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Thread: My Ultrasonic Record Cleaner

  1. #31
    Join Date: Jan 2008

    Location: Norwich

    Posts: 788
    I'm Mike.

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    Yes, I love my Henry too; cumbersome and annoying but utterly reliable and efficient.

    There's another thing I'd miss with an u/s machine. Brushing off the line of detritus from the felt pad. Little things, I know, but very satisfying when you can see what's just come off your record !

  2. #32
    Join Date: Dec 2012

    Location: Sonnin Common - Oxfordshire

    Posts: 213
    I'm Bernard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jac Hawk View Post
    This method of vinyl cleaning looks very interesting and i'm very tempted to give it a go, the initial post was very informative however the use of IPA had me a little confused at 1st until i realised people were talking about isopropyl alcohol and not Indian Pale Ale , seriously though wouldn't this work with a pre mix vinyl cleaning fluid such as the Knosti stuff?

    I have not tried using the Knosti pre mix, which could be an option. However, it would need to be diluted and might have a higher cost than the diy option!


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Turntable: Garrard 401 modded by Classic-HiFi in Hammertone. Heavy oak plinth by Russ Collinson; Tonearm: Jelco SA-750D; Cartridges: SPU GTE / VDH Colibri XGP / Decca SC4E rebuilt by ESCO with Paratrace; Phono Stage: Shindo ; SUT: Bob's Device Cinemag 1131; Pre Amp: Shindo Monbrison; Power Amp: McIntosh MC225; Speakers: Auditorium23 Solovox; CD Player: EastSound CD-E5 / Sony PS1; Cables: Yannis 423.5; Yannis 223.5; VDH The First Ultimate; Totem Sinew; Audio Tekne ARSP-500 / Auditorium 23.

  3. #33
    Join Date: Dec 2012

    Location: Sonnin Common - Oxfordshire

    Posts: 213
    I'm Bernard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YNWaN View Post
    Bernard, may I offer you enormous thanks for posting this very detailed description and list of components. Iíve been meaning to build myself an ultrasonic cleaner for a couple of years now but have yet to get around to it. Thanks to you I have just had the tank delivered (rather a nicely made thing it is too). So, another project for me to add to the list .
    Thanks Mark.
    Are you planning to build your own spinning device?


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Turntable: Garrard 401 modded by Classic-HiFi in Hammertone. Heavy oak plinth by Russ Collinson; Tonearm: Jelco SA-750D; Cartridges: SPU GTE / VDH Colibri XGP / Decca SC4E rebuilt by ESCO with Paratrace; Phono Stage: Shindo ; SUT: Bob's Device Cinemag 1131; Pre Amp: Shindo Monbrison; Power Amp: McIntosh MC225; Speakers: Auditorium23 Solovox; CD Player: EastSound CD-E5 / Sony PS1; Cables: Yannis 423.5; Yannis 223.5; VDH The First Ultimate; Totem Sinew; Audio Tekne ARSP-500 / Auditorium 23.

  4. #34
    Join Date: Dec 2012

    Location: Sonnin Common - Oxfordshire

    Posts: 213
    I'm Bernard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Reed View Post
    Interesting research project, Bernard. I note that you currently use a ratio of approx. 4:1 water to IPA ; marginally weaker than that, in fact, and as the ratio used by many RCM users is between 3:1 and 5:1, I wonder why you're thinking of reducing the IPA content.

    There's a lot of interest in ultrasonic record cleaning, due, no doubt to its supposed superiority over wet-vac. machines. However, for me, there's (currently) a major flaw, and that's by having to air-dry records. Not only (presumably) do you have to have a purpose-made rack which doesn't touch the playing surface, but you're allowing air-borne dust etc. to alight on the freshly cleaned record. Also not sure how you know when full evaporation has taken place prior to sleeving. Furthermore, is all the detritus extracted during the process mixed with the fluid as opposed to being extracted by vacuum on a standard RCM ?

    I may well have the wrong idea about some of these functions, but at the mo' I can see the disadvantages but not the overriding merits unless saving time is one.
    Thanks Mike.
    Re-IPA ... Some users only use distilled/de-ionised water + wetting agent. IMHO the use of IPAs solvent enhanced the cleaning process and reduce the air drying time.

