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Thread: Incompetent turntable fettling

  1. #31
    Join Date: Jun 2010

    Location: Essex, United Kingdom

    Posts: 899
    I'm givingyouaprettygoodclue.

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    Been enjoying your thread. Over the past 5 years I've refurbed a TD150 and a Townshend Rock. I developed some basics skills and knowledge on the former and then used them to better effect on the latter. Some would see all this as distraction and inconvenience but I find the engagement that you get from DIY is one of vinyl's appeals. As with many things there's a satisfaction from having put something of yourself into it. Whatever one thinks of the LP12's performance the scope for upgrading seems boundless so as long as you're enjoying the sound I'd be tempted to keep going with her.

    Pete

  2. #32
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    Thanks Pete. I think I will stick with it. Especially if the plinth update comes about.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  3. #33
    Join Date: Mar 2019

    Location: Windsor, Ontario, canada

    Posts: 25
    I'm Bruce.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YNWaN View Post
    It looks like the first armboard was acrylic which is more brittle than people often appreciate. It’s not so much that you needed a pilot hole as you need a sharp drill (or forstner bit), not a spade bit as you may use for wood) and a gentle drilling pressure with the acrylic backed by a bit of waste wood to stop cracking as the drill goes through the last bit. The second armboard looks like an acrylic/stone mix like Corian or Hi-Macs. This is significantly heavier than acrylic, but is also a lot stronger and less likely to crack.

    Edit: it could be Staron too but all these silica/acrylic composites are very similar.

    More editing: looking at the two armboard the position of the arm mounting hole appear to be in very different positions with the new one being much more toward the edge....?
    For drilling these materials I like to clamp a bit of sacrificial plywood or something underneath to give support. Better safe than sorry!

  4. #34
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddlefye View Post
    For drilling these materials I like to clamp a bit of sacrificial plywood or something underneath to give support. Better safe than sorry!
    I think there are many better ways of doing it, than the way I tried. Clamping would have been good. A pilot hole would have been better.

    For those interested in this on going saga:

    I've been working more on the amplifier side of things recently. I've struggled with a hum that would go for a while and then reappear. I tried a different cartridge (OC9ML/II), playing around with cable and PSU placement, and finally an alternative phono amp. The latter has fixed it, so it looks like the Firebottle phono amp is to go.

    I think the Firebottle has a sweeter sound than the Emotiva XPS-1 (brought from Struth of these precincts) I have in place now, but the hum is just too draining. I've come to the conclusion that the Firebottle just doesn't suit my system. Alan's had the amp back and could find no fault in it, so it must just be a compatibility issue.

    Also I've recently, added a Audio Technica AT630 (from that Sherwood sold here) and am very pleased with the result. So I think the next step is probably a better SUT. I'll also get the Hana SL back in for a while to see how that works with the Emotiva/AT630 combination.

    I still want to replace the plinth, but I will probably wait until I've finished my experiments on the amp side of thing.

    So still fettling .... incompetently ... it's the only way I know.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  5. #35
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    After a little time mulling over my options and trying to come up with a plan of attack, I've finally started assembling parts for my next bit of turntable fettling. The more I've looked, the more options have appeared. So there is quite a lot I'd like to try.

    However, I've come to realise that if I want to experiment the first thing I need is a platform to make it easier for me to dismantle and reassemble my LP12. Linn maintenance stands, seem to be a little like hens teeth, so I've been looking into a DIY alternative. For a while I was seriously considering building a rotating stand based on a motorcycle engine stand.



    But it's just a little too small.

    Then a couple of weeks ago I was looking through the MachineMart website (where I'd found the engine stand) and I spotted a simpler and perhaps more flexible option. A pair of table legs used to build work tables. At £36 a pair, it seemed too good an option not to try it.

    At about the same time I picked up a plinth at a very cheap price. I don't think it will be my final plinth, but it gives me a platform from which I can try things out before doing them on my main deck. I picked up the legs yesterday, and I think they are going to work just fine. They should hold the turntable securely at a convenient height and allow me access to both top and bottom at the same time.



    So the next step will be to:

    • add a brace across the lower cross bars of the legs to secure them in place at the right distance apart. I'm not sure at the moment whether to use a couple of bars, or a piece of thick board. I'll probably try both.
    • get some neoprene strips to put along the top of the frame to protect the turntable
    • rig up a clamping mechanism.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  6. #36
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    The latest collection of parts arrive in the week. This time bits for the maintenance stand rather than the turntable. Namely some T bolts with "Knob nuts" , and a roll of self-adhesive cushioned neoprene strip.



    So it was time for a little assembly this afternoon - with the addition of some odd bits of wood I had knocking around. First the T bolts were attached to the top of the two frame legs. Then two strips of wood were cut to size and then two holes drilled in each to align with the T-bolts. Then neoprene strips were stuck to the top of the frame legs, and the undersides of the wooden strips.



    Then a piece of board was drilled and bolted across the frame leg cross bars to provide a little stability, and the whole lot assembled, using my spare LP12 chassis as a guide.



    Well this works .... but ....

    It's a little less stable than I was hoping. It probably needs an additional cross member or two.

    Also I hadn't appreciated how narrow the chassis sides are - which means there's only a thin strip by which to hold the chassis - that is, with the current arrangement the clamp is just pinching the outside edge of the chassis sides which isn't as stable as I thought it would be. Perhaps this image shows what I mean:



    Also in hindsight, I think I should have got thinner neoprene strips. I got thick strips, because .... well .. it more cushioning. But now I've tried it, I think thin neoprene would have been fine (it just has to protect the surface of the chassis, and both it and the frame are very smooth and flat - there's no unevenness that thicker cushioning would help with. The problem with thinker neoprene is that makes the whole sandwich within the clamp thicker - and the bolts are only just long enough.

