Johns Hopkins Medical Centre - World Coronavirus infection Map by Country.

[walpurgis]

That's not to say that the UK's handling of the virus has been anything other than stumbling, and with a fair amount of locking stable doors after horses have bolted.

The forthcoming quarantining of arrivals into the UK being typical. And it's going to be 'self enforcing', as if people can be trusted to observe this. It will be abused and far too late anyway.

[walpurgis]

Ah okies... More later - some good recent posts to get stuck into!

Marco.

My point was that some folk will believe anything, no matter how implausible. There are those out there who believe we are characters in a movie!

[Joe]

There's certainly nothing new about billionaires suddenly deciding to give away lots of money, especially as they reach a certain age, whether through guilt, goodwill, or simply because they have more money than anyone would ever need. Andrew Carnegie, for example, made a fortune in the US steel industry, then in later life endowed libraries and other educational initiatives in the UK and the US. The US banker, George Peabody, establishing a housing trust in London for poor people (there's still several 'Peabody Buildings' there). And the Nobel Prize was established by someone who made a fortune out of dynamite, then felt guilty about the uses to which dynamite was being put. That seems a far more likely sort of motivation than simply adding billions more to a pile of money than Gates could ever use in the life he's got left.

[Marco]

Believe that if you like, that's your prerogative. I choose to believe something rather different.

Here's a most apt quote from the Jonas Salk link I posted earlier:

"One critic of the big pharma called Salk “the foster parent of children around the world with no thought of the money he could make by withholding the vaccine from the children of the poor."

Indeed - and that's the very kind of PURE EVIL and GREED that drives these huge 'pharma' companies, any why Gates wants a slice of the action, and it is ultimately humanity's greatest enemy.

Right, my [much needed] cappuccino awaits!!

Marco.

[AJSki2fly]

P.S Adrian, I'll get to your post after a (rather late) breakfast

No worries mate, I thought they had been round and taken you away for questioning.

[Joe]

Indeed - and that's the very kind of PURE EVIL and GREED that drives these huge 'pharma' companies, any why Gates wants a slice of the action, and that is ultimately humanity's greatest enemy.

Except that if one looks at the facts, rather than internet rumours, the truth is somewhat different:

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/f...us/2919503001/

'The Pirbright Institute is a biological research organization based in Surrey, England. The organization specializes in studying animal viruses and zoonotic diseases that transfer from animals to people. While the institute does hold a patent for a coronavirus that primarily affects chickens, it does not hold a patent on any part of the novel coronavirus causing the current COVID-19 pandemic.

"The Institute was granted a patent in 2018 which covers the development of an attenuated (weakened) form of the coronavirus that could potentially be used as a vaccine to prevent respiratory diseases in birds, including IBV, and other animals," a representative from the Pirbright Institute told USA TODAY.

"Pirbright does not hold any patents on parts of or the complete genome of the SARS-CoV-2 betacoronavirus," the institute stated.

No publicly available patents for genetic sequences of the SARS-CoV-2 virus have been issued anywhere in the world, and a possible vaccine isn't expected for possibly 12-18 months.'

So, there no vaccine (yet), and thus no patent for such a vaccine, and thus neither Bill Gates nor the Research Institute which he part-funds own such a patent. As another article puts it:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#47b963ab6227

'Additionally, there are a lot easier ways to make money than selling vaccines, which have to go through extensive testing and regulatory requirements. Vaccines don’t have the profit margins of other medications such as Viagra and other lifestyle medications or lower cost items like supplements or telling people to stick various household objects in their orifices.

Keep in mind that Gates has been far from a lone voice in expressing concerns about potential pandemics and pushing for more action before this COVID-19 coronavirus pandemic. In fact, he’s simply been echoing the concerns of many, many scientists and public health officials in the infectious disease world. Everyone in this world has seen how a new microbe like a virus or even an old microbe that suddenly has gotten some more gusto can unexpectedly emerge and quickly spread. This happened during the 2002 SARS outbreak, the 2009 H1N1 flu pandemic, the 2014-2016 Ebola outbreaks, and the 2016 Zika outbreak. All of these were all basically prequels to this current pandemic. They were harbingers like the episodes of chest pain that come before the heart attack, the feelings of “hmmmm” that come before the divorce, or the new baby characters that appear on a TV series before it gets canceled.