    Due to the IPA evaporation off the solution, I am gradually testing a lower ratio by not doing any top-up. I will try 5:1 or lower when I change the solution.

    Air drying ... by putting the record on the dedicated VinylStack air drier (see my pic above), there is no contact and there is no dust sticking to the records. Even then, it would be only surface dusts, hence can be brushed away easily knowing that the groove is clean.

    Some guys are doing a final rince with distilled water then using a RCM, which could bring some benefits. However, I do not see the point of adding another cleaning record machine in the process at increased costs. By all means, do that if you already have a vacuum cleaner!



    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Turntable: Garrard 401 modded by Classic-HiFi in Hammertone. Heavy oak plinth by Russ Collinson; Tonearm: Jelco SA-750D; Cartridges: SPU GTE / VDH Colibri XGP / Decca SC4E rebuilt by ESCO with Paratrace; Phono Stage: Shindo ; SUT: Bob's Device Cinemag 1131; Pre Amp: Shindo Monbrison; Power Amp: McIntosh MC225; Speakers: Auditorium23 Solovox; CD Player: EastSound CD-E5 / Sony PS1; Cables: Yannis 423.5; Yannis 223.5; VDH The First Ultimate; Totem Sinew; Audio Tekne ARSP-500 / Auditorium 23.

  5. #35
    Join Date: Dec 2012

    Location: Sonnin Common - Oxfordshire

    Posts: 213
    I'm Bernard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by YNWaN View Post
    Iíve yet to personally clean a record with an ultrasonic bath but I have used one to clean a whole bunch of other stuff and I can tell you, without any shadow of doubt, that it is profoundly more effective than any brushing, scrubbing or vacuuming - even if very aggressive and volatile cleaning agents are used.
    I agree.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Turntable: Garrard 401 modded by Classic-HiFi in Hammertone. Heavy oak plinth by Russ Collinson; Tonearm: Jelco SA-750D; Cartridges: SPU GTE / VDH Colibri XGP / Decca SC4E rebuilt by ESCO with Paratrace; Phono Stage: Shindo ; SUT: Bob's Device Cinemag 1131; Pre Amp: Shindo Monbrison; Power Amp: McIntosh MC225; Speakers: Auditorium23 Solovox; CD Player: EastSound CD-E5 / Sony PS1; Cables: Yannis 423.5; Yannis 223.5; VDH The First Ultimate; Totem Sinew; Audio Tekne ARSP-500 / Auditorium 23.

  6. #36
    Join Date: Dec 2012

    Location: Sonnin Common - Oxfordshire

    Posts: 213
    I'm Bernard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by guy View Post
    Hi Mike,

    I am sure that Bernard will be in a better position to answer your questions (my only experience in ultrasonics are using ultrasonic probes to disperse PVC emulsions many years ago and,more recently, watching the effect of a small bath on my wife's jewellery).
    However, I think it must be safer to reduce flammable volatiles content to a minimum in the cleaning solution (not sure that the IPA is even necessary to be honest) as the ultrasonics could cause fast formation of a flammable vapour around the bath.
    The reason that I am not sure that IPA is needed is because the effect of cavitation together with a good surface active agent (emulsifier) would lift any dirt particles from the surface of the record and keep them in suspension.

    I have been very interested in this thread - I just need to persuade my wife to let me buy a bath!
    My only suggestion for improving the process would be to spray the cleaned record with distilled water from a "plant sprayer"? (perhaps IPA mix to speed evaporation?) to rinse off any remaining emulsifier at the end of the process.


    Guy.
    Good points Guy.

    As mentioned, I think that the use of IPA reduces the drying time, which is good as you do not want to leave the record outside too long.

    Will be reducing the ratio gradually though ...


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Turntable: Garrard 401 modded by Classic-HiFi in Hammertone. Heavy oak plinth by Russ Collinson; Tonearm: Jelco SA-750D; Cartridges: SPU GTE / VDH Colibri XGP / Decca SC4E rebuilt by ESCO with Paratrace; Phono Stage: Shindo ; SUT: Bob's Device Cinemag 1131; Pre Amp: Shindo Monbrison; Power Amp: McIntosh MC225; Speakers: Auditorium23 Solovox; CD Player: EastSound CD-E5 / Sony PS1; Cables: Yannis 423.5; Yannis 223.5; VDH The First Ultimate; Totem Sinew; Audio Tekne ARSP-500 / Auditorium 23.

