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Thread: I'm just a primary school teacher and I need help :(

  1. #11
    Join Date: Mar 2009

    Location: South West-ish, UK

    Posts: 457
    I'm Patrick.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tornpower View Post
    I know it may seem vulgar to you professionals to jump so quickly to the mid-leagues but when I listen to my collection for the first time its going to honestly be one of my great experiences and to do it on the deepest, richest, cleanest sound possible would be sublime.
    It's not vulgar, but what you will miss out on is hearing a lot of stuff in your own environment which will help you understand what works for you and what doesn't; and where the acceptable compromises are.

    So I reckon, you should get yourself invited to hear lots of other people's systems and make you own mind up rather than getting 'blind' recommendations. Probably everyone on this forum has a unique combination of components and you will probably finish up with something different again. You'll need to choose speakers that work with your room, and an amplifier that will drive your speakers, and a deck, arm, cartridge and phonostage that work together. So think in terms of combinations rather than individual components.

  2. #12
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

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    I'm Grant.

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    I usually suggest getting speakers that will work for you and your enviornment first and working back. I know others feel you start with an amp but im right
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  3. #13
    Join Date: Sep 2019

    Location: Ipswich

    Posts: 76
    I'm Arthur.

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    Thanks for the heads up Pharos. I will avoid the phonostage for now.

    Cheers for backing the Krell, JBLs and potentially Tannoys Adrian. When you say bigger JBLs could recommend a model?

    Mr. Ian - inside the room i will be around two metres away. Its a small space. I am happy not to get a vintage vinyl player. Technics options seem sensible to me. What would yo recommend?

    Lawrence, I still want to be able to tweak the levels. In my experience with these singles all of them want a different mixture of bass/treble. I will have to get up every three minutes anyway to change the track so its not a huge problem to be adjusting for each song. What I wanted to know is will the presumably inferior quality of the Tubby component (http://www.jahtubbys.co.uk/equipment.html) undermine everything else? Is there a high end audiophile preamp where you can adjust the levels, that you would recommend?

    Sid, that is amazing thank you. So you have no problem with the Radford valve amp and its bass? It looks killer tbh. The Krell KSA80 looks like the one for me now. Maybe ill save up for the Radford if you think its worth it. I cant find the pre amps you suggested, are they vintage? Those Tannoys are the ones my friend recommended i can only find them for £2500 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/163855456...m=163855456988) will these particular units likely need servicing? Do you disagree with the consensus that the JBL L100s are also good for the job? Do I need a sub as well? What is your opinion of the Jah Tubby pre amps?

    Joe Gibbs and Upsetter labels are my jam.

    Patrick I am going to take this relatively slow and will try and listen to what I can. Just don't have audiofile pals and am an impatient impulsive little man!

    Thanks so much for all your input. Feeling positive about the world this morning!

  4. #14
    Join Date: Mar 2016

    Location: Brighton, UK.

    Posts: 3,061
    I'm Mike.

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    Think I saw somewhere on PFM that idler TT's are good with reggae.
    Current system 1210 GR. CDP - Meridian G08. Amp -Sugden A21I - Sig. Wharfedale Lintons.

  5. #15
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 13,240
    I'm Adrian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tornpower View Post
    Thanks for the heads up Pharos. I will avoid the phonostage for now.

    Cheers for backing the Krell, JBLs and potentially Tannoys Adrian. When you say bigger JBLs could recommend a model?

    Mr. Ian - inside the room i will be around two metres away. Its a small space. I am happy not to get a vintage vinyl player. Technics options seem sensible to me. What would yo recommend?

    Lawrence, I still want to be able to tweak the levels. In my experience with these singles all of them want a different mixture of bass/treble. I will have to get up every three minutes anyway to change the track so its not a huge problem to be adjusting for each song. What I wanted to know is will the presumably inferior quality of the Tubby component (http://www.jahtubbys.co.uk/equipment.html) undermine everything else? Is there a high end audiophile preamp where you can adjust the levels, that you would recommend?

