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Thread: Boris big win.

  1. #141
    Join Date: May 2009

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    Quote Originally Posted by Landloper View Post
    If Brexit was cooked up by the wealthy, it is strange to reflect that it was a Tory government [along with other powerful & wealthy institutions such as the Bank of England, the Church of England, the CBI, and so on] that campiagned for us to vote Remain. If the suggestion is that the referendum was held to benefit those who keep their wealth protected offshore [such as the anti-Brexit The Guardian newspaper, through their GMG Hazel Acqusitions 1 Ltd, registered in the Caymen Islands], then why are so many of the rich tax-avoiding Remainers and fully supportive of the hyper-capitalist EU?
    The rich and canny will always cover their bets, so that they'll be OK whatever happens. 'Big business' and the Bank of England have, as you say, been consistently pro-EU, because they know precisely how difficult it will be for us to make trade agreements post-Brexit.

  2. #142
    Join Date: Nov 2008

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    Why not put some 'meat on the bone' then, Chris, and tell him *why* you think he's wrong? Comments such as the above do nothing to further the debate.

    Marco.
    Anybody who learned any history in school will have learned of the socio-economic conditions in post First World War Germany.
    The punitive reparations (at French insistence) compounded the issues.
    Germany had rampant inflation, and they couldn't print and revalue the Mark fast enough https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperi...eimar_Republic

    If you didn't learn of such things then I suggest going to the library and learning.

    I don't see problems of the magnitude facing Germany during the Weimar Republic here.
    Yes, there are problems, but nothing of the same magnitude as then in Germany.
    Chris



    Common sense isn't anymore!

  3. #143
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikeyb View Post
    Westminster class us as a ‘Region’ that’s handy for shooting and fishing, and cheap holiday homes to get away from the rat race in London
    Lol - aye, and how true it that, too!

    Marco.
    Graham Peck, Knutkullavägen 15, 81569 Månkarbo, Uppsala, Sweden is an Internet troll. Report him (and his illegal, vile racist and abusive behaviour on Snakeoilaudio.com), should you be appalled by it, or a victim.

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  4. #144
    Join Date: Mar 2014

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    I'm Mike.

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    Anyway I've said my piece and will say no more.

    Enough of this political crap.

    Back to the music

  5. #145
    Join Date: May 2016

    Location: Balgill, Leinster, Ireland

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    '...the Bank of England have, as you say, been consistently pro-EU, because they know precisely how difficult it will be for us to make trade agreements post-Brexit..'

    They have also had to apologize for their incorrect forecasts on the economic impact of Brexit, so I don't set too much store by their claims on other dire consequences of our freedom

  6. #146
    Join Date: May 2016

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    The point still stands, Marco. Even if the union were more benign, it would still be a bar to Scotland's independence and would still have to go in order for her to achieve full nationhood. Even if every Scottish voter adored the union, it would still mean that Scotland had exchanged some of her self-governing rights in return for membership of the union.

    Until 1603 England and Scotland were separate nations, each with their own system of government. On the death of Elizabeth I, childless, the crown passed to James VI, of Scotland because he was the great great grandson of Henry the VIIth. It was James the VI of Scotland who decided not to be a monarch of two kingdoms, but rather to combine the two kingdoms into one, and so proclaimed the union of Scotland and England. In 1604 James first styled himself King of Great Britain. He wans't entirely successful, and the crowns remained separate, though now with shared symbols and and one monarch. But the drive towards the union had been begun by Scotland's attempt known as the 'Union o the crouns'.

    The history of relations between England and Scotland is complcated and often bloody, but i mention the above to point out that Scotalnd is far from a passive actor on the historical stage. Indeed without Scotland's active participation in what became Great Britain the history of the British Empire would have had taken a different course. I'm not sure the phrase English ruling class has much meaning, at least when used after 1603. The ruling class has been comprised of the a small strata of the English, the Scottish, and the Welsh peoples for a long time, and is perhaps better described as the British ruling class. I suggest that Scotland played a pivotal riole in furthering the idea of a union which allowed the concentration of class power over the various peoples of the British isles.



    The sooner both England and Scotland return to being independent self-governing democratic states the better.

  7. #147
    Join Date: May 2016

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    Suggestion: the Scotish Parliament should exceed their powers and hold a referendum on Scotland's independence and state beforehand that the result will be binding, and that should a majority vote to leave the union then the Scottish Parliament will without delay declare independence. Let Westminster chew on that.

  8. #148
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    Location: Bristol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Landloper View Post
    '...the Bank of England have, as you say, been consistently pro-EU, because they know precisely how difficult it will be for us to make trade agreements post-Brexit..'

    They have also had to apologize for their incorrect forecasts on the economic impact of Brexit, so I don't set too much store by their claims on other dire consequences of our freedom
    Brexit hasn't actually happened yet.

  9. #149
    Join Date: May 2016

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe View Post
    Brexit hasn't actually happened yet.
    The predictions in 2016 made by that instituion dealt with the alleged short term impact consequent on the UK merely voting to leave, not the on the bank's projections on possible UK economic performance after the process of withdrawal had been completed.
    Last edited by Landloper; 14-12-2019 at 15:10. Reason: Disaterous orthographical performance resuling from Leave win

  10. #150
    Join Date: Jan 2008

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    We'll agree to disagree on some of your other points, John, save the historical facts. However, on this we are in FULL agreement:

    Quote Originally Posted by Landloper View Post
    The sooner both England and Scotland return to being independent self-governing democratic states the better.
    ...and they shouldn't have been 'united' in the first place, as Scotland has never been treated, fairly and squarely, as England's equal. Instead, it's forever been ruled by Westminster and a politically London-centric bias,- and which has always irked the majority of the Scots (Welsh and Irish), whether they care to admit it or not.

    Equality , as part of the union, is what Scotland and its people have always wanted. Now, they can go one better, and be independent and in control of their own destiny - and we can all get on with looking after our own best interests and those of the country we live in, rather than kidding ourselves on that Westminster is ultimately looking after the best interests of anyone in the UK but England.

    Marco [considers himself as Scottish, first and foremost, before British, and so will always have a pro-Scotland mentality].
    Graham Peck, Knutkullavägen 15, 81569 Månkarbo, Uppsala, Sweden is an Internet troll. Report him (and his illegal, vile racist and abusive behaviour on Snakeoilaudio.com), should you be appalled by it, or a victim.

    The garden shed in my avatar is the property at the above address, should anyone wish to visit.

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