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Thread: An experiment in amplification

  1. #41
    Join Date: Dec 2018

    Location: Torquay, Devon.

    Posts: 1,333
    I'm Shane.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haselsh1 View Post
    The truth as I see it is that I am considerably older and considerably less demanding of almost anything. I have realised that hi-fi above a certain quality and cost is simply not essential or even important. What is important is that the music reproduced stirs your emotion and expression.
    Well said, Shaun.

    S.
    Shane Lonergan.

  2. #42
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 27,548
    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haselsh1 View Post
    Two main issues from the PrimaLuna Dialogue Premium days.

    An almost complete absence of very low bass so crucial with electronic music and a flat, dull sound with virtually no dynamics.

    I now have all of those things.
    The issue with any valve amp (except OTL) is that it uses an output transformer so its frequency response will vary depending on the impedance load of the speaker. That could be the issue. You might be better changing speakers than changing the amplifier. Ideally to something that has as flat an impedance curve as possible i.e not modern KEF or Spendor or anything similar.

    Or flog the valve power amp and buy a Krell, Bryston, something along those lines anyway. It is possible to get that midrange sweetness and transparency with solid state. Just not with most solid state.
    Current Lash Up:

    *Oppo BDT-101CI* Nelson Pass DCB1 / Krell KSA100 mkII * JM Lab Electra 926 *


    'You fool! To think that your ape-brain could contain the full knowledge of the Krell!'

  3. #43
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire

    Posts: 4,613
    I'm Shaun.

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    Just had a gorgeous Bowie 'Blackstar' session on this wonderful Sunday lunchtime; whoops, it's actually Tuesday. Must be all of the neighbourhood mowing their lawns and trimming their bush.

    So, what of it..? Blackstar that is..? Sue, my other half said that it now sounds driven and with more pace.

    I personally think that there is no part of this album that sounds better with the valve power. Martin, yes indeed re: the output transformer situation. I have though had four pairs of speakers in the last few years all with the PrimaLuna power. I found that the sound improved when connected to the 8 Ohm outputs. With the 4 Ohm outputs connected the voice and treble was just too exaggerated. There was never any improvement with the bass either in terms of drive or energy. I also agree Martin with your comments about Krell or Bryston. Sue has a bit of a fondness for Krell having listened before at Moorgate's in Sheffield.

    Shane, thank you for your approval. The older I become the more I think that way.

  4. #44
    Join Date: Feb 2014

    Location: Indianapolis, Indiana USA

    Posts: 759
    I'm Timothy.

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    Life is about cycles, and not necessarily the motorized ones! We tend to go through some, and some, many. Along the way, we find that we may come to like things in different ways, and some things we never liked at all, somehow manage to become likeable-I think my wife may now see me that way...maybe! I have gone through several hifi cycles myself, and am now kind of on the opposite side of your cycle, Shaun. I used to enjoy effortless power, and clarity, the pulse and drive of the music. Valves and some things related to that side of things, never seemed to be what I wanted, and at times, could not understand what it was even about.

    Now I am liking the softer, gentler side of things, which doesn't mean I am in the pipe and slippers brigade, but am enjoying decently sensitive speakers that take very little power to drive them, and at much lower sound levels than I used to. Some of it sort of came about by my moving to a new apartment versus my previous detached home, in which I could blast things-well, not blast, I never really was quite that way either-at any level I desired. When I moved into my current place, I just realized that I didn't need to have what I used to think I needed to get my musical enjoyment. I found I could get along just fine with bass to around 40 Hz, played at levels around 70-75 dB, and get it with my lower powered gear versus high powered, previous stuff. It also helped me really "listen" into the music, versus it being somewhat forced at me. Do I miss some of the previous gear/equipment and the way I listened to it then? Sure, to some extent. But I feel I am enjoying things in a different way now, and it is good. Is it better? Who knows, maybe if nothing else, for the neighbors, and also not creating issues otherwise, but it works, and I do not feel as if I am missing out on anything.

    It kind of paralleled a guy that I knew, that was also into music and hifi, and I pretty much watched and listened to his ideas on how systems can be put together, and also kind of followed similar thoughts-not as copying, but I felt as if we had a lot in common. I became kind of miffed after sometime with him, as he sort of did a total U-turn at some point with his system, and thought process. I was like so all these years, you have "practiced" this-almost like a belief statement, which I realize happens way too often in this hobby, and here he was, "turning his back" on all of those thoughts and beliefs. It took me several years to kind of realize that there is no right or wrong in any of it, it isn't this belief system-or shouldn't be, but more of an evolution, a cycle if you will. Then it made sense, and here I am, and here you are.