  7. #37
    Join Date: Dec 2012

    Location: Sonnin Common - Oxfordshire

    Posts: 213
    I'm Bernard.

    Default My Ultrasonic Record Cleaner

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Reed View Post
    Thanks, Mark and (neighbour ?) Guy. I'm posing these caveats out of pure ignorance, but am swayed by your conviction that the actual process is superior (however applied). As a VPI user, I can only compare what I do know with what I envisage about ultrasonic cleaners. As I mentioned, I can't understand why the drying process, which I find very important, can't be incorporated into a/the machine, thus presenting a viable all-round superior product.

    There is no way that I'd clean records and leave them out to dry for 10 to 15 minutes. Certainly, with an IPA mix, that drying process is more efficient with the record in a horizontal position (in my case, this is by short-term evaporation), whereas rack drying, to my mind, can only be done (almost) vertically.

    I have a local audiophile DIY friend who is also interested in making his own machine. As he builds amplifiers, DACs, phono stages and speakers as a hobby, I respect his enthusiasm for ultrasonics and shall refer him to this thread and Bernard's research.
    Thanks Mike. There are some diy drying devises available (fan based) which can be mounted on the tank.

    I currently can dry up to 6 records at once, using the VinylStack holder. I will be purchasing the very cheap IKEA plastic dish drainer to dry more records at once.
    https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/...-art-40176950/

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    Last edited by Berni217; 23-05-2018 at 20:55.
    Turntable: Garrard 401 modded by Classic-HiFi in Hammertone. Heavy oak plinth by Russ Collinson; Tonearm: Jelco SA-750D; Cartridges: SPU GTE / VDH Colibri XGP / Decca SC4E rebuilt by ESCO with Paratrace; Phono Stage: Shindo ; SUT: Bob's Device Cinemag 1131; Pre Amp: Shindo Monbrison; Power Amp: McIntosh MC225; Speakers: Auditorium23 Solovox; CD Player: EastSound CD-E5 / Sony PS1; Cables: Yannis 423.5; Yannis 223.5; VDH The First Ultimate; Totem Sinew; Audio Tekne ARSP-500 / Auditorium 23.

  8. #38
    Join Date: Sep 2014

    Location: brighton uk.

    Posts: 3,462
    I'm jamie.

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    playing devils advocate here,doesn't any water sludge/dirt get left on the record when you just air dry?
    My System/ Yamaha NS1000M speakers ,Pioneer PLC-590 turntable,Pioneer PA-5000 and PMAT-1010 Tonearms,AT-ART 7 Cartridge,Denon HA-500 Head Amp, John Wood KT88 Valve Amp, Nakamichi ca5 pre ampSony X555ES CD Player,

  9. #39
    Join Date: Sep 2012

    Location: Derbyshire

    Posts: 309
    I'm mark.

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    I've only ever used Knosti cleaner, the best results I've achieved are with a second bath and rinse in distilled water.

    Distilled water beads off the record with no residue left, it's fairly obvious when the liquid becomes contaminated with cleaning solution as it stops beading and 'clings' to the record.

  10. #40
    Join Date: Nov 2010

    Location: Chorley, Lancs

    Posts: 1,788
    I'm Mike.

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    Been seriously looking into getting an ultrasonic machine and came across this video



    the guy is a little boring, but explains the machine, how it works and more importantly the solution he uses very well.

    Some of the guys that have posted on this thread seem sceptical about air drying, my personal view is that as long as you can't hear any difference it's ok, my only caveat would be if you want to clean then listen straight after. Finally most of the attachments i.e. the spindle and motor assembly you need seem only to be available from abroad, i personally don't like buying from outside the UK if i can help it, but the guy in the video is based in the UK and sells the whole thing on ebay.


    As the late Colonel Sanders once said
    "I'm too drunk to taste this chicken!!"

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