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Thread: The big vinyl push

  1. #1
    Join Date: Jul 2018

    Location: Wirral

    Posts: 96
    I'm Chris.

    Default The big vinyl push

    Right, I could do with a little advice please!

    Over the last couple of years I have built a new HiFi system. The Tannoy Cheviots and the Radford Revival STA25 are keepers as is the Thorens TD124. Unable to spend big on a preamp and phono I have made do with an Audiolab 8000c. For the outlay I can't complain about the Audiolab but it isn't the last word in reproduction. I recently acquiring a Phase Tech P3 Cartridge. I really like the Phase Tech but I also know it would sound much better through something other than the MC phono in the Audiolab. The Phase Tech's output is 0.27mV.

    So...... I need to ditch the Audiolab but I'm not sure whether to go Valve MM phono and SUT or Valve MC phono. I know both routes are expensive and i would have to do it in stages. I am happy to ditch all other sources and go vinyl only so a line level pre would not be necessary. To get the best I can afford all components are likely to be secondhand. I have a dull Audionote IQ1 I can use whilst buying the components but it is worth mentioning that I am determined to use the MC Phase Tech. I bought a valve mm phono from an AOS forum member just last week to play about with. It cost very little but easily betters the Audiolab's internal phono, making the Audionote IQ1 slightly less mundane so I know there is plenty of capacity to make gains!

    What would you consider the best route to audio nirvana, bearing in mind I can't blow multiple thousands in one go?
    Thorens TD 124 mkII, SME 3009 mkII unimproved, Phase Tech P-3 and Phase Tech headshell. Transfiguration Spirit mk1. Arcam Delta 70.3. Naim Unitiqute2
    Radford Revival STA 25 and Audiolab 8000c
    Tannoy Cheviot and RFC crossovers.
    RFC Mercury interconnects and Rhodium Twist speaker cable.

  2. #2
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 21,906
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

    Default

    Any valve MC phonostage will most likely be a valve MM phonostage preceded by an SUT. This is because valves are generally too noisy to use in the first stage of an MC preamp.

    Since you already have a valve MM phonostage, all you need is a suitable SUT. Given your Phase Tech cartridge outputs 0.27mV, all you need is an SUT with a turns ratio of 8 - 10x, of which there are plenty to choose from.
    Barry

  3. #3
    Join Date: Jul 2018

    Location: Wirral

    Posts: 96
    I'm Chris.

    Default

    Thanks Barry, the mm phono will probably be used mainly by my dad as we bought it together. Not to say I cant use it now and again. What SUT would you recommend?
    Thorens TD 124 mkII, SME 3009 mkII unimproved, Phase Tech P-3 and Phase Tech headshell. Transfiguration Spirit mk1. Arcam Delta 70.3. Naim Unitiqute2
    Radford Revival STA 25 and Audiolab 8000c
    Tannoy Cheviot and RFC crossovers.
    RFC Mercury interconnects and Rhodium Twist speaker cable.

  4. #4
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 21,906
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

    Default

    Anything by Lundhal, Cinemag, Haufe, Stevens & Billingham or Van der Veen having a turns ratio of 10:1 (20dB) ought to be suitable.

    Some users have quite strict loyalties to particular manufacturers, so you may get some conflicting advice.
    Barry

  5. #5
    Join Date: Jul 2018

    Location: Wirral

    Posts: 96
    I'm Chris.

    Default

    Thanks for the advice Barry, I will have a look at those brands. One thing that I am not entirely clear on is the step up ratio. I was under the impression that my .27mV 4ohm cartridge would be best matched with a 20x step up showing 5.2mV to the mm phono. I know I you are right but I'm not sure why. I should probably go and read the Rothwell page again!
    Thorens TD 124 mkII, SME 3009 mkII unimproved, Phase Tech P-3 and Phase Tech headshell. Transfiguration Spirit mk1. Arcam Delta 70.3. Naim Unitiqute2
    Radford Revival STA 25 and Audiolab 8000c
    Tannoy Cheviot and RFC crossovers.
    RFC Mercury interconnects and Rhodium Twist speaker cable.

  6. #6
    Join Date: Jan 2020

    Location: South Yorkshire

    Posts: 1,430
    I'm Andre.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by guero View Post
    Thanks for the advice Barry, I will have a look at those brands. One thing that I am not entirely clear on is the step up ratio. I was under the impression that my .27mV 4ohm cartridge would be best matched with a 20x step up showing 5.2mV to the mm phono. I know I you are right but I'm not sure why. I should probably go and read the Rothwell page again!
    I always recommend the vintage Mayware 'T24' but no one seems to try or mention. Don't have to worry about Impedance or anything it does it all for you. You can use it for both MM & MC's

  7. #7
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 21,906
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

    Default

    If you are happy that 5.2mV will be well within the overload capability of the MM preamp then that's fine, but remember the 0.27mV cartridge output is quoted at a 'typical' playback velocity of 5cm/sec. Peak playback levels can easily be 10 - 50 times as high.

    A 20:1 turns ratio will transform the nominal 47k input impedance of the MM preamp down to ~ 120 Ohm, which is perfect.
    Barry

  8. #8
    Join Date: Dec 2017

    Location: Manchester

    Posts: 335
    I'm John.

    Default

    Surprised you're so unimpressed with the Audionote cartridge given the price of them.

    Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

  9. #9
    Join Date: Jul 2018

    Location: Wirral

    Posts: 96
    I'm Chris.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Made in 1968 View Post
    I always recommend the vintage Mayware 'T24' but no one seems to try or mention. Don't have to worry about Impedance or anything it does it all for you. You can use it for both MM & MC's
    Thanks, I'll investigate those
    Thorens TD 124 mkII, SME 3009 mkII unimproved, Phase Tech P-3 and Phase Tech headshell. Transfiguration Spirit mk1. Arcam Delta 70.3. Naim Unitiqute2
    Radford Revival STA 25 and Audiolab 8000c
    Tannoy Cheviot and RFC crossovers.
    RFC Mercury interconnects and Rhodium Twist speaker cable.

  10. #10
    Join Date: Jan 2020

    Location: South Yorkshire

    Posts: 1,430
    I'm Andre.

    Default

    Try get the one that does not have the captive RCA output lead

    https://www.lencoheaven.net/forum/in...topic=28173.45

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