    And the funny thing is, maybe my cycle will take me back there again, who knows? Just like yours, maybe it will, maybe not. In it all, I think what is key, is that you don't care about that, nor what anyone else thinks about it, and that is how it SHOULD be plain and simple. It is your-fi, like mine is my-fi. We make things do for ourselves and what our ears tell us. It shouldn't be dominated by what others think. We live, we learn. The main thing is that you enjoy whatever goodness it brings to your life! No approval necessary here! I do find too, that my energies are now spread to other things, and that sometimes is just because of being in the hobby so long, one can reach that close to burn-out bit at times, but the other part is that as you kind of mentioned, you just don't care about all the fluffery of it all. And that is kind of a nice thing too.

    Nothing wrong with all the tweaks, the cables, the this and that, but in the end, these days, just sitting and listening to the music really does sound fooking great, who gives a rats ass if I am not using ebony footers that came from some damn rain forest in god knows where, made by some guy with special tools and blessed by the neighboring medicine man, that is supposed to make all things sound like the best ever. Screw it. If your music is doing it for you, then all is well with the world, even if you are using a turd to hold your album to the turntable platter! Enjoy!
    Holbo TT-Nag 110-Croft phono/Innuos Zen MK2/LinnenberG Telemann DAC-Preamp/LinnenberG Allegro monoblocs/Duevel Venus/LinnenberG Maestro SE-Senn. 660S DH Labs cabling

    Croft Series 7 amps, WLM La Scala, Naim Uniti1, Naim Nait XS3, Naim ND5XS2, Guru Junior

  5. #45
    Join Date: Sep 2009

    Location: west mids, UK

    Posts: 2,591
    I'm Phil.

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    well put tim
    1]bel canto pre 3 vbs, ice power amps /onkyo sacd, modwright jolida dac
    sonos, . tannoy eaton legacy 2]bel canto pre 3 vbs bc ref s500 marantz sa8005, black ice dsd dac and RFC impulse ta`us , track audio stands

  6. #46
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire

    Posts: 4,613
    I'm Shaun.

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    I'll definitely second that !

  7. #47
    Join Date: Mar 2017

    Location: Seaford UK

    Posts: 1,363
    I'm Dennis.

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    From Martin;

    "Look at it another way, you're not disillusioned, you're just more experienced and therefore more demanding of quality than you used to be back in your twenties when the world was young and everything different was a revelation."

    There is nothing wrong with disillusion, it represents realisation, and hence a growth from an earlier and more naÔve standpoint.
    I would argue that this is healthy and necessary, especially if you want to effect reality.

    From Shaun;

    "The truth as I see it is that I am considerably older and considerably less demanding of almost anything. I have realised that hi-fi above a certain quality and cost is simply not essential or even important. What is important is that the music reproduced stirs your emotion and expression"

    I doubt that you are less demanding, but that your perspective has changed, and perhaps you have realised the limits of what can be achieved, the enormous personal endeavour involved, and its cost.
    That will feed into your sense of what is important.

    I still think that what, (probably), we were all excited about earlier in our lives,was a result of that era and our position of discovery within it, and at a time when music said so much.

    Those important things are now still so, but the vehicle of music ist expressing it so much these days; it was a revolution, and celebrated at the V&A in Feb '17 for what it was about and did.

    There is still scope for emotional expressions of new truths, but the stultification by PWL and Simon Cowell by producing corporate music intervened from about '88, and the big boys stopped allowing singer/songwriters to have free reign.

  8. #48
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire

    Posts: 4,613
    I'm Shaun.

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    I'll second that too

  9. #49
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: East Riding of Yorkshire

    Posts: 4,613
    I'm Shaun.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pharos View Post
    I doubt that you are less demanding, but that your perspective has changed
    Totally accurate description.

  10. #50
    Join Date: Apr 2018

    Location: The Shires.....(Lincolnshire)

    Posts: 40
    I'm Justin.

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    Existentialism on a audiophile forum..... bravo I say.

    Thank you guys, Iíve really enjoyed reading this thread. I can identify with quite a bit of what has been said.
    Yamaha NP-S303

    Audiolab 6000cdt + NAD D1050 dac
    Creek Destiny 2
    KEF LS50/Linn Majik 109

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