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Thread: Digital Confusion - Advice needed!!!

  1. #1
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 13,242
    I'm Adrian.

    Default Digital Confusion - Advice needed!!!

    OK, so even though I have worked in IT for many years, and am reasonably up to date on computers and have ripped all my CD's to a NAS drive for ease of playing I have not necessarily kept up to date with advances on digital music replay and streaming at hi-res etc. So I have been looking at several things and would like a bit of advice or views on what to go for bearing in mind that I do not want to spend lots of dosh but want a high quality of playback. To be honest it is all a bit confusing.

    Options as I understand it

    1 Use Audirvana, VOX or ROON on Mac in conjunction with a DAC connected to my HiFi, at present my choice of DAC would be the Beresford Caiman SEG which seems to be liked by quite a few on here and is not too costly

    2. Use Volumio with an ALLO – THE BOSS PLAYER (Raspberry PI 3 B+ and Allo BOSS I2S DAC) so ready to plug and play and I will be able to control it from my Mac or iPad etc

    3. Use Volumio with VOLUMIO – MINI86 and Beresford Caiman SEG once again control it all from Mac or iPad etc, also I could connect the MINI 86 to TV or the MAC by HDMI

    Can anyone advise me on Audirvana, versus VOX versus ROON versus, VOLUMIO as a front end from the point of ease of use and flexibility?

    Volumio with an ALLO – THE BOSS PLAYER seems to be the most cost effective solution, but would I be sacrificing on playback quality here?
    Would the Mini86 with the Caiman SEG be the better option or possibly using the Caiman SEG with another VOLUMIO device?

    Thanks in advance for any guidance given.

    Regards

    Adrian
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs: Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm, Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges, Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:- Marantz SA-KI Pearl CD player, RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi+ Pro, Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:- AudioValve Sunilda phono stage, Krell KSP-7B pre-amp, Krell KSA-80 power amp

    Output: Wilson Benesch Vector speakers, KLH Ultimate One Headphones

    Cables: Tellurium Q Ultra Black II RCA & Chord Epic 2 RCA, various speaker leads, & links


    I think I am nearing audio nirvana, but don’t tell anyone.

  2. #2
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    audirvana to a rpi works too wirelessly or wired. just another option. audirvana is under £100. roon is over £100, but every year. Trick is to try them out on a trial.
    having the connections already set up as up dont get all that long to test if you have issues getting it working. Jriver is another option(a bit cheaper too) works well and will connect to a rpi as well.

    they all have ipad apps
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  3. #3
    Join Date: May 2016

    Location: Notts

    Posts: 2,743
    I'm Geoff.

    Default

    I would go for an Rpi with the new Digione signature into a Caiman SEG with Dorado power supply. This is effectively my system (I am using the standard Digione though).

    Audirvana is great although I find you need a pretty powerful PC with plenty of fast RAM (16gb DDR4) to handle the upsampling. I am using an Intel NUC with i5 processor and 16gb DDR4 ram and that is enough to upsample to DSD128. The MAC version may require less in terms of hardware overheads.

    This setup sounds awesome. Tidal is fully integrated into Audivarna and their Masters HD files are superb.

    I prefer Volumio to other Rpi players because of its interface, but I don't think there are any differences in SQ between Volumio and Moode or the other Rpi software.

    Geoff

  4. #4
    Join Date: Feb 2017

    Location: Essex-Herts border

    Posts: 141
    I'm Matt.

    Default

    Haven’t compared your wish list myself, but I’ve been using a MacMini Audirvana/Tidal Hifi into my DAC for quite a while now. Very happy with the set up in all respects. Stability, reliability, sound quality, ease of use etc etc.
    As Geoff said, 4gb ram in the MacMini probably isn’t enough to ensure smooth running, aim for 8 or more.
    Other than that I can heartily recommend that set up & you can trial Tidal & Audirvana for a month before committing.

