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Thread: Digital Facts and realities?

  1. #151
    Join Date: Sep 2013

    Location: North Island New Zealand

    Posts: 1,757
    I'm Chris.

    Default A request to IASA

    I have written to IASA below, who are " The International Association of Sound and Audiovisual Archives (IASA) is a professional association concerned with the care, access and long-term preservation of the world’s sound and moving image heritage. Through its active worldwide membership and training initiatives, IASA supports and advocates the development of best professional standards and practice amongst organisations and individuals which share these purposes "


    Dear IASA
    I am interested in becoming a member of IASA. however wish to ask before doing so, Is there technical ability yet or endeavour, to raise the audio bandwidth of CD to say 45khz with Nyquist /Shannon sampling then at 96khz - allowing a 6 khz margin for filtering ?

    The benefits or suggestions of benefit to a better audio experience have been raised in the past by Dr Malcolm Hawksford, Paul McGowan of PS audio and David Blackmer founder of DBX

    I look forward to your reply

    Cheers / Chris

  2. #152
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,779
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marco View Post
    It still acts as valid personal experience, from which to make an informed opinion on the matter, rather than simply worshiping at the altar of theory!

    What would matter to you more, the contents of an AES paper, or the results of what your own ears told you with a clock upgrade, if they contradicted the AES paper? And yes, I'd like an answer to that one please...

    And in terms of not convincing anyone but the person who does it, why so?

    If I've got a mate who's system I know almost as well as mine, including the CD player, and he's had the clock in the player's DAC upgraded, with no other changes whatsoever carried out to his system, and next time I visit, CDs consistently sound better, with a variety of familiar music, then I'm going to think that the clock upgrade has effected a genuine sonic improvement.

    Why wouldn't I?

    Marco.
    Okay let's look at the Audicom clock mod. Is it just the clock that they change out or is there more to it?



    That's a lot of gubbins. I've got CD players with less gubbins than that in total. So what does it include?

    Not only are three separate high precision regulators on the PCB, a large number of Sanyo Os-Con's and Black Gate's latest Capacitors support the Circuitry. The Board uses more than just the usual two layers and everything has been optimised to the highest degree possible. This extends to the Wiring on the clock output that is high purity Silver, chosen over coax cable after extensive tests.


    Now I know we both agree that changing the value of a component, or even keeping the value the same and changing it for one of a different material construction, can change the sound. So given that this is not simply swapping the crystal out for a better one how can you say for certain that it is reduced jitter that is responsible for the sound of the player being different after the mod? This looks like a whole raft of changes and boutique components.


    Given that you have no before and after jitter measurements and given the findings of the AES study that shows jitter has to be at high levels before we can hear it, and given that Sony were unlikely to have overlooked jitter reduction in their flagship DAC and transport combo, can you really still say for certain that the differences you heard were due to a reduction in jitter? Or would you now agree that there are more variables involved than you had previously considered?
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  3. #153
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,779
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gazjam View Post
    Digital sound quality, all sounds the same and anythings as good as you’ll ever need...not.
    Careful with that strawman Eugene. I mean Gaz.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  4. #154
    Join Date: Oct 2008

    Location: Glasgowshire

    Posts: 9,656
    I'm Gary.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    Careful with that strawman Eugene. I mean Gaz.
    No it's not...
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  5. #155
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,779
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gazjam View Post
    No it's not...
    Sorry, I'm not allowed to argue with you unless you pay.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  6. #156
    Join Date: Oct 2008

    Location: Glasgowshire

    Posts: 9,656
    I'm Gary.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    Sorry, I'm not allowed to argue with you unless you pay.
    That's the Spirit...
    AC POWER
    Hardwired 10kVA balanced mains powering entire system
    AMPS
    Meridian 557 power Amp (Modded) / PS Audio BHK Preamp (Modded)
    SPEAKERS
    Wharfedale Evo 4.4
    DAC
    PS Audio Directstream (Modded)
    TURNTABLE
    Pro-Ject X8 balanced output via XLR / Ortofon Quintet Blue cartridge
    PHONOSTAGE
    Pro-Ject DS3 B balanced Input (TT and Phonostage powered by Pro-Ject Power box RS2 linear psu)
    DIGITAL
    OPPO 203 (Modded: Linear PSU, i2s output to Dac) - Roon Endpoint, HDMI input used for all things Streaming/ PS5 /AppleTV ... also good for movies apparently?
    MUSIC PLAYBACK
    Tweaked AP-Linux based Roon Server into Oppo 203 as Roon endpoint
    Ipad Roon Remote.
    Apple Music/ YouTube via AppleTV, fed to Dac via Oppo HDMI input/i2s output to Dac.
    SPEAKER CABLES
    Biwired: Duelund DCA10GA (Bass) Duelund DCA16GA (mid & treble) Duelund 12DCA used as jumpers (On
    "Blackcat Cable" Chris Sommivigo's advice - yup, even with biwire it sounds better - and it does)
    INTERCONNECTS
    All Balanced: Ghost+ recording studio XLR cables

  7. #157
    Join Date: Aug 2009

    Location: Staffordshire, England

    Posts: 37,779
    I'm Martin.