The trouble is too few ended up heeding these warnings, and now everyone is stuck at home, hugging their toilet paper rolls as if they were gold as opposed to a little gold-colored after use. Not only that, people are actually dying each and every day that this pandemic continues. Gates was one person who actually listened to and understood the pandemic concerns being raised by real scientists. These conspiracy theories about the origin of the virus do nothing to control the pandemic. In fact, they detract from the efforts of scientists, health care professionals, and officials who are taking action against the virus. As Bruce Willis said in the movie Die Hard, “If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. Quit being part of the [bleeping] problem and put the other guy back on!”'

[RobbieGong]

Nope, not at all.

I'm all for any properly tested and effective vaccine, designed for directly treating a *specific disease*, which is 100% safe for human consumption (or as near to that as biologically possible), and which the proposed one for COVID-19 almost certainly isn't (*if* introduced for human use in the timescale being suggested), as it normally takes YEARS for such to happen, if ever - and crucially that has been created *solely* on MORAL/ETHICAL grounds (not profit or control), and therefore is for the greater good of man.

That's why the great virologist, Jonas Salk, didn't patent the vaccine he created for Polio! See here: https://slate.com/technology/2014/04...o-vaccine.html

Those are the types of genuine people - REAL scientists who are 'in the game' for the RIGHT reasons, and to make a genuine positive contribution to society - not multi-billionaire businessmen, such as Gates, whose greatest ability is to ever-increase his personal wealth via *whatever* means possible, no matter what damage he does to others.

In that respect, you have to ask yourself, why someone like him would suddenly become *so* interested in humanitarian issues, and take such great steps to ensure that he can heavily influence not only the production of vaccines, but which company gets to produce and roll out the *ultimate* one, which when patented, will make him rich beyond his wildest dreams?

Ah, I hear you say, he's just a good guy who cares about people and has the money to do something about it.... BULLSHIT. That's fundamentally *not* how guys like him work! He didn't step down from Microsoft to fritter away his fortune on do-gooding, and I'm afraid anyone who thinks that is living in cloud-cuckoo land - far more so than the ones who believe in 'conspiracy theories'!

THAT is why this vaccine, and everything that surrounds it, stinks to high heaven, and we must do our UTMOST to ensure that it doesn't end up fatally contaminating the bloodstreams of the UK population!!

Marco.

P.S Adrian, I'll get to your post after a (rather late) breakfast

Have to agree. To not look at such a thing, with very wide open eyes, pertaining to your life, future, health, liberty and even that of your children, and just accept whatever is propose because of the 'situation' and decide 'they have our best interests at heart' would be careless and naive to say the least.

Never forget history and what happens when certain people are determined to push through certain things - too many examples and occurrences to list History shows that all too often, the result is bad things happen and not to them, but to us, the people.

We have voice, a brain and the right to explore, investigate as well as question. To just accept what is being told and then have 'something' injected into you AND your children is reckless and dangerous in my opinion.

Never make it easy for anyone or anything to just have its way over you and your life, why would anyone do that, especially knowing history. We have no excuse.

The amount if times we've been warned, told, reminded of what we are up against in this very existence, time and dispensation, but some don't want to know or are just either too weak, naive, dismissive, happy or cosy, choosing to go along trusting and allowing the rulers of the world to just implement whatever they will and purpose

None of this is new, Paul knew exactly what we the people were/are up against and he expressed that when writing to the church in Ephesus, after the death of Christ, 2000 or so years ago........ https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...12&version=KJV

Some eyes have always been opened, some are starting to open, some unfortunately will always remain closed, to their detriment. We should choose to never, ever be casual about our God given life, our soul, who we serve and ultimately where our eternity will lie.

We are called to be cautions and ever watchful https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...36&version=KJV

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...A8&version=KJV

It is better to be informed than than not informed, I'd say the majority would agree, better to be forewarned than not forewarned too, at least that way you can evaluate and discern for yourself. Yet as soon as it comes to ones life, some choose to categorically disregard anything that they regard as 'heavy' or controversial which is baffling.

Guess how many times scripture, tell us to not fear ? Around 365 times, can you believe that. That for me is no mistake and clear indication of how much God is for us, to protect us and wants us to not fall victim to fear. Fear cramps, burdens, weakens, suffocates and makes us vulnerable ..... A prime tool for any enemy or one looking to deceive by presenting as one with a way of hope....

