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Thread: Balanced amp / output ?

  1. #1
    Join Date: May 2012

    Location: Dagenham Essex

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    I'm I'mteachingmarcotheartofpishanto.

    Default Balanced amp / output ?

    Hi People

    Some questions for the more knowledgeable than me

    How many hifi items have balanced outputs ?

    How many amps have balanced in's / out's , TT's not that I have seen ?, Cassette players , not that I have seen
    Tuners ? not that I have seen ? R2R yes some have the 3 pin connecters but are they balanced ?

    I have a CD player with balanced out's but dont have a amp with balanced connections

    Is the sound quality much improved if you use balance instead of RCA's

    Fanks in advance
    Music , fills the gaps between silence !

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  2. #2
    Join Date: Oct 2011

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    I'm Andrew.

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    I wonder if you can get a balanced grounding box?

  3. #3
    Join Date: Nov 2008

    Location: North Down /Northern Ireland/ UK

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    I'm Neil.

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    Not everything with XLR outputs or inputs is actually balanced. A true balanced design has dual differential circuit layout, so the left and right channels in the pre etc is doubled up. These are more expensive and some will argue overly complex with single ended being superior, because they are less complex. Both are valid designs, but to my ear balanced designs sound better, than most single ended designs I have heard, hence much of my system is made up of true balanced designs.

    True balanced designs generally have a lower noise floor than single ended designs.
    Regards Neil

    System 1 (Living Room) : Vinyl: AMG Giro Turntable, AMG 9W2 Tonearm, AMG Reference Armcable, Air Tight PC3 MC Cartridge PhonoStage: Passlabs Xono Digital: Esoteric P5 SACD Transport and Esoteric P 5 DAC, Sony HAP Z1es Digital File Player + Audioquest Jitter Bug, Computer Audio: Veracity Audio Mystra DAC + HP laptop + iFi Audio i Power, Wireworld Starlight USB + Audioquest Jitter Bug Tuner:Kenwood KT 7020 + Magnum Dynalab Signal Sleuth FM Amplifier Cassette Tape: Nakamichi CR5e Amplification: Pre-Amplifier Meridian G02 Power-Amplifier Meridian G56 Speakers: Anthony Gallo Reference 3.1 Audio Cabling: Signal - Atlas Mavros, Audience AU24 Speaker - Atlas Mavros. Mains Cabling: Audience AU24, Analysis Plus, TCI. Mains Distribution: Mark Grant Distribution Blocks, Mark Grant DC Blocker Equipment Tables: Target Audio B series + Track Audio Isolation Spikes Isolation/ Platforms: Bright Star Audio Isonodes, BASE 01, SSC Platforms.

    System 2 (Music Room) : Vinyl: Turntable 1 Loricraft Garrard 401 Turntable + SME 5 Tonearm, Graham IC70 Tonearm Cable + VDH MC10 cartridge Turntable 2 Modified Technics 1200 turntable + Triplannar 7 Tonearm + VDH Frog Gold Cartridge + Paul Hynes SR7 PSU Turntable 3 SME Model 20 Turntable + Graham Phantom Tonearm + Graham IC70 Tonearm Cable, Ortofon MC5200 Cartridge PhonoStage: Balanced Audio Technology VK10se Digital: Moon Andromeda CD Player, Toshiba 9500 DVD Audio Player Computer Audio: AMR DP777 DAC + Dell Laptop + iFi Audio i Power + JKenny JKSPIDIF + Wireworld Starlight USB Tuners: Kenwood 8300 Tuner, Revox B760 Tuner, Leak Troughline Tuner + EAR Stereo Decoder ReelToReel Tape: Revox B77 mk 2, Revox A77 mk3, Sony TC-377 Cassette Tape: Nakamichi DR10 Headphone: Audio Valve RKV2 OTL Valve Headphone Amp, Headphones Grado GS 1000, Sennheiser 560 Ovation2, Sennheiser 410SL Pre-Amplifier: Balanced Audio Technology VK52se Power-Amplifier: Music Reference RM200 mk1 Speakers: Anthony Gallo Reference 3.5 Audio Cabling: Signal - Audience AU24, Kimber KCAG, Audio Note ANVs, Barry Hunt Cables Speaker - XLO Type 6. Mains Cabling: Audience AU24, TCI. Mains Distribution: Mark Grant and Russ Andrews Equipment Tables: Clear Light Audio Aspekt Tacks Isolation/Platform: SSC, Bright Star Audio Isonodes, Naim Frame Record Cleaner: Hanns Audio

  4. #4
    Join Date: May 2012

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    My CD player is a Toshiba SD 9500 is this true balanced

    In the manual is says "Balanced output 4.0V 100ohm,XLR (L.R) X 1
    Music , fills the gaps between silence !

