Cheap upgrade for michell gyro

[02GF74]

Ok, I'm a bit late to this party. I'd be looking to upgrade the suspension towers om my Gyro.

BUT I notice that Peter, user gwernaffield, had not posted since February 2022.

Anyone knows if Peter still is making the parts?

[33na3rd]

Ok, I'm a bit late to this party. I'd be looking to upgrade the suspension towers om my Gyro.

BUT I notice that Peter, user gwernaffield, had not posted since February 2022.

Anyone knows if Peter still is making the parts?

Peter's new user name is "rocking kid".

Pete's Pylons and other Gyro/Orbe goods can be purchased from "True Point Audio".

https://www.truepointaudio.com

[rocking kid]

but this time they wont appear before i am ready

[rocking kid]

yes i am ..https://www.maverick-hifi.com/post/m...11484?trail=80

[Hammer]

Got the feet as well.Didn't say they were cheap,but hey you can't take it with you☺.Together they have made a big improvment to the sound.

[TAD12]

Hi there, I've just applied a mod to the feet on my Odyssey. I used Target Audio speaker feet (years old, sitting in a drawer unused) under the Michell feet.The Michell feet sit snug inside the Target audio feet, which were designed for metal spikes and much more weight than the Odyssey generates. The Target feet then sit on top of SDS anti-vibration pads. Just now, also awaiting a granite slab offcut from a kitchen installer to finish off the base. If anyone wants a link to the feet then pm me.

Excellent work from Peter.

Kind regards.

T.

[BendBound]

A month or so back, I learned about Peter's suspension upgrade from a friend of mine who also has a JA Michell GyroDec. He has been in a long search for how to get this turntable to sound better or even as good as a lower end turntable he also uses. Both of us over the years have investigated various upgrades to these wonderful but in one way seriously flawed turntables. We each had issues with the performance of the turntable that we found frustrating to solve. Something was robbing the sound reproduction in these turntables and it was hard to understand why. As we all know, Gert Pedersen in Denmark has done a lot to get these Michell turntables to the next level. So has SolidAir. A lot of those efforts surround improvements to suspension, eliminating a natural resonator called a spring. However, I was not prepared to take a drill to my suspension or use sand in some of the suggested modifications. I mean, it was more likely that I would sell the turntable than do that to it and I know for a fact that my friend was of the same mind.

Besides using acrylic toroids under the armboard, my friend and I have experimented with employing vibration control devices under platforms that the turntables sits upon. In my case, I was astonished at the improvement that passive vibration control devices brought. That really tightened up every aspect of the sound reproduction. As a consequence, I felt that I had eliminated most of the issues that derive from undampened spring vibrations in the GyroDec. I was by and large satisfied and I shared that view the other day with Mad-Moon as we discussed upgrade options for the GyroDec.

So a few weeks ago, my friend and I made the necessary measurements to get our GyroDecs fitted with Peter's "castlenut" suspension assemblies. The design reminded me of the suspension bridge over the River Tweed at Peebles, Scotland. Also, transmission towers use a similar structural design; it is very stable, incredibly strong and an effective design. What Peter has come up with is a significant design evolution from the SolidAir approach. So together we pulled the trigger and ordered sets. They arrived in a week once shipped from the UK to the US.

Friday I installed the new pylon suspension system. My measurements were bang on and the pylons installed quickly, in less than 30 minutes, soap to nuts. I did not employ the included sorbothane pads, instead I used Herbie's Audio's Grungebuster material. I punched out a 1/4" diameter disc on 1/8" thick Grungebuster with adhesive backing. That fit perfectly on the top part of the lower suspension post and slips into the upper post perfectly. The adhesive backing meant that the vibration-absorbing pad stayed on the lower post. I employed the ceramic bearings because I did not believe the static load on the turntable was large enough to adversely impact the bearing. I did remove the green copper grease in the upper post and replaced it with a small dab of silicone grease. I have not yet installed the ceramic ball bearing on the main bearing. That change is pending. It took only a few minutes with several bubble levels to get the GyroDec properly level.

Then I pulled out a small stack of records that I have been playing recently. First in the stack is Kate Wolf's 1975-1985 Retrospective. This is what I heard. The detail is just better all the way around but not analytical. The sound stage is the biggest difference. Everything seems to be in a natural and sweet focus. The bass is taut and firm, just right. Overall a nicer tone, not muddled. Crisp sounding, as if Kate was performing in the room, just right. I did not think the difference would be like this. Other changes I've made produced a stunning improvement. The change here is in tone. Little things all around improved that tighten up the sound reproduction. An overall sweeter tone. Detail across the audio frequency spectrum was just better. Quite relaxed. Just sweet.

Then I put on a jazz record that I know well and have been playing lately, Music Matters SRX release of Horace Silver's Song of My Father. The difference here was pronounced. Particularly on the drums and hi-hats. The change just jumped out at me in literally a head-turning, can-you-believe-that moment. Here the bass response was unreal, just so much better. I had commented a month or so ago on the Steve Hoffman Forum in a Music Matters thread that the drum kit was polite in this pressing, a bit subdued. I did not necessarily hear that so pronounced on the mostly acoustic guitar Kate Wolf album. But on this jazz title, it was more than obvious. As I listened to more and more records, I was pleasantly surprised at what I was hearing.