  5. #5
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    Think Ive got either 6 or 8 go ram and an i5 processor. I could up mine to 32/192 without any issues. I don't manage dsd Mines an rpi 2b But at that level of upsampling is sounds terrific out of the volumio2 app. Considering it's an old laptop and being used for other things too it's surprisingly good.
    Shows what can be achieved on a budget
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

  6. #6
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 13,242
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherwood View Post
    I would go for an Rpi with the new Digione signature into a Caiman SEG with Dorado power supply. This is effectively my system (I am using the standard Digione though).

    Audirvana is great although I find you need a pretty powerful PC with plenty of fast RAM (16gb DDR4) to handle the upsampling. I am using an Intel NUC with i5 processor and 16gb DDR4 ram and that is enough to upsample to DSD128. The MAC version may require less in terms of hardware overheads.

    This setup sounds awesome. Tidal is fully integrated into Audivarna and their Masters HD files are superb.

    I prefer Volumio to other Rpi players because of its interface, but I don't think there are any differences in SQ between Volumio and Moode or the other Rpi software.

    Geoff
    OK how about this and http://iqaudio.co.uk/home/52-pi-dac-bundle.html and then into Caiman SEG, the DIGIONE SIGNATURE PLAYER seems a bit pricey or is this actually better S/PDIF out quality?

    Thanks for the help,

    Adrian
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs: Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm, Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges, Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:- Marantz SA-KI Pearl CD player, RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi+ Pro, Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:- AudioValve Sunilda phono stage, Krell KSP-7B pre-amp, Krell KSA-80 power amp

    Output: Wilson Benesch Vector speakers, KLH Ultimate One Headphones

    Cables: Tellurium Q Ultra Black II RCA & Chord Epic 2 RCA, various speaker leads, & links


    I think I am nearing audio nirvana, but don’t tell anyone.

  7. #7
    Join Date: May 2016

    Location: Notts

    Posts: 2,743
    I'm Geoff.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AJSki2fly View Post
    OK how about this and http://iqaudio.co.uk/home/52-pi-dac-bundle.html and then into Caiman SEG, the DIGIONE SIGNATURE PLAYER seems a bit pricey or is this actually better S/PDIF out quality?

    Thanks for the help,

    Adrian
    The IQ board is fine but the Allo Digione is far better. Yes, it is considerably more expensive than other RPi audio boards, but it justifies the price. If the Signature model is too much for you to consider, then still go with the basic Digione. I am contemplating selling my Digione to upgrade to the Digione Signature though.

    Geoff

  8. #8
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 13,242
    I'm Adrian.

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherwood View Post
    The IQ board is fine but the Allo Digione is far better. Yes, it is considerably more expensive than other RPi audio boards, but it justifies the price. If the Signature model is too much for you to consider, then still go with the basic Digione. I am contemplating selling my Digione to upgrade to the Digione Signature though.

    Geoff
    Hi Geoff

    Will you be selling the DigiOne as stand alone or with Rpi? I am a quandary now as having read a bit more it seems the signature model and Caiman Seg is the best option of that ilk although a bit pricey all together width psus. I have also come across the ALLO kantata and the new version shortly to come out sounds like a very good all in one solution, whether better or not I have no idea, but much more cost effective. I am beginning to form some views on music player software and o have to say I have mixed views, have a read of my other thread.

    Thanks

    Adrian

  9. #9
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

    Posts: 13,242
    I'm Adrian.

    Default Music Player software?

    So I am trying to evaluate and get my head around what appear to be the main music players out there, which is proving to not be that easy.

    I have been trialling Audvirna 3+ on my Mac and it seems quite reliable and reasonably easy to use, although the UI is a bit old school, at least you can try it.

    Next up was Volumio, the interface looks good and from what I read about it seems generally liked. So I loaded onto an memory stick and booted the Mac off of it into unix running the software, everything looked good but no matter what I did it would not conect to WiFi, after several frustrating hours of searching the net I decided to split partition my macbook hard drive allocating 16gb for the Volumio boot efi/system. Then to port it from the memory stick onto this new partition using the feature in Volumio. Guess what it ported it but wiped my whole drive, great!!!! So I have had to restore the MacBook and am in the process of restoring from my backup. I have a suspicion that Volumio did not properly pick up the second partition on my hard drive and just wiped it at root by configuring the drive for unix, YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!

