A new kid on the block...Topping E30

[Bonky]

I've just received a new Topping E30 DAC - a small, brand new model. It arrived from China a lot quicker than I was expecting. After spraying the parcel with an anti-viral agent the unpacking started.

It's only been running on my 2nd system (Apple iMac> Topping> Rega Brio) and so far I'm impressed. It's been 'burning-in for an hour or so and it does sound more 'immediate' and articulate (cf a Beresford Caiman2).

I'm yet to try it in my main system (with a Beresford SEG + Dorado). I'll let it burn-in for longer before the swap.

So far it's being powered by USB from the Mac. Obviously I'll experiment later with a dedicated, smoother, 5V source.

I downloaded a HD Rolling Stones 'Honk" album yesterday and that sounds very good in both systems and, I think, a little better than the 'red-book' CD standard. (I'm 72 yrs old so am not exiting too much!)

Question: to fully appreciate the SQ and to make proper comparisons, I need to download more HD tracks that both the Topping and SEG can play at their max resolutions. I'm looking for recommendations folks - where you've noticed a noticeable difference between the HD and standard tracks.



I'm all ears... (!)

Thanks,

Richard

[Opti-cal]

Got mine a few days ago, also super faster than expected shipping. It's a lovely little unit. It's fairly close to my higher end modified DACs. I've got an ifi power supply on the way to try with it so it might bring it up another level.

It's exceptionally transparent and neutral, as a modern well measuring DAC should be.

One thing I have noticed though is that running it via the 5v slot on my streamer, it is a bit noisy.... Surprising given its noise figures. I do have a high gain system and efficient speakers but my tube DACs run silently. Albeit not on 5v USB supplies from the streamer feeding it! Hence the ifi power supply, should sort that issue also.

Sounds best via coax and on filter 4 and 5 to me.

Great looking little thing too. Knocks shades off all my previous toppings (D30 & 50).

As for the music comparisons I'd do some Dire Straits - Brothers In Arms. A good DAC will sound good with 16 bit and 24 bit versions, a great DAC will hold your attention for the entire album, especially the 24 bit. I am slightly bias though....

Also had an SEG for a while, it's warmer than the E30. The Topping winning out on clarity by a smidge. Both nice in different ways, I'm looking forward to hearing the E30 with a good power supply.

[Bonky]

Hi, thanks for that. Your impression if the difference between the two DACs mirrors my initial impression. It's been burning-in all night so will make a better comparison later.

I though, technically, USB should be better than coax?

I'd be very interested in your impression of upgrading the power supply.

I have all of Dire Straits on vinyl and CD so I'll buy a HD version soon. Thanks for the recommendation.

Please keep in touch.


R

[Opti-cal]

Hi Richard, no problem.

Re the USB/coax comparison, I've found normally coax to sound better than USB. However IF (and its a big if) the streamer/source is properly powered (good transformer/battery etc) and well isolated (I also like to use an SSD for storage) I can imagine USB maybe edging ahead. I've heard USB outputs from dedicated servers (which only output USB) and they sound great. I don't have one as I'm more than happy with my coax/toslink setup. One thing that will sound worse is using USB directly from a computer/laptop, at least in my experience that has always been the case.

You can quieten the USB source down (if its a computer/laptop) using noise suppression/isolating devices from the likes of ifi/Audioquest etc, but I prefer what is to me the 'cleaner' (at least in terms of noise) output of coax/toslink.

Hopefully my power supply for the E30 will be here today so I'll certainly let you know what I think.

Cheers Richard,

Chris.

[Bonky]

Hi Chris, thanks.

It's 'burned-in' by now (not sure I believe in all that unless there are massive capacitors) and I'm now using an Anker 5V battery I had spare as a power source...but still using it in my 2nd system - the weather has been too nice to 'play inside'.

Expectation bias perhaps, but the sound sounds 'cleaner' somehow.

If you find a substantial benefit in the iFi power I may ditch the Anker (I believe there are switching circuits inside the battery case).

The DAC certainly punches above its weight!

Thanks again,

Richard

[Opti-cal]

Hi Richard,

ifi power supply arrived yesterday evening (just in time).

Firstly it has cured the noisy USB power issue I was having so major plus points there.

The sound with it is fairly close to how it was before but I must say it is now even closer to my higher end DAC's. Only thing its missing in comparison is a small amount of bass slam and a bit of 'presence'. At the end of the day though we are comparing a £120 DAC with a modified £500+ one so the fact its so close is a testament to its design if nothing else.

My other DAC's are mostly tube output so no surprise in the sound difference. I've built my system mainly around these DAC's (which have a warmish signature) but a ton of ambient texture so the rest of my system is fairly neutral with a bit of high end extension (brought about by an extra pair of full range drivers on the speaker assembly).

If your system is naturally a tad warm then I reckon the Topping might be an even better bet as it does seem to do detail and clarity exceptionally well.