    I'm wondering now whether it would be better just to use a couple of G clamps on each side as they will be less likely to get in the way and can be adjusted more easily.

    One thing I am very please about is how easy it was to dismantle once I'd finished having a play. As I've used bolts throughout, it was very easy to take it all apart - and the whole lot just collapses down to flat pack.

    So all in all, a good step forward but a little more fettling to do. I'm tempted to get the next set of parts order for the turntable now, but I think I'll give it a week for me to have a think about whether I need to do more work on the stand before jumping forward to the next stage of the project.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  7. #37
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    I should also mention the developments in my system up stream of the turntable itself. I recently purchased a Luxman AD8000 SUT from Hermit via this forum. David at MCRU made up a short run of Corvette Arm Cable to run between the SUT and the Phono Amp (still the Emotiva XPS-1). The result of which has been another step up in quality. I've had my Hana SL cartridge in for a while now and it's singing beautifully. However, I'll get the OC9ML/II back in, in the not too distant future and have another listen to that. I think now my AD8000/XPS-1 combination now sounds better than the Firebottle Plus (I really must get around to selling the later).

    For the first time in my chronic case of audiophilia I'm enjoying listening to LPs more that digital. I think I've got a good digital setup - but there's just something more alive and engaging to the sound I'm getting from my turntable now. I finding I'm even spending the ridiculous amounts needed for new vinyl without wincing - as the resulting music is so enjoyable. And I've falling back in love with trawling through second hand record shops.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  8. #38
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    A new set of clamps arrived in the week, so I've had a chance to try them out this week.



    This is a much better solution. The clamping is easier to fix in place, is more flexible, and still holds the plinth firmly in place. The clamps cost as much as the leg frames - but I think I'll find other uses for them so not a problem.

    A little tidying up to do (I'll have to get the sandpaper out later)

    So. Now I need to spend some money and buy my next set of mods for the LP12.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  9. #39
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    After a lot of mulling as to my next upgrade, I've gone and ordered a Stack Audio Sub-Chasis.



    I'd been considering replacing the top plate after reading a couple of reviews like this. But on doing a little more research and reading a few negative reviews, I decided to leave that for now. At £450 to £800 (Stack Audio Serene Ultimate and Tiger Paw Khan respectively), that seems like too much of a punt for my next step.

    A new chassis seems to be a safer bet and a little less pocket stretching at the moment. My choice of arm has restricted the choice a little, as I need a plinth that will take a standard fixing arm board. So options like the Tiger Paw aKula, Analogue Innovations Sole or Linn Kore are a no go. So the two main choices came down to the Stack Audio, and the Vinyl Passion Unity.

    I like the look of the Stack Audio kit, and they answered a couple of queries I had quickly and easily, so I plumped for that one. It's also the cheaper of the two, so that made the choice a little easier.

    I'm looking forward to being able to compare the new sub-chassis to the Cirkus I currently have. I hope that the fact that I'm fitting it myself will allow me to swap the two back and forth to do a decent comparison (rather than the: send it to a dealer to make the change, try and remember what it used to sound like and compare that memory to how it plays a couple of weeks later type of comparison).

    However it turns out, I'm looking forward to a little more fettling and of course - finding out whether my new maintenance stand works as I hope it will
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

  10. #40
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Worcestershire, UK

    Posts: 1,101
    I'm Rob.

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    Another weekend - another opportunity for incompetence.

    My new Stack Audio Sub-Chassis and Base Board arrived in the week; the latter being a bit of a last minute decision after a short conversation with Theo Stack via email. Excellent service so far from Theo.

    So my first chance to use my maintenance stand and almost a disaster straight away as the two legs moved apart and I almost lost the deck down between them. So first job, a cross brace to ensure that doesn't happen again.



    Then with the deck now securely in place I could take the base board off and start firkling (having already removed the arm, and platters).



    First thing I found was that the bearing and sub-chassic look original. I seemed to recall the seller mentioning Cirkus, but it must have been another upgrade. It didn't take too long to take the arm board off, the cross member, and then remove the springs. And the old sub-chassis was out. With the two out and side by side, it was obvious which looked the better engineered. And it was also clear which was the more acoustically inert.



    So then I started the re-assembly. I bought some new springs from Audio Affair as well last week, so fitted them. All was going well .... until I came to fitting the arm board. This image shows the problem:



    The small screw is one of three that have been holding my Konne arm board to the original sub-chassis. It's short and 2.5M. The longer screw is the one supplied by Stack Audio to fit their armboards. It's 18mm long and 3M. So too large a diameter to fit the inserts in my arm board, and the Konne screws are too short to fit through the new sub-chassis, which is much thicker at the attachment point.



    Unfortunately a trip around Screwfix, ToolStation, B&Q and Halfords was unsuccessful. None of them having screws that small. So ebay it is. I've order three sets - Slot, Posidrive, and Allen - to see which works best.

    I'm glad I went for the new base board. It's should be a lot better than the original bit of fibreboard it will replace.



    I also found that earplugs make the perfect bung for the bearing hole.

    Which all means it will be next weekend at the earliest before I have my turntable back up and running.
    Rob.
    Powered by crossed fingers and clenched buttocks

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