    Sid, that is amazing thank you. So you have no problem with the Radford valve amp and its bass? It looks killer tbh. The Krell KSA80 looks like the one for me now. Maybe ill save up for the Radford if you think its worth it. I cant find the pre amps you suggested, are they vintage? Those Tannoys are the ones my friend recommended i can only find them for £2500 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/163855456...m=163855456988) will these particular units likely need servicing? Do you disagree with the consensus that the JBL L100s are also good for the job? Do I need a sub as well? What is your opinion of the Jah Tubby pre amps?

    Joe Gibbs and Upsetter labels are my jam.

    Patrick I am going to take this relatively slow and will try and listen to what I can. Just don't have audiofile pals and am an impatient impulsive little man!

    Thanks so much for all your input. Feeling positive about the world this morning!
    Hi Arthur,

    I would be cautious of over powering you room with too big speakers, or you may induce bass reflection and re-enforcement. The Tannoys you mention should be good and they will be robust.

    In my early twenties I and a friend were invited to a reggae party in Wandsworth in an old block of flats, and great fun it was. The two Rastafarians whose party and flat it was had their system set up in a 18' by 12' room, they were very proud of it, there were a pair of home made open baffle cabinets about 5' tall and two 15" Tannoy bass drivers in each, a couple of mids and a tweeter. They were hooked up to I think a Thorens deck, Sansui equaliser, can't remember the pre-amp and I think a huge JVC power amp which ran very hot. It sounded very impressive and was very loud, you did not stand in front of the speakers as the bass just hit you in the guts. I remember they said the deck was in a very heavy plinth and was carefully isolated. My point it was great for a party and frightening the neighbours but not something you would want to sit down and listen to everyday.

    I think the Krell would be a good amp, from the power and sound quality point of view. If you want to taylor the sound then why not try something like this to start with, not expensive and you can see if it works for you or not https://www.vintagechief.com/sansui-...qualizer-21793, or maybe https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rotel-RE-...IAAOSwfDtdNI9X. About pre-amp there others who know Krells better than me and know what works well with them.

    TT I would say either something like this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Thorens-T...IAAOSwbYddfQQc or a Direct drive like these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-X-Techn...QAAOSwm-BdLiRQ or maybe a good Garrard 301 in heavy plinth. Remember whatever you get you need is isolated and not in front of the speakers or being hit by reflected sound.

    Just for you I have just listened to Third World on my system while writing and the bass from the 15" Tannnoys at sensible levels is pretty good, I currently have UB40 - "Present Arms IN DUB" on and this is impressive, I certainly can fell the pumping bass and driving bass drum.

    I hope this helps a bit.
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs: Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm, Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges, Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:- Marantz SA-KI Pearl CD player, RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi+ Pro, Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:- AudioValve Sunilda phono stage, Krell KSP-7B pre-amp, Krell KSA-80 power amp

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  6. #16
    Join Date: Dec 2008

    Location: London, UK

    Posts: 65
    I'm Syed.

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    Yes Arthur, I'll go through you questions one by one -

    So you have no problem with the Radford valve amp and its bass? It looks killer tbh. - Playing at home through Tannoys or Yamaha NS1000m's the Radford is fine as both are efficient speakers.

    The Krell KSA80 looks like the one for me - This one will save you money in the winter as you won't need the heating on in winter.

    I cant find the pre amps you suggested, are they vintage? These I had made by World Designs.

    Do you disagree with the consensus that the JBL L100s are also good for the job? I have no knowledge of these.

    What is your opinion of the Jah Tubby pre amps? - Hmmmm Jah Tubbys (Keith) from East London he makes sound system pre-amps mostly mono 3 or 4 way crossovers......with weight, mid and treble cutouts and parametric eq's

    Joe Gibbs and Upsetter labels are my jam. - How can you leave out Bunny Lee productions with King Tubby's version sides? And Channel One and Freedom Sounds, Keith Hudson, Niney, Jammy's, Pablo etc etc.....I'm sure you know about them!


    Build a mini sound system, a couple of twin Fane 18 inch bass reflex, some Celestion 12's or 10's on mid and some horn tweeters with some PA amps then run it through an EQ, some parametric, siren effects and an echo/delay unit.....you will be happy!