Is the ifi worth £50 for a small (but noticable) improvement? If we're treading the same path value-wise as the E30 itself, I would say not, given its phenomenal value for money. However, listened to in the context of sonic improvement and looking at the E30 as just 'a DAC', I would say it does bring things up another level. As ever its dependent on your circumstances but £50 for a power supply upgrade is not expensive in proper power supply terms.

Hope that's of some use to you Richard.

Additionally I have tried the DAC with a power bank battery and it too got rid of the USB noise I was getting. The sound quality is also very nearly as good as with the ifi supply. Just loses out a tad somewhere though, sorry I can't be more descriptive but it just wasn't quite as 'good' as with the ifi. To be honest I only listened for a few minutes with the battery bank so maybe not a fair comparison but having to charge it every few days may also become annoying, just a nice cheaper alternative to the ifi supply anyway.

Cheers,

Chris

[Bonky]

Thanks again Chris for that full and informative description.

I have two Anker 5V batteries so I suppose I could charge one up as the other is being used - but I know what you mean re the inconvenience. As you say, £50 isn't much for a clean PS these days. (Although in: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-review.12119/ I think Amir found no objective improvement when using the iFi over a relatively cleanish PS from a smart 'phone charger (not, as you say from a laptop USB)).

...but this is a 'subjective'; forum after all.

At present my main system is warmish with a WD tube amp driving Living Voice speakers. I've yet to plug the E10 into it. I'll report back as I think a comparison with the Beresford SEG would be interesting.

A problem I have is that at 72 I've lost my 'top-end' (in all senses).

Thanks again,

Richard.

[Opti-cal]

Thanks again Chris for that full and informative description.

I have two Anker 5V batteries so I suppose I could charge one up as the other is being used - but I know what you mean re the inconvenience. As you say, £50 isn't much for a clean PS these days. (Although in: https://www.audiosciencereview.com/f...-review.12119/ I think Amir found no objective improvement when using the iFi over a relatively cleanish PS from a smart 'phone charger (not, as you say from a laptop USB)).

...but this is a 'subjective'; forum after all.

At present my main system is warmish with a WD tube amp driving Living Voice speakers. I've yet to plug the E10 into it. I'll report back as I think a comparison with the Beresford SEG would be interesting.

A problem I have is that at 72 I've lost my 'top-end' (in all senses).

Thanks again,

Richard.

Ahhh Amir (and his followers . . ), yes as much as I respect the importance for measurements of a component, it doesn't tell you 100% of the story. It's a useful resource but zero time spent actually listening to most of the products reviewed there misses almost the entire point of this hobby for me. They hate R2R DAC's too as they can measure appallingly (at least in the measurements they have deem as gospel to DAC performance).

Having said they they are a 'science' review forum so they do what is advertised. Just won't entertain any subjectivity what so ever, which often results in stupid spats and inflexible opinions.

As I say, a useful resource but ultra reliance and faith in pure numbers is not something that I can fully get on board with. If you measure a Lampizator tube DAC against a PC soundcard which one do you think will measure better . . . . and which one will sound better.

Living Voice speakers have an incredibly natural presentation on the few opportunities I've had the pleasure of listening to them. I really really like them, everything about them. They are good looking, well designed and above all sound superb. All boxes ticked for me. Good choice.

I think with those components you should try it in your system with the battery supply.

Haha, my dad is 70 and sometimes when we're listening to a piece (seems like a long time ago now!) I'll say, 'great shimmer or decay' his reply will be 'oh is something playing?' . . . .

Noticed over the last few years that I'm now missing the top few hz actually. Only noticed when I wasn't enjoying certain pieces quite so much . . .

Give it 10 years and I'll just be sat there with a pair of subwoofers, pipe and slippers.

Cheers

[Macca]

As I say, a useful resource but ultra reliance and faith in pure numbers is not something that I can fully get on board with. If you measure a Lampizator tube DAC against a PC soundcard which one do you think will measure better . . . . and which one will sound better.
s

I'm pretty certain if you search enough you'll find someone who prefers the sound of the PC soundcard. It is all subjective after all. Of course they would be hounded and ridiculed by Lampizator fans and those who think that kit that costs thousands has to be automatically 'better' than anything costing fifty quid. Sort of forgetting their own 'trust your own ears' rule in the process of course but that's how it goes.

[Opti-cal]

I'm pretty certain if you search enough you'll find someone who prefers the sound of the PC soundcard. It is all subjective after all. Of course they would be hounded and ridiculed by Lampizator fans and those who think that kit that costs thousands has to be automatically 'better' than anything costing fifty quid. Sort of forgetting their own 'trust your own ears' rule in the process of course but that's how it goes.

Expense aside (although likely an unconscious bias factor), they were just the most extreme examples of differing topological approaches to the design (that I could think of at the time!) but with the same end result, digital to analogue. One which would likely measure as expected and another which could measure all over the place. (Although I have not confirmed this). True, some people do not have ears though.