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Thread: Anyone use solid state for the bass and valve for mid and treble

  1. #41
    Join Date: Nov 2017

    Location: Vancouver, WA USA

    Posts: 5
    I'm Bruce.

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    So, I'm feeling like a total impostor in this crowd, but I've done something not unlike this and much simpler in my system. I have a pair of SET amps monoblocked at 10 W each - the mids and highs are sweet but the bass is (was) pretty uncontrolled with my original speakers. Last year I went with two upgrades: a set of line transmission speakers with just a 4-inch driver, and a vintage McIntosh 250 SS amp. My preamp has two sets of outputs, one now leads to the McIntosh to drive a pair of B&W 500s and a subwoofer, while the other set feeds the monoblocks/line speakers. I essentially now have two separate systems driven by the same source, superimposed. I tuned the relative volume levels and balances of each system by ear. I wasn't expecting much but wow, I now have the sweet tube sound and a very tight lower end, it really worked. (The McIntosh side does a pretty competent job on its own, but the tube enhancement pushes this into another realm to my ears.) I'm sure this is still a junior system compared to what I'm reading about on this thread but I'm really enjoying it.

    Cheers

    Bruce

  2. #42
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: Southall, West London

    Posts: 36,860
    I'm Geoff.

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    The appreciation and enjoyment are all that matter Bruce.

  3. #43
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: souf east for work

    Posts: 988
    I'm paul.

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    Yes indeed Bruce, if it sounds good to you that matters more than all the measurements in the world. Enjoy
    Sony STR 6055 Denon DP80 Stax UA-70 Shure Ultra 500 in a Martin Bastin body with jico stylus Zu omen

    Office system, DIY CSS fullrange speakers with aurum cantus G2 ribbons Najda dsp as dac Akai AM-U02 Jvc QL-A51 direct drive turntable
    SAE1000LT leema sub. JVC Z4S cart is in the house

    Garage system another Sony receiver, cassette deck and full range drivers in free air


    System components are subject to change without warning and at the discretion of the owner.

  4. #44
    Join Date: Feb 2010

    Location: Berkshire, UK

    Posts: 3,250
    I'm Tom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pharos View Post
    Our own sensitivities and sensibilities have to come into this.

    I've seen so many designers say that certain frequency ranges should not be divided across different drivers, and then another designer blatantly breaks those rules.

    For eg., B Woodman states that the human voice must all be covered by one driver, (with the exception of fundamentals I suppose), which is about 300 to 3000Hz with his mid driver.

    Then another designer of a new speaker has a Xover right in the middle of the vocal range, and it doesn't stand out as sounding particularly wrong.
    eh? 300hz is something like D above middle C. Singing voice fundamentals range from about 70-80 hz (a good Russian bass) to about 600hz (a good Coloratura Soprano) - what you need to cover the fundamentals is something like a Tannoy Dual Concentric that runs all the way from low bass up to 800hz-1khz. That mid driver is exactly in the WRONG place.
    Main: Speakers 'RFC' Tannoy Canterburys / custom crossovers with Tannoy ST25 supertweeters; Amp - Radford STA100; Pre EAR 912; Vinyl: Thorens TD124 MkII + Ikeda IT345-CR1 9 inch and Ikeda IT-407 12 inch tonearms; Cartridges Stereo - Miyajima Madake, Miyajima Takumi, Ikeda 9TT, SAEC/Excel C3; Mono - Miyajimas - Zero 0.7, Premium 1.0, Edison '78' 4.0 conical, and Shure M44 strapped for mono with several Expert Stylus conicals for different eras of 78s; Phono stage and SUT from EAR 912 + Miyajima ETR-Mono SUT; Esoteric Sound Re-Equalizer for equalisation of early mono and 78, switchable in from tape loop; Digital: Audio Note CDT2/II transport, heavily modded AN Kit DAC + Mutec MC3+USB.

    Study: Speakers - Tannoy DC6; Amp: Pass Aleph 'Mini'; tube preamp - Gate Audio tube; Vinyl: Garrard 401 with AT1503 Mk I tonearm and vintage Ortofon SL-15e with matching Ortofon 2-15k SUT; Phono Stage from Gate Audio preamp; Digital - Trichord Genesis III CDP + Arcam rBlink.

  5. #45
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: souf east for work

    Posts: 988
    I'm paul.

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    Quote Originally Posted by montesquieu View Post
    eh? 300hz is something like D above middle C. Singing voice fundamentals range from about 70-80 hz (a good Russian bass) to about 600hz (a good Coloratura Soprano) - what you need to cover the fundamentals is something like a Tannoy Dual Concentric that runs all the way from low bass up to 800hz-1khz. That mid driver is exactly in the WRONG place.
    300hz - 3000hz worked for me in a 3way horn set up.
    Sony STR 6055 Denon DP80 Stax UA-70 Shure Ultra 500 in a Martin Bastin body with jico stylus Zu omen

    Office system, DIY CSS fullrange speakers with aurum cantus G2 ribbons Najda dsp as dac Akai AM-U02 Jvc QL-A51 direct drive turntable
    SAE1000LT leema sub. JVC Z4S cart is in the house

    Garage system another Sony receiver, cassette deck and full range drivers in free air


    System components are subject to change without warning and at the discretion of the owner.

