The vagaries of vinyl

[alphaGT]

Returning to the importance of vinyl quality and sound... I had an interesting exchange with the owner of an online audiophile vinyl shop yesterday who warned me off buying several new release records I was interested in, noting that those- and indeed the vast majority of vinyl nowadays- were essentially junk, using as source a cd master on a usb stick or CDR, mastered in a couple of hours buy an engineer in a studio who rattles through 3 or 4 albums a day. The vinyl is cut using a digital 16bit cutting head on a DMM lathe instead of an analogue VMS one. His advice was save money and buy the CD instead. Not really news I suppose but pretty depressing nonetheless. If only all new releases were as stunning as Mofi Ultradisks (and a fraction of the price!!!!), I think we'd be hearing fewer complaints about TTS, carts and other ancillary equipment...

That’s interesting. Were these new artists? I confess I haven’t bought any new vinyl in a year’s time, and the ones I have are mostly older music. But that is most disappointing, mastering a vinyl record from a USB stick! Definitely a label to watch out for.

Russell

[Pharos]

From da222:
"mastered in a couple of hours buy an engineer in a studio who rattles through 3 or 4 albums a day. "

This also raises one of my concerns, those who re-master are often from a very different cultural heritage and background, who as a result do not have a sensibility for the original ethos of the artistic material.

A good example IMO is the CD version of Country Joe's Electric music.

[struth]

Returning to the importance of vinyl quality and sound... I had an interesting exchange with the owner of an online audiophile vinyl shop yesterday who warned me off buying several new release records I was interested in, noting that those- and indeed the vast majority of vinyl nowadays- were essentially junk, using as source a cd master on a usb stick or CDR, mastered in a couple of hours buy an engineer in a studio who rattles through 3 or 4 albums a day. The vinyl is cut using a digital 16bit cutting head on a DMM lathe instead of an analogue VMS one. His advice was save money and buy the CD instead. Not really news I suppose but pretty depressing nonetheless. If only all new releases were as stunning as Mofi Ultradisks (and a fraction of the price!!!!), I think we'd be hearing fewer complaints about TTS, carts and other ancillary equipment...

DMM lathes are afaik analogue. Direct metal mastering. its cut straight into a copper disc.

[AJSki2fly]

Returning to the importance of vinyl quality and sound... I had an interesting exchange with the owner of an online audiophile vinyl shop yesterday who warned me off buying several new release records I was interested in, noting that those- and indeed the vast majority of vinyl nowadays- were essentially junk, using as source a cd master on a usb stick or CDR, mastered in a couple of hours buy an engineer in a studio who rattles through 3 or 4 albums a day. The vinyl is cut using a digital 16bit cutting head on a DMM lathe instead of an analogue VMS one. His advice was save money and buy the CD instead. Not really news I suppose but pretty depressing nonetheless. If only all new releases were as stunning as Mofi Ultradisks (and a fraction of the price!!!!), I think we'd be hearing fewer complaints about TTS, carts and other ancillary equipment...

Yes, quite correct, need to be quite careful buying re-releases even of major artists, unless the process is clear, it often can be from digital masters, and/or badly re-mixed and cut. IMO it is better to try and buy an original early pressing in genuine NM condition, depending on cost and availability.

[da2222]

"That’s interesting. Were these new artists? I confess I haven’t bought any new vinyl in a year’s time, and the ones I have are mostly older music. But that is most disappointing, mastering a vinyl record from a USB stick! Definitely a label to watch out for."

His comments related to 'big' label artists' material in general and, in my case, it was a Craig Armstrong album and the re-press of Portishead's live in USA...

[Macca]

DMM lathes are afaik analogue. Direct metal mastering. its cut straight into a copper disc.

Yes DNM uses an analogue head, not digital.

There 's no real issue with using a 16 bit digital cutting head though since best case a vinyl LP will only have 13 bits equivalent dynamic range.

There still seems to be some confusion regarding this. Wouldn't a fairly recent recoding by Portishead be digital? So why would you expect them to cut the vinyl from a none-digital master? This makes no sense.

I can understand wanting to preserve the 'analogue purity' with an analogue recording even if there is no real point to it but how can it possibly matter if the recording is digital to begin with?

[da2222]

Yes DNM uses an analogue head, not digital.

There 's no real issue with using a 16 bit digital cutting head though since best case a vinyl LP will only have 13 bits equivalent dynamic range.

There still seems to be some confusion regarding this. Wouldn't a fairly recent recoding by Portishead be digital? So why would you expect them to cut the vinyl from a none-digital master? This makes no sense.

I can understand wanting to preserve the 'analogue purity' with an analogue recording even if there is no real point to it but how can it possibly matter if the recording is digital to begin with?

Sorry I wasn't very clear. The Portishead original was digital of course, but apparently much better sonically than the recent digital re-press, both in terms of mastering and vinyl QC.

[Macca]

I see. have to say when I was buying vinyl I always tried to get first pressings due to the massively variable quality of the re-issues. No doubt some are 'better' but it really did seem to be pot luck. There are so many variables when pressing a record that it is hard to pin down any particular reason for a specific example to be rubbish.

Quality of the stamper, and how many it has done before it does the one you end up buying:

Quality of the vinyl used, and the cleanliness of the facility.

The experience or the lack of it of the bloke running the press.

I'd say all of those will make far more difference than whether they took the master from a USB stick or whatever, or whether a digital or analogue lathe was used. I know we have at least a couple of members here who have worked in pressing plants, maybe they will comment.

[YNWaN]

I recently bought the remastered ‘My Life In The Bush Of Ghosts’ (on vinyl, obviously) and it sounds outstanding.

[Breezy]

I'm not sure that this is as clear cut as some would make out. I've enjoyed quite a bit of re-mastered new vinyl: Kate Bush and Jethro Tull for a start off. The Abbey Road half speed version of John Martyn Solid Air was also excellent I thought. I think you have to differentiate between the sound and the quality of the vinyl itself - if you know what I mean - a well mastered recording is useless if the pressing is rubbish. I've had quite a few issues with K-Scope recordings. They look perfect but have huge amounts of surface noise. It's very frustrating. Buying good first pressings is not always easy either - there many sellers who claim Near Mint which are anything but. Overall it's all a bit of a lottery

BTW - Where's this Audiphile Vinyl shop? Sounds facinating