    TAT Sale post Leader " Marcos Mentor "

    Also a pishanto specialist confirmed by Head Daftee

    Real name " Allen " or "Zoomer Nut”, “Numpty Napper”.

    ±± KEEP IT REEL

  5. #5
    CageyH is offline European loan coordinator for Graham Slee
    Join Date: May 2012

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    If you have really long cable runs, then balanced may sound better.

  6. #6
    Join Date: May 2012

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    Quote Originally Posted by CageyH View Post
    If you have really long cable runs, then balanced may sound better.
    Hum , may does not sound convincing and make me want to go out and buy a balanced amp
    Music , fills the gaps between silence !

    TAT Sale post Leader " Marcos Mentor "

    Also a pishanto specialist confirmed by Head Daftee

    Real name " Allen " or "Zoomer Nut”, “Numpty Napper”.

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  7. #7
    CageyH is offline European loan coordinator for Graham Slee
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    It all depends on the length of cables, and the environment that said cables are in.

  8. #8
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: South West of England

    Posts: 246
    I'm Will.

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    Balanced interconnects' sole purpose are for hum and noise reduction - if this currently isn't an issue then going to balanced connections will be of no benefit. Most of the time in domestic setups the cable runs and short enough that hum loops / noise pickup aren't really an issue (obviously with the occasional exception, usually down to equipment with odd earthing / shielding or strange interconnects)

    Well designed equipment works perfectly fine connected together with unbalanced with low levels of noise and hum in a sensibly wired system (most of the time)
    Radford Revival
    www.radfordrevival.co.uk

  9. #9
    Join Date: May 2012

    Location: Dagenham Essex

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    Thanks Will , I have zero hum so looks like I have saved some money
    Music , fills the gaps between silence !

    TAT Sale post Leader " Marcos Mentor "

    Also a pishanto specialist confirmed by Head Daftee

    Real name " Allen " or "Zoomer Nut”, “Numpty Napper”.

    ±± KEEP IT REEL

  10. #10
    Join Date: Sep 2013

    Location: North Island New Zealand

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    I'm Chris.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Audio Al View Post
    Hi People

    Some questions for the more knowledgeable than me

    How many hifi items have balanced outputs ?

    How many amps have balanced in's / out's , TT's not that I have seen ?, Cassette players , not that I have seen
    Tuners ? not that I have seen ? R2R yes some have the 3 pin connecters but are they balanced ?

    I have a CD player with balanced out's but dont have a amp with balanced connections

    Is the sound quality much improved if you use balance instead of RCA's

    Fanks in advance
    Balanced audio finds use where you have need for long cable runs, it has ability to reject noise and offer wider dynamic range than unbalanced audio.
    However unbalanced can be made to similarly reject noise intrusion where opto coupling is used, and provide just as good, if not better ability for silence,
    in the process improving signal to noise ratio. The NSL32SR3 LDR for instance offers this ability, however requires much care with how it is powered.
    Marco might provide a review of a unit I sent to him late last year... if we are all good

    Some equipment that benefits from balanced audio includes phono stages, seen in the Audio Synthesis ADEQ product of the 1990's. Also headphones can be
    rewired for balanced audio and some amplifiers are provided with balanced inputs. Traditionally though balanced audio is used in recording studios and for live concerts.
    http://www.aviom.com/blog/balanced-vs-unbalanced/

    Whether balanced sounds better than unbalanced requires comparison using identical equipment. There is far more complexity with balanced audio. IMO the same advantages
    it offers can be attained with unbalanced, as explained above. That said some stages like phono benefit from being arranged with RIAA eq being balanced and turntables wired for balanced
    - which is due to the very small voltages involved. Taking this purist path requires attaining or building a balanced phono stage

    Generally converting unbalanced to balanced can be done with a THAT 1646 http://www.thatcorp.com/1600-series_...iver_ICs.shtml
    noting you need to regulate the current to each polarity of the devices power supply ( LM317/337 )

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