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Thread: Can you ever go back to belt drive?

  1. #11
    Join Date: Aug 2014

    Location: Norfolk

    Posts: 440
    I'm Andrew.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pigmy Pony View Post
    I don't know how quickly the platter gets up to speed on my DD turntable, but it looks pretty instant, and the platter weighs an absolute ton. Power coming 'directly' from a high-torque motor I suppose, and that's as technical as I can get
    How is it I've never heard of this brand? The tt's look amazing!


    My System:

    Turntable - Linn Sondek LP12, Kore, Lingo 4, Roksan NIMA, Lyra Delos Cartridge, Roksan HDC-03 arm lead, Trampolin 2 base, Tiger Paw Vulcan, Denon DCD-A110 Cd player, Tag Mclaren DAC20 Digital to Analogue Converter, SPM Interconnects, Nordost Red Dawn Leif Speaker cable, Spendor S3/5R2 Target R1 speaker Stands, Atacama ECO 60/40 hifi racks, Sennheiser HD565 Ovation headphones

  2. #12
    Join Date: Aug 2014

    Location: Norfolk

    Posts: 440
    I'm Andrew.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shovel_Knight View Post

    From the mechanical point of view, if you connect a heavy platter to a motor with a compliant rubber band, the resulting system acts as an oscillator, and if you add a spring-suspended subchassis to the equation, things get even more interesting. The rubber band being stretched and pulled by the motor and the platter creates a measurable amount of torque that rotates the subchassis and excites the suspension, this should result in pretty severe real world wow... Please take note that adjusting the suspension does nothing to eliminate this wow, it only shifts its frequency!
    Could that make off centre records sound worse? I only ask as when I had an 1210 I never noticed the wow so prevalent on off centre records as I do on the Linn? It seems that now I've noticed it nearly every record suffers from it.


    My System:

    Turntable - Linn Sondek LP12, Kore, Lingo 4, Roksan NIMA, Lyra Delos Cartridge, Roksan HDC-03 arm lead, Trampolin 2 base, Tiger Paw Vulcan, Denon DCD-A110 Cd player, Tag Mclaren DAC20 Digital to Analogue Converter, SPM Interconnects, Nordost Red Dawn Leif Speaker cable, Spendor S3/5R2 Target R1 speaker Stands, Atacama ECO 60/40 hifi racks, Sennheiser HD565 Ovation headphones

  3. #13
    Join Date: Sep 2017

    Location: Dublin

    Posts: 506
    I'm Pavel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by allthingsanalogue View Post
    Could that make off centre records sound worse? I only ask as when I had an 1210 I never noticed the wow so prevalent on off centre records as I do on the Linn? It seems that now I've noticed it nearly every record suffers from it.
    Well, the armboard is mounted to the subchassis, and if the tonearm is moving back and forth I assume it would also slightly rotate the subchassis and excite the suspension.

  4. #14
    Join Date: Jun 2014

    Location: Chorley Lancs

    Posts: 14,604
    I'm Steve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by allthingsanalogue View Post
    How is it I've never heard of this brand? The tt's look amazing!
    Thing is Andrew, I'm a lazy shite with no technical knowledge, two cloth ears and sausage fingers. So I wanted something 'plug 'n' play'. The arm and cartridge were set up by Inspire so may not be performing optimally (the 2M Blacks are notoriously sensitive to set up). But all I know is I love it!

    Maybe change the arm one day.
    I just dropped in, to see what condition my condition was in

    T/T: Inspire Monarch, X200 tonearm, Ortofon Quintet Blue. Phono: Project Tube Box CD: Marantz CD6006 (UK Edition); Amp: Musical Fidelity A5 Integrated.
    Speakers: Zu Omen Def, REL T9i subwoofer. Cables: Atlas Equator interconnects, Atlas Hyper 3.0 speaker cables

    T'other system:
    Echo Dot, Amptastic Mini One,Arcam A75 integrated, Celestion 5's, BK XLS-200 DF

    A/V:
    LG 55" OLED, Panasonic Blu Ray, Sony a/v amp, MA Radius speakers, REL Storm sub

    Forget the past, it's gone. And don't worry about the future, it doesn't exist. There is only NOW.

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  5. #15
    Join Date: Apr 2015

    Location: Central Virginia

    Posts: 1,736
    I'm Russell.

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    My experience was quite the opposite. For 20+ years I had a fine Denon direct drive ‘table. It finally developed a problem, (after a drunk girl decided to arm wrestle with the auto cuing tone arm.) I never had it fixed, sold it as is.

    So, now I have a VPI Scout, with the acrylic platter, and the timing and pace, wow and flutter are far beyond anything I heard from the Denon. The Denon had a rumble during the silent passages of a record, that reminded me of a bowling ball rolling down the lane. Or course it was very slight, it never bothered me, most people wouldn’t even notice, but the VPI is dead quiet on the silent passages. And no ‘table I’ve ever owned has Impressed me with its timing and pace like this VPI. Every album sounds like another, and another. To me, that’s the true measure of any piece of gear.

    So, maybe it’s not the belt drive, but some other feature, or design choice?

    Russell

  6. #16
    Join Date: Jan 2009

    Location: Norwich

    Posts: 2,814
    I'm Hugo.

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    There are good and bad examples of all turntable drive systems, and good and bad implementations too, so it's pretty pointless to make any sweeping statements or assumptions. That said I do believe that perceived speed instability with belt-driven decks like the LP12 has more to do with the suspended sub-chassis wobbling around than the actual drive system being imprecise. So, in my opinion a suspended deck like the LP12 should always be placed on a very solid surface, not a wobbly one, and where the floor is timber suspended, get the deck onto a strong wall shelf.

    Of course once heard, low rate 'wow' is difficult to 'unhear' and a good direct drive deck won't suffer from such problems, and nor will a good idler even if they still benefit from careful placement; and in the case of idlers there is always mechanical noise to get used to. My Thorens TD-124 is a lovely musical thing, but so too are my Kenwood and Technics DD decks which benefit from 'added silence'.

    Andrew, your SL-1200G was as close to the turntable motor system 'state of the art' as anything bar the new SP-10R, but there is 'something' about the way that a well set up Linn plays music, even if it still has its flaws to which even Linn lovers will admit. Try moving the LP12 onto a solid surface or wall mount and then re-evaluate what you hear; otherwise I think you answered your own question to begin with and the SL-1200G is more your thing.

    How widespread is the SL-1200G 'warped platter' issue in reality? I don't know but these things can be blown out of all proportion on the internet and all I can say is the my pimped SL-1200GR has no such problems. That said, I can supply the Technics SL-1200G, SP-10R and SL-1000R (via an authorised Technics dealer) and I would personally check any deck very carefully before handing it over to the customer!

  7. #17
    Join Date: Nov 2008

    Location: Banbury, Oxfordshire/Panteg is where my late father was born

    Posts: 4,382
    I'm Chris.

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    I wouldn't worry too much about the 1200G platters, if you really want one, go for it.

    I didn't think I would switch back to belt drive I just fancied trying another Voyd, I think it's the only belt drive deck I would have gone for, because I really like the three motor drive system, I'm so glad I did, absolutely love it, plays music beautifully to me.
    Having said that I wouldn't rule out getting a SL1200G at some point if it's an option but I'm more than happy with my Voyd.
    Chris

    We've gone on holiday by mistake !

  8. #18
    Join Date: Sep 2009

    Location: Derbyshire

    Posts: 9,228
    I'm Josie.

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    Actually... and don't shoot me down here.

    A friend of mine has a budget Pro-Ject RPM-5 with the carbon fibre arm and that sounds awsome. He uses an Ortofon black with it.

    I used to own the very same TT a long time ago and to be honest I was quite taken with it at the time but the Ortofon red cart let it down. I remember the Gyro SE was better but in a more refined way and then they are in differently priced camps.

    For playing rock and dance stuff the RPM-5 was a good little TT.

    What I'd really love to try is a really nice linear turntable. A subject for a different thread maybe?




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  9. #19
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: scotland

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    I'm alan.

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  10. #20
    Join Date: Sep 2009

    Location: Derbyshire

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    I'm Josie.

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    haha... cheeky bugger.
    Ultrafide U500DC power amplifier - Croft Vitale )highly modified) - TRIO L-07D Turntable - Denon DL103C1 - Funk Firm Houdini - Lentek MC head amp - 15" Tannoy Monitor Gold Loudspeakers in Lockwood Major cabinets (From Trident Studios) - Tannoyista SPEC 3 Custom Crossovers - VanDamme Black Speaker Cable


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