Bleed'. I also have the original CD release. The remix/remastered version sounds 'better'. But I prefer to listen to the original.
    Current Lash Up:

    *Oppo BDT-101CI* Nelson Pass DCB1 / Krell KSA100 mkII * JM Lab Electra 926 *


    'You fool! To think that your ape-brain could contain the full knowledge of the Krell!'

  10. #50
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 6,835
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    I think they all do this but aiming for the most accurate and unadulterated recording is just one approach. Many/most artists apply all sorts of studio techniques to get the sound they want us to hear, and that can take the recording a long way from 'accuracy to real instruments'. But all approaches are valid.

    I have the remixed and re-mastered version (SACD) of 'Let It Bleed'. I also have the original CD release. The remix/remastered version sounds 'better'. But I prefer to listen to the original.
    Yep, I have several versions of Led Zep II and I think the original sounds sonically better or shall we say more enjoyable, even though the later remix CD seems to have more clarity/detail. I do have a few others though where the re-master is an improvement in experience, to my ears anyway.
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs:
    Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm
    Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges
    Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:-
    Sony 3d blu-Ray for CDs to Caiman SEG
    RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi to Beresford Caiman SEG DAC
    Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:-
    LFD MMC special phono stage & Rothwell MCX SUT
    ALLNIC T1500 MKII SET 300B amp
    Schiit MAGNI 3 Heresy amp

    Output:
    Wilson Benesch Vector speakers
    KLH Ultimate One Headphones

    Cables:
    Furutech AG-12-R4 High Performance Phono Cable
    Eccose Conductor CA1
    Belden 8402 with Switchcraft 3502A Audiophile High-End RCA
    Chord Epic speaker leads, & signature links


    I think I am nearing audio nirvana, but donít tell anyone.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 5 of 6 FirstFirst ... 3456 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •