you will get some noise from that sprung clip as the spring forces the plastic ring onto a boss on the spindle,when i say you get some noise im taking using a mechanics stethoscope lol too anal i know!
you will get some noise from that sprung clip as the spring forces the plastic ring onto a boss on the spindle,when i say you get some noise im taking using a mechanics stethoscope lol too anal i know!
My System
John Wood KT88 Amp.
Paradise Phono Stage
Sony TTS-8000 Turntable.
PMAT-1010 MK6 Tonearm.
Ortofon Cadenza Bronze
Sony X555ES Cd Player
Yamaha NS1000m Speakers
Location: Mildenhall, Suffolk
Posts: 380
I'm John.
Excellent Mark
As I see there are Oil-lites that look like they are seated into the Bearing Housing, I am feeling a similar lubricant as used on another Oil-lite design should suffice, as there are no flutes milled into the Oil-lite bush, it is looking like a Oil Bearing, as the flute will usually allow grease to come into contact with the spindle.
The 'Quantity' of lubricant will be hit and miss, so I think a slight
overfill ? and have a hypodermic needle on standby to draw any excess lubricant that escapes.
I was kind of hoping the Oil-Lites were live, as these are a quick fix solution to a design, and a off the shelf part with known variations in their production tolerances.
I know the Oil-Lites are reasonably cheap to purchase as a batch, and measuring to select a pair that will be better suited to the bearing housing and spindle is achievable, resulting in a smidgeon more mechanical control through tightening up the tolerances.
No room for a thrust pad down in the depths to further protect the housing from any unwanted wear ?
It is these little things that are reported to have a audible difference.
Or am I just going all Lenco on a TTS
lol yep you are. they dont need over filling imo,just a smear of oil,compairing them to lenco's is like oil or water.
you see this was my point earlier,an oil lite bearing is designed to not need oil,so why do you feel the need to,'over fill it' as you say with oil?
My System
John Wood KT88 Amp.
Paradise Phono Stage
Sony TTS-8000 Turntable.
PMAT-1010 MK6 Tonearm.
Ortofon Cadenza Bronze
Sony X555ES Cd Player
Yamaha NS1000m Speakers
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 542
I'm mark.
I'm not knocking Lenco's, (I am ) but they're not SOTA, never been near. L59 is a good design but subsequent decks were built to reduce costs. I'm throwing a blanket out there, but the 59 chassis is much stiffer than a75/8, the idler wheels got better, but thats about it.
It's not that I dislike them, they can be great, but it takes work and a lot of £££. Here's one I made earlier, there's nothing original Lenco apart from the idler arm and wheel !
IMG_5692 by mark leatherland, on Flickr
Back to the TTS, I put a couple of drops on the spindle and around the ball-end. I'll keep an eye on it.
Search has suggested SAE30, lawn mower oil...
i agree,im using compressor oil,sae30
My System
John Wood KT88 Amp.
Paradise Phono Stage
Sony TTS-8000 Turntable.
PMAT-1010 MK6 Tonearm.
Ortofon Cadenza Bronze
Sony X555ES Cd Player
Yamaha NS1000m Speakers
Location: Mildenhall, Suffolk
Posts: 380
I'm John.
I'm not trying to scupper anything, or am I even trying to present myself as a authority on the subject.
It seems to be a common consensus, that a unfaltering performance of a TT Bearing is one of the fundamental contributors to a TT delivering a outstanding performance.
I have just got a lot of reading under my belt on Lenco Bearings, as well as a friend with a man cave and a Stethoscope, with plenty of dismantled and reassembled bearing trials behind him, Lenco's, Garrard and TD160 are ones I know about, there are a couple of DD's in the room, but I have no knowledge of these being worked on.
I do know of bearings that are worked on, receive a Oil-Lite Bush assessment, and a exchange if believed required, before and after stethoscope analysis, and this analysis
has extended across different lubricants.
Whether every bearing worked on gets a replacement Oil-Lite, or if the design the known of bearings even uses a Oil-Lite, is not something I am not privy to, my main discussion on bearing parts has been limited to Lenco's.
As my PTP has a up to date bearing version, and my SP10 has been overhauled by Angus, I have not concerned myself with the DIY lubrication practical exercise, just the theories available through reading on other forums.
There is a lubricant that has been selected by my friend, that I have been informed has a effect on the
' what ever is listened to on a stethoscope ' that is deemed a near perfect end result, in the view from the man cave.
I am not privy to the type, another secret not to leave the man cave, but have been informed my Lenco Bearings should be passed on to receive the treatment.
I will one day take the PTP and GL75 to the man cave.
Hypodermics are known to be used when dealing with lubricant for bearings, my idea was based on that, as it a tool that is chosen by others who fettle with bearing lube.
I have been to my Linn Axis, GL75, PTP Solid 9 and SP10 and applied force by hand to the spindle, their feels to me, like no movement is taking place at all side to side, and definitely no audible knocking.