    Default

    No it's not.
    Current Lash Up:

    TEAC VRDS 701T > Sony TAE1000ESD > Krell KSA50S > JM Labs Focal Electra 926.

  8. #158
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

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    I'm Grant.

    Default

    Oh yes it is
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  9. #159
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Wrexham, North Wales, UK

    Posts: 110,012
    I'm AudioAl'sArbiterForPISHANTO.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Macca View Post
    Okay let's look at the Audicom clock mod. Is it just the clock that they change out or is there more to it?



    That's a lot of gubbins. I've got CD players with less gubbins than that in total. So what does it include?

    Not only are three separate high precision regulators on the PCB, a large number of Sanyo Os-Con's and Black Gate's latest Capacitors support the Circuitry. The Board uses more than just the usual two layers and everything has been optimised to the highest degree possible. This extends to the Wiring on the clock output that is high purity Silver, chosen over coax cable after extensive tests.

    Now I know we both agree that changing the value of a component, or even keeping the value the same and changing it for one of a different material construction, can change the sound. So given that this is not simply swapping the crystal out for a better one how can you say for certain that it is reduced jitter that is responsible for the sound of the player being different after the mod? This looks like a whole raft of changes and boutique components.

    Given that you have no before and after jitter measurements and given the findings of the AES study that shows jitter has to be at high levels before we can hear it, and given that Sony were unlikely to have overlooked jitter reduction in their flagship DAC and transport combo, can you really still say for certain that the differences you heard were due to a reduction in jitter? Or would you now agree that there are more variables involved than you had previously considered?
    The electrical components used on the board combine to perform the function of the clock upgrade, and so their effect can't be assessed individually. It's cumulative, thus the board acts as one part (replacing the existing 'gubbins'), and so that's how its effect is assessed.

    Obviously I can't say for certain if the clock upgrade factually reduced jitter, as I didn't measure it (although Mark may have on his test bench), but since you're a fan of technical studies, there are plenty around*, documenting evidence of clock upgrades reducing jitter in the digital domain, for me to believe that they're intrinsically linked, notwithstanding numerous testimonials from people, such as Neal, who've had first-hand experience of carrying out such upgrades themselves, and of course my own.

    In that respect, it would certainly have been interesting to have taken some pre and post clock upgrade jitter measurements, and I'll ask Mark if he did, and what his views are on the matter, as I'd be confident that results would've backed up what my ears clearly indicated. The bottom line though, is that the clock upgrade carried out to my Sony DAC fundamentally improved its sonic performance, which demonstrated that there was mileage to be had in that area, even with 'flagship' gear, as indeed there will almost certainly be with any of your CDPs.

    * Here's a nice wee paper for you to read: http://digitalassets.lib.berkeley.ed...CS-2007-96.pdf

    Marco.
    Main System

    Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.

    Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.

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  10. #160
    Join Date: Oct 2008

    Location: Glasgowshire

    Posts: 9,656
    I'm Gary.

    Default

    From direct experience:
    Know that upgrading the clock in my Oppo 203 Blu-ray player noticeably improved everything, including Redbook CD playback.

    Video improvement was off the scale, but CDs sounded much better too.
    AC POWER
    Hardwired 10kVA balanced mains powering entire system
    AMPS
    Meridian 557 power Amp (Modded) / PS Audio BHK Preamp (Modded)
    SPEAKERS
    Wharfedale Evo 4.4
    DAC
    PS Audio Directstream (Modded)
    TURNTABLE
    Pro-Ject X8 balanced output via XLR / Ortofon Quintet Blue cartridge
    PHONOSTAGE
    Pro-Ject DS3 B balanced Input (TT and Phonostage powered by Pro-Ject Power box RS2 linear psu)
    DIGITAL
    OPPO 203 (Modded: Linear PSU, i2s output to Dac) - Roon Endpoint, HDMI input used for all things Streaming/ PS5 /AppleTV ... also good for movies apparently?
    MUSIC PLAYBACK
    Tweaked AP-Linux based Roon Server into Oppo 203 as Roon endpoint
    Ipad Roon Remote.
    Apple Music/ YouTube via AppleTV, fed to Dac via Oppo HDMI input/i2s output to Dac.
    SPEAKER CABLES
    Biwired: Duelund DCA10GA (Bass) Duelund DCA16GA (mid & treble) Duelund 12DCA used as jumpers (On
    "Blackcat Cable" Chris Sommivigo's advice - yup, even with biwire it sounds better - and it does)
    INTERCONNECTS
    All Balanced: Ghost+ recording studio XLR cables

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