Denon DL-S1 MC cartridge

[Bigman80]

if its who i think it is,he's already got my SA so a fine collection of denons to choose from.

It is, and he will have a fine collection.

Easy transaction too.

[nickbaba]

It is... and it's looking like I do! Didn't really plan it that way but this and the SA both came up within a short time and I do like the Denon sound in my system, so wanted to give it a try on the same basis Oliver did eg if it's not working for me it'll get moved on again for a (hopefully) minimal outlay. Cheers Oliver for passing it on to me.

My only worry with the S1 is that at 14 um/mN it's getting up into the range of medium compliance. Should be fine for the Jelco 750D on my 1210 but I'm not sure it'll be a good match for my future (still under construction) TT with the Groovemaster ii titanium arm. The GM2 is rated for use with carts <20 um/mN but the titanium model is really designed for carts <10 um/mN.

[karma67]

nice one nick,id love to read your thoughts on the 2 and how they compare.

[nickbaba]

Yes I will add my impressions to the thread here, if Oliver doesn't consider it a threadjack...

btw for anyone who might be interested I heard back from Audio Creative who make the GM2 arm and they said any cart <15 um/mN will work with the titanium arm so that means all my Denons should be fine. Phew.
They actually recommend the DL-103 for the GM2, which is one of the things that attracted me to it, as its based on old broadcast transcription arms and the 103 used to be industry standard back in the day.

[Bigman80]

Yes I will add my impressions to the thread here, if Oliver doesn't consider it a threadjack...

btw for anyone who might be interested I heard back from Audio Creative who make the GM2 arm and they said any cart <15 um/mN will work with the titanium arm so that means all my Denons should be fine. Phew.
They actually recommend the DL-103 for the GM2, which is one of the things that attracted me to it, as its based on old broadcast transcription arms and the 103 used to be industry standard back in the day.

absolutely feel free to add your comments on here. Eventually, it may become a very good resource for anyone looking into the DL-S1

[worrasf]

Only just seen this thread - been away a while so apologies if I’ve missed the info but what SUT/Headamp are you (OP) using with the S1?

I only ask as I also am running an S1 (in a Jelco TK 850s) and for me it’s the perfect compromise. However, it only started to dance properly when I got the Denon AU-S1 SUT.




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[Bigman80]

Only just seen this thread - been away a while so apologies if I’ve missed the info but what SUT/Headamp are you (OP) using with the S1?

I only ask as I also am running an S1 (in a Jelco TK 850s) and for me it’s the perfect compromise. However, it only started to dance properly when I got the Denon AU-S1 SUT.




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My phonostage is MC only and has loading options in the form of loading plugs. Any amount ofloading can be supplied. I tried the usual suspects. Started at 100ohm to 470ohm, can't remember where I decided it was best if I'm honest.

[blake]

What kind of gain does your MC Phono preamp have and what kind of adjustment was made for the pretty significant discrepancy in output between the 2 cartridges?

[Bigman80]

What kind of gain does your MC Phono preamp have and what kind of adjustment was made for the pretty significant discrepancy in output between the 2 cartridges?

Hi Blake,

I don't have a figure for the gain as it's a DIY phonostage and ive never even tried to work it out. Gain was no issue though because it is quite high.

The only real way of adjusting for the discrepancies was via the attenuator on the preamp. I did use a sound meter app on my phone for some sort of reference point but it was all very unscientific.

[blake]

Hi Blake,

I don't have a figure for the gain as it's a DIY phonostage and ive never even tried to work it out. Gain was no issue though because it is quite high.

The only real way of adjusting for the discrepancies was via the attenuator on the preamp. I did use a sound meter app on my phone for some sort of reference point but it was all very unscientific.

No problem.

The spec'd output from these two cartridges (Ortofon Kb and Denon DL S1) is vastly different.
.47 mV vs. .15 mV. They have grossly different gain requirements, probably in the range of 8-10 dB with most "normal" systems. Just my opinion, but it's inconceivable that a gain level that would be ideal with one would be at all close to working well with the other.

While I admire the work you put in to make the comparison, under the circumstances I think it's pretty hard to draw any conclusion with respect to the overall quality of either cartridge though. A pretty good chance that one of these cartridges was severely handicapped with respect to proper matching to the phono stage; the best case scenario would be that they were both equally mismatched. Either way, not a great situation unfortunately.