Fear is not the spirit that God gave us or put in us, the 'world' will never tell you of the spirit God placed in us, it would be like the owner training the bird how to lift the hinge from the cage door and leaving the windows open https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...A7&version=KJV

There is no excuse for ignorance as God has promised that we will be informed, regardless of any schemes, trickery, deceit. Jesus made that very clear to the disciples, his friends before he left them and so we are informed too https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...28&version=NET

[Marco]

Except that if one looks at the facts, rather than internet rumours, the truth is somewhat different:

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/f...us/2919503001/

'The Pirbright Institute is a biological research organization based in Surrey, England. The organization specializes in studying animal viruses and zoonotic diseases that transfer from animals to people. While the institute does hold a patent for a coronavirus that primarily affects chickens, it does not hold a patent on any part of the novel coronavirus causing the current COVID-19 pandemic.

"The Institute was granted a patent in 2018 which covers the development of an attenuated (weakened) form of the coronavirus that could potentially be used as a vaccine to prevent respiratory diseases in birds, including IBV, and other animals," a representative from the Pirbright Institute told USA TODAY.

"Pirbright does not hold any patents on parts of or the complete genome of the SARS-CoV-2 betacoronavirus," the institute stated.

No publicly available patents for genetic sequences of the SARS-CoV-2 virus have been issued anywhere in the world, and a possible vaccine isn't expected for possibly 12-18 months.'

So, there no vaccine (yet), and thus no patent for such a vaccine, and thus neither Bill Gates nor the Research Institute which he part-funds own such a patent. As another article puts it:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucele.../#47b963ab6227

'Additionally, there are a lot easier ways to make money than selling vaccines, which have to go through extensive testing and regulatory requirements. Vaccines don’t have the profit margins of other medications such as Viagra and other lifestyle medications or lower cost items like supplements or telling people to stick various household objects in their orifices.

Keep in mind that Gates has been far from a lone voice in expressing concerns about potential pandemics and pushing for more action before this COVID-19 coronavirus pandemic. In fact, he’s simply been echoing the concerns of many, many scientists and public health officials in the infectious disease world. Everyone in this world has seen how a new microbe like a virus or even an old microbe that suddenly has gotten some more gusto can unexpectedly emerge and quickly spread. This happened during the 2002 SARS outbreak, the 2009 H1N1 flu pandemic, the 2014-2016 Ebola outbreaks, and the 2016 Zika outbreak. All of these were all basically prequels to this current pandemic. They were harbingers like the episodes of chest pain that come before the heart attack, the feelings of “hmmmm” that come before the divorce, or the new baby characters that appear on a TV series before it gets canceled.

The trouble is too few ended up heeding these warnings, and now everyone is stuck at home, hugging their toilet paper rolls as if they were gold as opposed to a little gold-colored after use. Not only that, people are actually dying each and every day that this pandemic continues. Gates was one person who actually listened to and understood the pandemic concerns being raised by real scientists. These conspiracy theories about the origin of the virus do nothing to control the pandemic. In fact, they detract from the efforts of scientists, health care professionals, and officials who are taking action against the virus. As Bruce Willis said in the movie Die Hard, “If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem. Quit being part of the [bleeping] problem and put the other guy back on!”'

Much of what you're written there I agree with and is valid. However, when it comes to forming an opinion on the matter, which remotely qualifies as being conclusive, it depends on which "facts" you wish to believe, in order to form that opinion, and who or what created the data qualifying them as such.

In that respect, you choose yours and I'll choose mine, and ultimately what you want to believe is true!

Marco.

[Joe]

I'll go with the scientific consensus that the virus is real and very dangerous, rather than a theory which implies collusion on the part of thousands of people, including many eminent doctors and scientists, and at the cost of billions of pounds and millions of lost jobs, to enrich one person. Such a theory makes no sense.

[Marco]

I'll go with the scientific consensus that the virus is real and very dangerous, rather than a theory which implies collusion on the part of thousands of people, including many eminent doctors and scientists, and at the cost of billions of pounds and millions of lost jobs, to enrich one person. Such a theory makes no sense.

Yes, that's probably because that's NOT what this *could* ultimately be about. Far from it. Gates is simply a pawn, albeit, a very wealthy and influential one, for the global elite. They're the ones pulling the strings, including those of the government and everyone else they need to get what they want!

In terms of the "collusion" thing, you misunderstand and have got that all wrong. I'll explain later, as right now I'm busy

Marco.