  6. #46
    Join Date: Feb 2010

    Location: Berkshire, UK

    Posts: 3,250
    I'm Tom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by paulf-2007 View Post
    300hz - 3000hz worked for me in a 3way horn set up.
    Nevertheless you've put a crossover right on the middle note of the piano, around the higher end of baritone vocal range and lower end of soprano, or right where the cello and violin overlap as melody instruments. Not ideal I would suggest.
    Main: Speakers 'RFC' Tannoy Canterburys / custom crossovers with Tannoy ST25 supertweeters; Amp - Radford STA100; Pre EAR 912; Vinyl: Thorens TD124 MkII + Ikeda IT345-CR1 9 inch and Ikeda IT-407 12 inch tonearms; Cartridges Stereo - Miyajima Madake, Miyajima Takumi, Ikeda 9TT, SAEC/Excel C3; Mono - Miyajimas - Zero 0.7, Premium 1.0, Edison '78' 4.0 conical, and Shure M44 strapped for mono with several Expert Stylus conicals for different eras of 78s; Phono stage and SUT from EAR 912 + Miyajima ETR-Mono SUT; Esoteric Sound Re-Equalizer for equalisation of early mono and 78, switchable in from tape loop; Digital: Audio Note CDT2/II transport, heavily modded AN Kit DAC + Mutec MC3+USB.

    Study: Speakers - Tannoy DC6; Amp: Pass Aleph 'Mini'; tube preamp - Gate Audio tube; Vinyl: Garrard 401 with AT1503 Mk I tonearm and vintage Ortofon SL-15e with matching Ortofon 2-15k SUT; Phono Stage from Gate Audio preamp; Digital - Trichord Genesis III CDP + Arcam rBlink.

  7. #47
    Join Date: Mar 2017

    Location: Seaford UK

    Posts: 686
    I'm Dennis.

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    I think that B W's argument was more about getting most of the harmonics from the same driver, the fundamentals could perhaps be from a separate driver, and these the ear is less sensisitive to.

    It is difficult to remember verbatim a discussion with him some 20 years ago.

  8. #48
    Join Date: Feb 2010

    Location: Berkshire, UK

    Posts: 3,250
    I'm Tom.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pharos View Post
    I think that B W's argument was more about getting most of the harmonics from the same driver, the fundamentals could perhaps be from a separate driver, and these the ear is less sensisitive to.

    It is difficult to remember verbatim a discussion with him some 20 years ago.
    Interesting point. Well that would certainly achieve that.
    Main: Speakers 'RFC' Tannoy Canterburys / custom crossovers with Tannoy ST25 supertweeters; Amp - Radford STA100; Pre EAR 912; Vinyl: Thorens TD124 MkII + Ikeda IT345-CR1 9 inch and Ikeda IT-407 12 inch tonearms; Cartridges Stereo - Miyajima Madake, Miyajima Takumi, Ikeda 9TT, SAEC/Excel C3; Mono - Miyajimas - Zero 0.7, Premium 1.0, Edison '78' 4.0 conical, and Shure M44 strapped for mono with several Expert Stylus conicals for different eras of 78s; Phono stage and SUT from EAR 912 + Miyajima ETR-Mono SUT; Esoteric Sound Re-Equalizer for equalisation of early mono and 78, switchable in from tape loop; Digital: Audio Note CDT2/II transport, heavily modded AN Kit DAC + Mutec MC3+USB.

    Study: Speakers - Tannoy DC6; Amp: Pass Aleph 'Mini'; tube preamp - Gate Audio tube; Vinyl: Garrard 401 with AT1503 Mk I tonearm and vintage Ortofon SL-15e with matching Ortofon 2-15k SUT; Phono Stage from Gate Audio preamp; Digital - Trichord Genesis III CDP + Arcam rBlink.

  9. #49
    Join Date: Oct 2009

    Location: Birmingham, UK

    Posts: 311
    I'm Phil.

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    Hi again folks , I ended up buying a monocor sta800d amp 300 , these use all hypex modules , and you cant buy the parts for this money so a bit of a
    bargain I think , I managed to match the gain using a multi metre on ac , and used both volume controls on the sta800d to match the gain of the ming da 805 mono blocks , I had to separate the bass crossover from the mid and tweeter section , and all is now working great , after listening to a lot of
    well known tracks it has given the bass more punch and drive , and I think the extra current that the mid and tweeter are now getting has improved
    as well , i did try the amp running the whole system but its not for me , but doing bass duties only its great . hopefully my views wont change . phil
    Last edited by oceanobsession; 13-01-2018 at 19:38.
    Phil.

  10. #50
    Join Date: Apr 2016

    Location: souf east for work

    Posts: 988
    I'm paul.

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    Quote Originally Posted by oceanobsession View Post
    Hi again folks , I ended up buying a monocor sta800d amp 300 , these use all hypex modules , and you cant buy the parts for this money so a bit of a
    bargain I think , I managed to match the gain using a multi metre on ac , and used both volume controls on the sta800d to match the gain of the ming da 805 mono blocks , I had to separate the bass crossover from the mid and tweeter section , and all is now working great , after listening to a lot of
    well known tracks it has given the bass more punch and drive , and I think the extra current that the mid and tweeter are now getting has improved
    as well , i did try the amp running the whole system but its not for me , but doing bass duties only its great . hopefully my views wont change . phil
    Sony STR 6055 Denon DP80 Stax UA-70 Shure Ultra 500 in a Martin Bastin body with jico stylus Zu omen

    Office system, DIY CSS fullrange speakers with aurum cantus G2 ribbons Najda dsp as dac Akai AM-U02 Jvc QL-A51 direct drive turntable
    SAE1000LT leema sub. JVC Z4S cart is in the house

    Garage system another Sony receiver, cassette deck and full range drivers in free air


    System components are subject to change without warning and at the discretion of the owner.

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