My concern with Oil-Lite inserts in a bearing housing is that these are known to have different tolerances and are not the perfect match for a design demanding tight tolerances.
If parts are not specifically selected for their match, a lateral or side to side movement can be felt when hand pressure is applied to a spindle.
This movement can be detected on the bearing assembly to the touch, and depending on how excessive, can be picked up as a audible knocking.
This movement and audible knocking, is potentially the end product of a not carefully matched Oil-Lite for the Housing/Spindle, and further increased by the Spindle being able to rotate in a concentric motion, causing a wear pattern on the Oil-Lite Bush, that allows for a further side to side movement, that is now identifiable with a movement that is audible.
This is a condition found on certain Lenco bearings that is overcome through the exchanging of the Oil-Lite Bushes, as stated before this post, it can be further improved, as discussed on Lenco Heaven, by buying in a batch of Oil-Lite Bushes and selecting a pair that has the closest measurement that is best for the Housing/Spindle arrangement through measuring the two parts to be interfaced by the Oil-Lite.
I know a few individuals, and read up on the works done by others, who have carried out the work to overcome the interface issues on a Lenco Bearing have reported back on the improvements.
As the TTS bearing does not have a Fluted cut on the inner face of the Oil-Lite Bush or a Thrust Pad and Ball, I don't think Grease is used in the assembly.
The Oil-Lite Bushes seem similar in their production and arrangement on a TTS as the Lenco so the TTS seems to be requiring oil.
I would have to enquire at the man cave, as well as revisit my readings again on the amounts of oil used by different individuals at the time of a rebuild on Lenco Bearing, to see if a direction offered was accepted by a TTS owner.
I hope this change in the direction of the TTS thread brings some valuable direction, as a vintage bearing on a TTS is as rare as the TT itself, so anything that can be done that offers a reassurance that the condition is preserved and the life cycle is extended, especially if a maintenance ritual is the outcome will hopefully be seen as a good practice.
yep all good info thanks john,the trouble is due to its rarity who is going to risk removing the bearing or how? if someone did it would be best to have the spindle machined as well as that would be worn/matched to the old bearing would it not?
on the other hand if i had a completely shagged one bought for peanuts id give it a go,i presume it just presses out?
My System
John Wood KT88 Amp.
Paradise Phono Stage
Sony TTS-8000 Turntable.
PMAT-1010 MK6 Tonearm.
Ortofon Cadenza Bronze
Sony X555ES Cd Player
Yamaha NS1000m Speakers
English is not my native language, so any grammar & spelling errors is due to my crappy Smartphone..
Speakers: Franco Serblin Accordo.
Amp: Yamaha A-S2100.
Turntable 1: Sony TTS-8000 in a TB-2000 plinth with:
Tonearm 1: Helius Phaedra & Benz LP-S.
Tonearm 2: Reed 2A & ?
Turntable 2: Garrard 401, Jelco SA-750E & Shelter 501 classic.
Phonostage: Modwright PH 9.0 w. US Amperex 7308.
Step-up: Allnic AUT-2000.
Head-amp: GS Elevator EXP.
Cables: AN Qssc, Belden 8402 & Audience au24.
http://www.discogs.com/user/Nonnegativ
Location: Mildenhall, Suffolk
Posts: 380
I'm John.
I reckon we all know a man who would laugh in the face of such a challenge, the type of man who takes a AT-1010 Tonearm by the Short and Curlies and Breathes ingenuity all over it.
The Spindle as far as I know, will have had a surface treatment that will make it extremely hard, the standard of finish will not be known, I suppose that is IP for the Company, Not even Sien, who makes bearing on Lenco Heaven would divulge that when requested, The case hardened metal will come into contact with a sacrificial material such as Oil-Lite, that would usually be the required replacement part at the time of a service, if wear was identified.
Time to search for a Bush Extractor, and I don't mean I am searching out an Adonis from somewhere.
Location: Derbyshire
Posts: 542
I'm mark.
Bearings an interesting subject, I've always prefered Garrard's over Lenco's going back so far I couldn't afford them and built a belt drive 'project'. I preferred the Garrard platter and bearing over the Lenco. It'd be interesting to compare examples with the same SPH bearing?
The issue with the TTS bearing is it can't be lubed while the spindles in place, I would suggest it was put together at the factory and expected to last and be lubricated for the life of the TT?
May be interesting to see some of the other TTS's to see if there's any wear?
As for fit, even dry it took some pulling and came out with a pop.
Garrard's and Lenco's have a felt washer to keep the top lubed (also Garrard & 124 motors have felt reservoirs) tech had moved on, and if we accept the car/bike analogy Japanese manufacturing was way ahead of ours in the late 70's.
Not sure if it's the heat, but I'm enjoying the TTS far more than I have previously, it's singing. I've had moments of indifference. Maybe it did need some oil??
As we've both mentioned SPH, I'm not convinced they're hardened at all. I've polished the pair I've had quite easily.
*I'm no expert either, but they 'work' much easier than the Garrard spindle which is known to be hardened.