    If I had the space (and not the neighbours), I would sell all of my gear and go down that road.....it's the music that matters and reggae is true full range music.......it was always mixed for sound system not Hi-Fi 5 inch in bass units!

    Cheers

    Sid

  7. #17
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,777
    I'm Martin.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tornpower View Post
    I grew up in a household where Reggae was played a lot. D.B.C broadcast from my mums roof for a few years and old tapes were laying about when I was thirteen. It became a passion, but I was always digging on the internet listening to low grade reproductions. I shied away from actually owning anything until I was recently blown away by an acquaintance's high end system playing some of my favourites on mint vinyl. I was converted on the spot to wanting/needing a rig and high fidelity recordings of my own.

    I am now obsessively buying early 70s 45s, fiendishly creating/curating my own little selection of the strictly baddest, rarest cuts I can afford. The problem is... I don't even have a record player . I have an 80s Pioneer amp and a pair of Dynaudio audience 40s. Together they cost £300. I am on a mission to find the ultimate set up - I have been saving and will have £3-4k to spend - I am potentially prepared to go higher. I know it may seem vulgar to you professionals to jump so quickly to the mid-leagues but when I listen to my collection for the first time its going to honestly be one of my great experiences and to do it on the deepest, richest, cleanest sound possible would be sublime.

    However my amateur forum lurking and asking around have opened my eyes to the unbelievable range of options. It is frankly staggering and overwhelming. There don't seem to be clear cut answers, but strongly held and argued opinions each particular to the amp, speaker, type of music, room size, even speaker box shape etc. I have only just (thanks Crackles!) been made aware that 'cleanest' sound may not even be appropriate for my predominantly reggae and dub collection.

    I hate the look of anything really post 1995 but prob pre 1992 is good enough. I have been told that buying vintage means potentially having any thing I buy - speaker, amp - fully refurbished at potentially considerable expense - I am up for doing this. I am looking for the dream set up that any of you knowledgable people could imagine given my requirements. I am now fully conscious that Reggae and Dub are not appropriate for lots of the audiophile equipment promoted here. I am hoping that this is not strictly true and/or there is a likeminded soul who thinks there is an option for me, or knows what wold work. Ive also been told that speaker design has advanced massively since the 70s so is it sensible to go for the most modern speaker if you were being totally honest about sound? Is this also true of amps? I am asking this hoping that there is still magic in the old models that cant be replicated!

    Ive asked a lot of friends but not sure they really know what they are talking about or that it is really reggae vinyl I will be playing. But I have been recommended by them to get either Quad Mono block amps or Leak Stereo 20 amp or and, this was really sold to me, a Croft OTL power amp. Speakers people have been suggesting Tannoy (my friend said the 15 DMT II). I have been looking and like what people are saying about the Rodgers 5/9s. Are any of these suggestions good?
    Forget the Leak, the OTLs and the QUAD monos, but the Tannoy DMT15 are a good suggestion. You've got a big room so it would really make the most of them. Buy a sack truck to move them about and they will also work well in the party barn. £2K is about right for a pair in good condition. Tannoy Ardens would also be a good alternative. Big JBLs would be better but much harder to find second hand and new is outside your budget. The smaller JBL like the L100 and its variations do not have deep bass, they would not be my recommendation for a fan of dub. Neither would the Rogers speakers.

    The amp you have now would work fine with the Tannoys, although it isn't going to give you the best possible sound quality. A Krell KSA100 would be better! take into account it is the size of a suitcase and a two man lift - unless you're mister muscles. Obviously with a power amp you need to consider a matching pre-amp. I use mine with a Nelson Pass designed DCB1 pre amp. Very good match, you can get someone here like Ollie to knock you one up. Will not break the bank.

    Otherwise I'd say go for a flagship integrated amp from the 1980s or 1990s, Sony, Marantz, Sansui, JVC. Won't cop out in the bass and will go to gig volumes with the Tannoys without any sweat. Ideally look for one that's been serviced. They come up pretty much all the time.

    Don't listen to the idea that you want a bit of a 'rough' sounding system to make it sound authentic. The authenticity is on the recordings it isn't inherent in the system. I know those old dancehall PAs could sound a bit rough but that was because they couldn't afford any better. If you'd have asked the owners would they like to improve them the answer would have been yes!

