Women Hifi owners...

[Marco]

But mostly we all seem to become consumed in mortgages, buying fridge freezers and raising children, and then upgrading the house we live in. Then if we are not careful we become embroiled in the competitive approval seeking of society and the associated consumption.

Nail>head. That is *exactly* what is happening all around us in the world today, and of course has been occurring for many years, simply that for some time now (in my view, since the inception of the Internet and smartphones, and crucially social media) the last bit has become much worse.

All I can say is that thank goodness I'm not living in that world, and largely never have been.

The essence of this to me is that capitalism attempts to convince us that we will achieve happiness by acquisition of material goods, whereas this is in fact not a way of fulfilment, which actually comes from within, and what psychologists call inner direction; that is, directing ourselves rather then letting forces around us do so, which is outer direction.

Very interesting, Dennis! I shall have to conduct some research into that subject.

The bit in bold is linked with what I often refer to as 'free-thinking' (i.e. not blindly accepting that what you're told, by the 'powers that be' (and often brainwashed into believing) is fact, actually *is* fact, and therefore always seeking to challenge/question the veracity of 'currently accepted wisdom', or 'the norm' (together with practising some lateral thinking), thus putting yourself in control more, in order to achieve the highlighted above.

I would contend that "outer direction" is precisely how the establishment and elite seek to influence matters and brainwash/control us, via means previously discussed.

TBH, without even thinking of, or knowing about "inner direction', and what it strives to achieve, it's pretty much how I've always led my life, and the catalyst for achieving the goals I set for myself since becoming an adult.

Marco.

[Beobloke]

I also prefer to follow my own inner direction in order to find fulfilment and happiness.

The problem is that said inner direction keeps leading me to my local B&O dealer and telling me to buy stuff.

[Marco]

Yes, you've always had an uncontrollable penchant for old tat...

And before you mention Tannoys, yes I know!!

Marco.

[Beobloke]

How very dare you!

My B&O dealer is a prestigious establishment and only sells new tat!!

[AJSki2fly]

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But mostly we all seem to become consumed in mortgages, buying fridge freezers and raising children, and then upgrading the house we live in. Then if we are not careful we become embroiled in the competitive approval seeking of society and the associated consumption.

Nail>head. That is *exactly* what is happening all around us in the world today, and of course has been occurring for many years, simply that for some time now (in my view, since the inception of the Internet and smartphones, and crucially social media) the last bit has become much worse.

All I can say is that thank goodness I'm not living in that world, and largely never have been.

The essence of this to me is that capitalism attempts to convince us that we will achieve happiness by acquisition of material goods, whereas this is in fact not a way of fulfilment, which actually comes from within, and what psychologists call inner direction; that is, directing ourselves rather then letting forces around us do so, which is outer direction.

Very interesting, Dennis! I shall have to conduct some research into that subject.

The bit in bold is linked with what I often refer to as 'free-thinking' (i.e. not blindly accepting that what you're told, by the 'powers that be' (and often brainwashed into believing) is fact, actually *is* fact, and therefore always seeking to challenge/question the veracity of 'currently accepted wisdom', or 'the norm' (together with practising some lateral thinking), thus putting yourself in control more, in order to achieve the highlighted above.

I would contend that "outer direction" is precisely how the establishment and elite seek to influence matters and brainwash/control us, via means previously discussed.

TBH, without even thinking of, or knowing about "inner direction', and what it strives to achieve, it's pretty much how I've always led my life, and the catalyst for achieving the goals I set for myself since becoming an adult.

Marco.

Exactly, I spent many years chasing various dreams in terms of the better house, car and so on, often driven by what I would call conditioning from external influences such as advertising, sales pressure and what others told me, peer to peer pressure from friends, colleagues and family.

About 12 years ago aspects of dissatisfaction came into my life, and I started thinking about what I was doing, why I was buying this or that and actually these things actually giving me any long term pleasure or fulfilment, the reality was very little of what I was doing, certainly relating to owning physical stuff, was giving me any long term happiness. I was chasing money, working harder and harder to try and satisfy what I thought I needed to do to be happy, all I did was become trapped, tired and very unhappy. In some areas like cars it was actually making me very stressed, perpetually looking for the bigger thrill or one that was better, a complete waste of time. When I became physically ill 4 years ago and had time to reflect on various aspects of my life it dawned on me that I just needed to get rid of certain things that were not important and stop chasing non-existent rainbows, unimportant at least to me, and adjust my way of thinking. So the expensive fast car went, some money from it went on much needed home improvements and peace of mind for longer term.

I also returned to a main love of mine, listening to music and actually sitting and relaxing when listening to it. So I used some proceeds from the car to improve the hifi, I set myself a budget and limited myself to that. I knew it would be very easy to get sucked into the this is better than than that, talked into gear by dealers and it spiral out of control. Also my wonderful Sue became my Jimmy Cricket, reminding me of my aims and not to let my hobby become an obsession or dissatisfying. So after a few years a couple of amps, 3 pairs of speakers and two turntables I am now pretty happy with what I have and how it all sounds and I have kept my promise to myself and my original budget. I may do the odd cable tweak or improve the digital streaming side, but only if I have the money. It's time to sit and enjoy for many years, and forget about what's new or whether it could sound better.

Am I happier, well yes I am more relaxed and more content generally, we try and organise our life so that I and Sue can do what we like as much as possible, walking, occasional meals out and relaxing together at home, obviously based on what we have and can afford. Yes we like to be comfortable and would prefer to be more financially secure, but we cut our cloth to fit and ignore commercial pressures to have unnecessary stuff. This may become even more important based on my health or lack of it in the future. Some would view an expensive hifi as unnecessary and a waste of money, and I suppose it is really, but at least I enjoy it and do not just own it to have the best or be part of a social group in society. Although I suppose I by default I am now viewed by others as a sad old geeky git with a posh stereo.

