Boris big win.

[ReggieB]

Labour lost because they were seen as the Momentum party, a coterie of middle class academic leftist virtue signallers par excellence. How could they possibly connect with working class voters?

I really don't understand that argument. If it were true why did so many vote for the likes of Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg, who couldn't be further from working class voters in their background.

[Marco]

Really? The Daily Telegraph is owned by the Catholic Barclay twins, the Daily Mail by the Harmsworth family (CofE AFAIK, and they backed fascism pre-WW2), the BBC and Channel 4 are publicly-owned, the FT is owned by a Japanese company, News International is owned by Rupert Murdoch, who is of Scottish and Irish descent. So what evidence is there of the media being 'mostly Jewish owned and controlled'?

If you do some digging around you may discover there are others involved at high levels in the media (and especially at the BBC), with some major influence. I will say no more on that particular matter.

Marco.

[Marco]

Ah well, that's me done with AOS.

That's a shame, it's been fun.

Bye.

Eh.... Why on earth do you say that??

Marco.

[Marco]

As for the comments about antisemitism, they have been used to repeatedly smear Jeremy Corbyn. This is true whether you believe that he is antisemitic or you don't. It has been a major weapon against him and any evidence to the contrary has been ignored by the British media. The great Noam Chomsky has declared antisemitism to be completely untrue with respect to Corbyn and a creation of the right wing media. The chief rabbi has weighed into the debate recently but was then found to be a personal friend of Boris Johnson so he disappeared from view as soon as this was picked up.

Spot on, not just the highlighted bit, but the whole lot! And the last bit is also, shall we say, rather 'interesting'

And by the way, just in case anyone thinks differently, just because you're critical of any particular race, or what they stand for on some issues, Jewish or otherwise, doesn't make you are 'anti' them or racist! No-one in this world is beyond reproach, scrutiny or criticism.

Marco.

[chris@panteg]

I was wondering if it was a good idea to start this thread, but I think we need to talk about and listen to everyone's views.
I don't have any answers to put it right, but very many Corbyn supporter's are very angry and wallowing in self pity, blaming everyone but themselves.

They need to visit those labour heartlands and ask people why instead of just taking their support for granted.

[oldius]

The thread was a good one to start but comments like 'wallowing in self pity' are not the words of someone who genuinely wishes to listen to everyone's views.

I speak as a remainer.
I speak as someone who moved abroad temporarily, partly because of the UK issues in education.
I speak as someone who deplores the lack of scrutiny of the current government's performance in the last decade.
I also speak as someone whose family are firmly Brexit supporters and will have voted as such in this election.

What is shocking, and needs to be examined completely, is that a party has been re-elected despite it generally being considered that they have done a very, very poor job while in government. The opposition has to take responsibility for that. We also need to examine other issues at play, like the role of the media and the issues around self interest and conflict of interest in politics.

I am open to discussion that includes both sides listening to each other.

[Joe]

Anti-semitism often takes the form of the argument that 'the Jews control everything', with the spoken or unspoken implication that 'something must be done about it'. This is an argument that is deployed by both right-wing and left-wing politicians; the right-wing element playing on the nationalist sentiment that Jews are 'alien' and not really German/English/whatever, and the left-wing element playing on class-envy: 'Look how rich those Jews are, and how poor you are'. Saying that the media is 'mostly Jewish owned and controlled' and then backing off when asked to produce evidence looks disingenuous at best.

[Joe]

I was wondering if it was a good idea to start this thread, but I think we need to talk about and listen to everyone's views.
I don't have any answers to put it right, but very many Corbyn supporter's are very angry and wallowing in self pity, blaming everyone but themselves.

They need to visit those labour heartlands and ask people why instead of just taking their support for granted.

The danger signals for me started when Gordon Brown, thinking his mic was switched off, muttered that a woman in a Northern constituency who expressed concern about levels of immigration from Eastern Europe was a 'typical bigot'. Labour when in power consistently ignored the problems of towns across the country where schools, hospitals and other public services were under huge pressure because of high levels of immigration. The Tories have done little to address the problem either, but they have made the right noises. In Scotland Labour became increasingly irrelevant given the growing popularity of the SNP, who successfully argued that a London-based Labour Party would never take Scotland's problems seriously.

[struth]

Anti-semitism often takes the form of the argument that 'the Jews control everything', with the spoken or unspoken implication that 'something must be done about it'. This is an argument that is deployed by both right-wing and left-wing politicians; the right-wing element playing on the nationalist sentiment that Jews are 'alien' and not really German/English/whatever, and the left-wing element playing on class-envy: 'Look how rich those Jews are, and how poor you are'. Saying that the media is 'mostly Jewish owned and controlled' and then backing off when asked to produce evidence looks disingenuous at best.

when times are tough a scapegoat is always found

[Marco]

Anti-semitism often takes the form of the argument that 'the Jews control everything', with the spoken or unspoken implication that 'something must be done about it'. This is an argument that is deployed by both right-wing and left-wing politicians; the right-wing element playing on the nationalist sentiment that Jews are 'alien' and not really German/English/whatever, and the left-wing element playing on class-envy: 'Look how rich those Jews are, and how poor you are'. Saying that the media is 'mostly Jewish owned and controlled' and then backing off when asked to produce evidence looks disingenuous at best.

Yes, but that's not what I've done, so don't start with your silly little digs!

I've got good reason to post what I did in reference to the media, the same as I've good reason to believe the stuff I've posted in the past about the Royal Family and paedophiles (some of which is just starting to surface now with Prince Andrew), 9/11, Jill Dando, and Princess Diana's 'accidental death', etc, the 'evidence' for which is out there should you care to do the required research, but which I won't be getting into here simply for you to dismiss as 'conspiracy theory', or become embroiled in a circular argument about, just because what I've stated offends your sensibilities and/or doesn't fit with your belief system.

Marco.