    Turntables - good suggestions made already. Technics the obvious choice. If you want to go new the SL1200 GR would be my pick, it's better than the old SL1200 model https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Technics-...kAAOSwOKldaS26 - otherwise loads of second hand direct drives by Technics, Sony, Toshiba and so on. They'll all give a decent sound if properly sited and set up.

    Whatever you do don't skimp on the speakers, that is far and away the most important part of a system like this. Very large speakers with good power handling and deep bass are an absolute essential. You can always wing it a bit on the deck and the amp and maybe improve them later if you run out of budget on the speakers.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  8. #18
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,590
    I'm Steve.

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    +1 for Macca's suggestions, except I'd look for a tidy secondhand SL1200/1210 as opposed to a new deck, that would free up £500 or so to go towards the biggest badass JBLs you can afford, powered by a 70's jap amp (which will have a phono stage built in).
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

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  9. #19
    Join Date: Sep 2019

    Location: Ipswich

    Posts: 76
    I'm Arthur.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AJSki2fly View Post
    Hi Arthur,

    I would be cautious of over powering you room with too big speakers, or you may induce bass reflection and re-enforcement. The Tannoys you mention should be good and they will be robust.

    In my early twenties I and a friend were invited to a reggae party in Wandsworth in an old block of flats, and great fun it was. The two Rastafarians whose party and flat it was had their system set up in a 18' by 12' room, they were very proud of it, there were a pair of home made open baffle cabinets about 5' tall and two 15" Tannoy bass drivers in each, a couple of mids and a tweeter. They were hooked up to I think a Thorens deck, Sansui equaliser, can't remember the pre-amp and I think a huge JVC power amp which ran very hot. It sounded very impressive and was very loud, you did not stand in front of the speakers as the bass just hit you in the guts. I remember they said the deck was in a very heavy plinth and was carefully isolated. My point it was great for a party and frightening the neighbours but not something you would want to sit down and listen to everyday.

    I think the Krell would be a good amp, from the power and sound quality point of view. If you want to taylor the sound then why not try something like this to start with, not expensive and you can see if it works for you or not https://www.vintagechief.com/sansui-...qualizer-21793, or maybe https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rotel-RE-...IAAOSwfDtdNI9X. About pre-amp there others who know Krells better than me and know what works well with them.

    TT I would say either something like this https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Thorens-T...IAAOSwbYddfQQc or a Direct drive like these https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-X-Techn...QAAOSwm-BdLiRQ or maybe a good Garrard 301 in heavy plinth. Remember whatever you get you need is isolated and not in front of the speakers or being hit by reflected sound.

    Just for you I have just listened to Third World on my system while writing and the bass from the 15" Tannnoys at sensible levels is pretty good, I currently have UB40 - "Present Arms IN DUB" on and this is impressive, I certainly can fell the pumping bass and driving bass drum.

    I hope this helps a bit.
    That story is amazing Adrian. Im jealous, I often think I missed better days. You paint a mad picture but it doesn't put me off going big, that vibrating gut punching bass sounds boss. Take your point about sound reflecting and needing to shield turntable. Also about going for cheap Equalizer to start with.

    Do you recommend a high end EQ that would work with the system being proposed?

    Glad your getting out your reggae!

  10. #20
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Essex

    Posts: 31,848
    I'm openingabottleofwine.

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    Speakers: most JBLs, Altec Lansings and Tannoys would suit

    Amplifier: Solid state, either a 100W Krell, or Quad 520 (a pair of Quad 510 monoblocks would be better, but they are comparatively rare and hard to come by). Valve, a high power Audio Research.

    Preamp: obviously something that offers RIAA equalisation for record replay (avoid those that incorporate an equalisation pole at 7950 µs (approximately 20 Hz)), and can output 1V at maximum setting of the volume control.

    Turntable: Technics 1210 (obviously! ); low 'rumble' is of paramount importance.

    Cartridge: something robust - there are many cartridges designed for use by DJs. Something by Ortofon should suit.
    Barry

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