    So I have not been able to try out Volumio and cannot now until I get a Rpi, which is somewhat disheartening. However having read quite a bit about Volumio in the support pages and various forums it is now clear to me that it is not a simple plug n play in all cases and if it goes wrong the end user could soon be well out of their depth. Please bear in mind that I have worked in IT since 83 and currently as technical support, so I do not just point this out of frustration.

    So next step is to trial ROON running on my MAC once it is restored that is. If I like ROON then I need to decide whether to use the Mac as the server or a Rpi. I see that ALLO, hifiberry and IQaudIO products all work with it, I would just need to decide which suits best.

    So I have not ruled out Volumio, but I think it would have to be on Rpi. Audirvana is a possibility but it means tying up the Mac, and losing flexibility. Roon if I like the interface and QA then this may be the solution with it running on an Rpi connected to either a built on DAC or via an S/pdif to a Caiman Seg.

    It seems ROON may give the best flexibility but Volumio could as well if I can be convinced it’s reliable and not a geeks can of worms?

    Anyone out there who can give me their thoughts or advice on this, would be gratefully appreciated.
    Last edited by AJSki2fly; 22-10-2018 at 15:32.
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs: Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm, Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges, Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:- Marantz SA-KI Pearl CD player, RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi+ Pro, Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:- AudioValve Sunilda phono stage, Krell KSP-7B pre-amp, Krell KSA-80 power amp

    Output: Wilson Benesch Vector speakers, KLH Ultimate One Headphones

    Cables: Tellurium Q Ultra Black II RCA & Chord Epic 2 RCA, various speaker leads, & links


    I think I am nearing audio nirvana, but don’t tell anyone.

  10. #10
    Join Date: Feb 2013

    Location: W Lothian

    Posts: 99,005
    I'm Grant.

    Default

    volumio2 is usually used on an rpi. its pretty straightforward this way, as i can do it. i wouldnt have even thought of trying it on a mac
    Regards,
    Grant .... ؠ ......Don't be such a big girl's blouse

    I've said it before and I'll say it again: democracy simply-doesn't-work
    .... ..... ...... ...... ................... ..... ..... ..... ..... .....
    FIIO K7 BT, M11 PLUS, BTR7, KA5 - OPPO BDP-103D - PANASONIC UB450 - PANASONIC 4K ULTRA HD TV - PIXEL 6 - AVANTREE LR BLUETOOTH - 2* X600 SOUNDCORE - HEADPHONES INCLUDE, FIIO, NURAPHONES', FOCAL, OPPO, BOSE, CAMBRIDGE, BOWER & WILKINS, DEVIALET, MARSHALL, SONY, MITCHELL & JOHNSTON - 2*ZBOOK'S- MERCURY BD ROM, ROON, QOBUZ, TIDAL, PLEX, CYBERLINK, JRIVER - MULTI HDD'S -

    Oh my god! There's nothing wrong with the bidet is there?

    “Nothing discloses real character like the use of power. It is easy for the weak to be gentle. Most people can bear adversity. But if you wish to know what a man really is, give him power. This is the supreme test. It is the glory of Lincoln that, having almost absolute power, he never abused it, except on the side of mercy".

    “You see these dictators on their pedestals, surrounded by the bayonets of their soldiers and the truncheons of their police ... yet in their hearts there is unspoken fear. They are afraid of words and thoughts: words spoken abroad, thoughts stirring at home -- all the more powerful because forbidden -- terrify them. A little mouse of thought appears in the room, and even the mightiest potentates are thrown into panic.”

    "You don't have free will. You have the appearance of free will.”

    “There's a war out there, old friend. A world war. And it's not about who's got the most bullets. It's about who controls the information. What we see and hear, how we work, what we think... it's all about the information!”


    ***SMILE, BE HAPPY***

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