My point is from my own experience I think we often fail to realise even as adults how easily we are influenced and guided in a particular way of thinking. Marketing and advertising aims, as Dennis says, to pull/push us into a particular way of thinking, which is effectively if you own this product you will be happy or happier. Even worse it is suggested sometimes that if you don't own a particular product/house/holiday you will be missing out, deprived or not as good as someone who has it, this approach is all done very cleverly and subliminally. I find this particularly nasty and a big reflection of our society as we see it developing today. Those that wish to influence the many and profit are doing so by whatever means they can, psychology, internet, social media, AI etc are all very influential and useful tools for them to use or abuse rightly or wrongly.

Be Happy,

Adrian

[Marco]

Post of the year, Adrian, and a man after my own heart!!!



I shall comment individually on some of the most apt points you've made later

Marco.

[Pharos]

I used to be a motorcycling enthusiast in the 70s and 80s, extending to '91. In the 70s we didn't have to wear a crash helmet, and I would ride my chopped Triumph Daytona 500 to and from Hastings to see and stay with my aunt, heady times.
But I rebuilt the bike into what it became, and with a personal commitment, not just a material indulgence.

In '85 I bought a BMW R100RS, a beautiful bike, and used to ride down to Seaford, where I now live from Beckenham, to see the same aunt who had moved here. I then changed it for a K100RS, much better, and was happy, except that it really is a dangerous pursuit.

Hi-Fi has been for me, having studied electronics and sound reproduction, not an entirely material pursuit; it has always involved endeavour and striving, to pursue achievement toward the aim of perfect sound.
(I bet you don't know anyone else who would travel on public transport carrying a paraline speaker wrapped in a blanket to work in Bush house, on the tube, to audition it with co workers on night shift. We also took my Tannoy golds + system on another occasion in a fellow worker's van on another night shift.)

The point? For me satisfaction in life is gained by the effort put into trying to achieve, mush more so than the gratification obtained by consumption, which is easy. This also has applied to the much more recent, and much deeper attempt at a speaker design from '02 onwards. In Oct '17 after winning a legal case, I spent the money going to Berlin and buying my pair of ADAMs, and yes, they are very good, and must be a result of an enormous amount of research by a team of PhDs + others using a great deal of expensive facility. They are enjoyable, but are they twenty times as good as my attempts, and how do we quantify this?
I was actually a month ago considering upgrading from the Betas to the Alphas, but it struck me as an obscenity, can they really be that much better? I decided not to, and this raises the issue of the materialism slope; when you have a Lamborghini, where do you go to next, the Bugatti? It is a philosophical question from which I think we have to become grounded.

The beauty of Hi-Fi is that once we own it, it is a virtually cost free pursuit, and if anyone thinks that speakers such as these are owned for the approval of others, I point out that, unlike a parked car, the exposure to potential admirers is minimal, in fact I fear others knowing about them for the obvious reasons.

Motorcycling now is more dangerous that ever IMO, the roads are so crowded, and the possibility of doing what they are designed for is very limited with so many speed cameras around.

I think maturity necessitates a greater grasp of reality, in my 20s I was obsessed with ladies' tits, arses and legs, not aware really that it is the inner connection that fulfils a relationship. Children are obsessed with the taste of food, especially sweet tasting food, and only have to look at the results of that if it is allowed to take over choices. There needs to be a societal realisation.

Can you imagine what it would be like for us if the majority thought this way, meeting in a friendly way rather than competing to outdo everyone else in material terms?

[Macca]

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Can you imagine what it would be like for us if the majority thought this way, meeting in a friendly way rather than competing to outdo everyone else in material terms?

I'd say that the majority do think that way. Do a poll on here and ask if people place a high priority on accumulating material possessions and keeping up with the Joneses. I'll bet no-one votes yes.

Aside from that the majority, even in this country, have not got enough left after rent/mortgage payments and essential expenses to keep up with anyone.

[Marco]

I'd say that the majority do think that way. Do a poll on here and ask if people place a high priority on accumulating material possessions and keeping up with the Joneses. I'll bet no-one votes yes.

Wouldn't tell you much, mate, as the views and traits of AoS members, in general, aren't representative of those of the general public. The very nature of this place, and other forums of a specialist nature like it, is that it attracts reasonably discerning, intelligent and well-balanced people (more likely to be free-thinkers) - that is apart from our resident daftees!

Besides, what makes you think if anyone here was like that, they'd admit it?

Aside from that the majority, even in this country, have not got enough left after rent/mortgage payments and essential expenses to keep up with anyone.

You're missing the point. Many are still living way beyond their means, simply because of being guilty of the type of behaviour (perhaps subconsciously), as outlined earlier by Dennis, then Adrian [specifically "becoming embroiled in the competitive approval seeking of society and the associated consumption"] - and which is partly why they're skint.

Btw, I'm not referring to folks who are genuinely financially poor, but rather those who earn a decent working wage, but simply fritter it away on 'stuff' that they really don't need, or insist on living beyond their means, trying to be something they're not, and subsequently getting into serious debt.

Marco.

[Macca]

Btw, I'm not referring to folks who are genuinely financially poor, but rather those who earn a decent working wage, but simply fritter it away on 'stuff' that they really don't need, or insist on living beyond their means, trying to be something they're not, and subsequently getting into serious debt.

Marco.

Well yes they exist and I guess in sizeable numbers, I was just disagreeing with the notion that they are 'the majority'.

Also you know the saying - that a man who owes ten thousand pounds to the bank lives in a shack eating baked beans whilst a man who owes a million pounds to the bank lives in a mansion eating caviar.

Those number probably need to be adjusted for inflation now.