Gave up on vinyl

[Jimbo]

Well, you've heard my T/T at NEBO, with the Denon DL-S1, which others and you positively raved about. Did that sound "like a CD player", in the way you're inferring?

Think about that one....

So you're not really getting where I'm coming from, mate.

Marco.

Your turntable is spot on Marco, no doubt about that and when i heard it it certainly did not sound like CD!.

[jandl100]

Lol - so what took you so bloody long to discover the SQ limitations of Spotify?

IIRC, before that you'd been using it for years!

Marco.

Well, a combination of things, I think.

I'd started off streaming with Tidal on Justin's reccie.
I stayed with it for about a year, then an audio-buddy suggested I try Spotify Premium. I was dubious due to its lossy nature but gave it a go.
I think it was similar to Jim's turntable colourations which he seems to love so much - there were some tonal quirks and a slight smoothness (less rez) to Spotify that actually came as a bit of a relief compared to Tidal, which had come to sound a bit stark, insistent and forward.
So I kind of relaxed into the Spotify sound and revelled in the breadth of its catalogue (better than any other streaming service, ime).

But there came a day when an email from Qobuz gave me 3 months free trial at 16/44.
I appreciated getting the "Tidal rez" back and it seems rather more tonally neutral than Tidal (possibly setup dependent) so I can happily listen for hours.
So I have coughed up for a Qobuz 16/44 sub and cancelled Spotify Premium.
And that's where I am at the moment.
EDIT: And Qobuz has the advantage of being able to search by record label and also has a decent and growing proportion of "CD booklets" available for viewing.

[Stratmangler]

Fair enough, mate. That would be a pisser then, no matter how good it sounded. I have no such issues here with Chromecasting Tidal, via my Mac and network-enabled Sony home-cinema amp, through the rest of the downstairs system, where I then view the track content, etc, on my 49" HD Sony TV

Marco.

You Chromecasting is not far removed from what I've been doing for years.
In my case I access LMS (which is now being run on a RasPi), which in turn drives the Squeezeboxes, from either a web browser on any computer in the house, or using an app on my Smartphone.

[Marco]

Your turntable is spot on Marco, no doubt about that and when i heard it it certainly did not sound like CD!.

Cool, *but* which proves that you're not quite getting where I'm coming from mate, because in my view it has some of the best attributes of CD, as I outlined earlier, whilst still sounding like a good turntable. Therefore, by definition, in some ways it sounds like a good CD player.

I can't really put it any plainer than that

Marco

[Bigman80]

"I don't doubt that Ollie's SP10 sounds exactly as you describe. Plinths aside, which can fundamentally change their presentation for better or worse, turntables, such as SP10s, don't need modifying, as they were originally built as pretty much 'cost no object', unlike the SL-1200, which was rather more built to a price."

I agree with this. The SP10 doesn't need much help other than getting rid of the shite platter mat and sticking a Tenuto (or a n other) on it. That was the biggest upgrade I've made to an actual TT.

The plinth is Panzerholtz and the arm is incredibly good (thanks Phonomac) so no need for change there either.

[Marco]

Well, a combination of things, I think.

I'd started off streaming with Tidal on Justin's reccie.
I stayed with it for about a year, then an audio-buddy suggested I try Spotify Premium. I was dubious due to its lossy nature but gave it a go.
I think it was similar to Jim's turntable colourations which he seems to love so much - there were some tonal quirks and a slight smoothness (less rez) to Spotify that actually came as a bit of a relief compared to Tidal, which had come to sound a bit stark, insistent and forward.
So I kind of relaxed into the Spotify sound and revelled in the breadth of its catalogue (better than any other streaming service, ime).

But there came a day when an email from Qobuz gave me 3 months free trial at 16/44.
I appreciated getting the "Tidal rez" back and it seems rather more tonally neutral than Tidal (possibly setup dependent) so I can happily listen for hours.
So I have coughed up for a Qobuz 16/44 sub and cancelled Spotify Premium.
And that's where I am at the moment.

No worries, Jerry. The difference in my system is that, whilst I totally agree with you about the more "relaxed" sound of Spotify (in my view as a result of its inferior resolution), which is why I ultimately didn't get on with it after only about 3 months of using it, Tidal doesn't sound in any way "insistent and forward", simply more like music should do, in a high-fidelity sense, due to the source signal being less compromised/compressed.

With me, as soon as I detect an obvious bottleneck in the sound, compared with what I know is right, then it's out the window, as I'm not after anything that could be deemed as 'rose-tinted' or imbued with obvious coloration. I like to hear stuff, warts and all!

Marco.

[jandl100]

No worries, Jerry. The difference in my system is that, whilst I totally agree with you about the more "relaxed" sound of Spotify (in my view as a result of its inferior resolution), which is why I ultimately didn't get on with it after only about 3 months of using it

Well, yes - it just took me a bit longer.
-- and I do miss the extra scope of the Spotify catalogue a bit. But there's more than enough music of potential interest on Qobuz to keep me happy for several lifetimes.
Although if Spot started up a hi-rez service I would be first in the queue to sign up and give it a go!

[Marco]

A lot of these newer uber dac with s/n's of 128dB plus have lower noise floors and mega detail but Very few actually deliver a musically enjoyable and listenable sound that will captivate you for long periods of time.

Exactly my experience, which is precisely why, in my main system, I've stuck with using (now for over 10 years) an 'obsolete' Sony CDP and DAC, from the late 80s (albeit modified), the latter of which uses multibit technology!

Consequently, that's why it has some of the 'addictive musicality' you get from a good turntable, and why in my system there isn't a lot to choose between the performance of vinyl and digital, simply because my T/T has many of the attributes of a good digital source, and vice versa with my CDP/DAC - and none of that is an accident

Marco.

[Marco]

Oh man I love that sentiment. That is exactly what producing prints in a darkroom is about......

Lasting memories indeed, way beyond my lifetime.

Absolutely Shaun. The problem is that these days few folk appreciate genuine quality and are prepared to pay for it. It's all about what's cheapest and most convenient, which for me is a really sad state of affairs, compared with how things used to be in that respect.

As I said, the current attitude is indicative of our increasingly 'disposable society', where aside from anything else, nothing has any real value or longevity. Folk simply want a 'quick hit', and are unwilling to work at anything that requires some effort, in order to be rewarding - including their relationships [don't get me started on that one]!!

Marco.

[Haselsh1]

Absolutely Shaun. The problem is that these days few folk appreciate genuine quality and are prepared to pay for it. It's all about what's cheapest and most convenient, which for me is a really sad state of affairs, compared with how things used to be in that respect.

As I said, the current attitude is indicative of our increasingly 'disposable society', where aside from anything else, nothing has any real value or longevity. Folk simply want a 'quick hit', and are unwilling to work at anything that requires some effort, in order to be rewarding - including their relationships [don't get me started on that one]!!

Marco.

Yes Marco, a number of years back I had my own photo gallery in a cellar under a shop in Pickering, North Yorkshire and I sold framed prints of mainly black and white photographs. A lot of these were genuine photographs printed in the traditional manner but sadly, most of the general public didn't give a damn. There were of course the discerning few who could see the difference but most folk simply didn't care so most of what sold were framed digital prints in glorious colour.