I told my friend that I believe the changes we’ve just made have moved this turntable to a new, better and higher level. The cost for this upgrade is relatively minimal, particularly in relation to the entire turntable cost. A local audiophile friend who knows my system well was over on Friday afternoon. He said this: “Your turntable before sounded awesome. Now that I hear some of the same titles again, what I hear is the muddiness is gone. I would never have described your turntable as muddy. But now I hear a new clarity and all of its attendant impacts on imaging and soundstage. The biggest impact is in the bass because it’s not muddy. Instead it’s more defined, refined and louder." We played some five or six records, selected cuts.

The turntable sounded really good to me before I installed Peter's suspension. For me it was hard to imagine a leap in performance. Given what I have done prior, I was thinking I would hear an incremental improvement. The improvement, however, is one of immediate refinement and it is quite obvious. This suspension makes the GyroDec just better overall in hard-to-articulate ways. The hotness or stridency or metallic sounding as in the upper registers is tamed. The bass is super clear and powerful. Best of all is a beautiful soundstage and imaging. Nice note decay in imaging and soundspace is extended. Just lots of refinement. The best way to describe what I now hear is refinement to every aspect of sound reproduction. And that is sweet.

One more change that I made here. Now under each of the three "orbital lander" footers on the Michell, I have placed a Grungebuster disc inside one of these lamp check rings (https://www.grandbrass.com/item/crt1...ckrings-18ips/). The 1/8" thick Grungebuster has an adhesive on one side and in this application, it is up, and in contact with the Michell footer. This Grungebuster is several thousands of an inch proud of the lamp check ring, so the ring does not touch the maple base or the turntable for that matter. I did not want to install skateboard wheels on the turntable, so these pads are my solution to potential movement of the table on the maple blocks in my system.

I told my friend who introduced me to Peter's suspension system that I was really glad he found this upgrade and shared it with me.

And to you Peter. Thank you! Well done.

[33na3rd]

A month or so back, I learned about Peter's suspension upgrade from a friend of mine who also has a JA Michell GyroDec. He has been in a long search for how to get this turntable to sound better or even as good as a lower end turntable he also uses. Both of us over the years have investigated various upgrades to these wonderful but in one way seriously flawed turntables. We each had issues with the performance of the turntable that we found frustrating to solve. Something was robbing the sound reproduction in these turntables and it was hard to understand why. As we all know, Gert Pedersen in Denmark has done a lot to get these Michell turntables to the next level. So has SolidAir. A lot of those efforts surround improvements to suspension, eliminating a natural resonator called a spring. However, I was not prepared to take a drill to my suspension or use sand in some of the suggested modifications. I mean, it was more likely that I would sell the turntable than do that to it and I know for a fact that my friend was of the same mind.

Besides using acrylic toroids under the armboard, my friend and I have experimented with employing vibration control devices under platforms that the turntables sits upon. In my case, I was astonished at the improvement that passive vibration control devices brought. That really tightened up every aspect of the sound reproduction. As a consequence, I felt that I had eliminated most of the issues that derive from undampened spring vibrations in the GyroDec. I was by and large satisfied and I shared that view the other day with Mad-Moon as we discussed upgrade options for the GyroDec.

So a few weeks ago, my friend and I made the necessary measurements to get our GyroDecs fitted with Peter's "castlenut" suspension assemblies. The design reminded me of the suspension bridge over the River Tweed at Peebles, Scotland. Also, transmission towers use a similar structural design; it is very stable, incredibly strong and an effective design. What Peter has come up with is a significant design evolution from the SolidAir approach. So together we pulled the trigger and ordered sets. They arrived in a week once shipped from the UK to the US.

Friday I installed the new pylon suspension system. My measurements were bang on and the pylons installed quickly, in less than 30 minutes, soap to nuts. I did not employ the included sorbothane pads, instead I used Herbie's Audio's Grungebuster material. I punched out a 1/4" diameter disc on 1/8" thick Grungebuster with adhesive backing. That fit perfectly on the top part of the lower suspension post and slips into the upper post perfectly. The adhesive backing meant that the vibration-absorbing pad stayed on the lower post. I employed the ceramic bearings because I did not believe the static load on the turntable was large enough to adversely impact the bearing. I did remove the green copper grease in the upper post and replaced it with a small dab of silicone grease. I have not yet installed the ceramic ball bearing on the main bearing. That change is pending. It only took only a few minutes with several bubble levels to get the GyroDec properly level.

Then I pulled out a small stack of records that I have been playing recently. First in the stack is Kate Wolf's 1975-1985 Retrospective. This is what I heard. The detail is just better all the way around but not analytical. The sound stage is the biggest difference. Everything seems to be in a natural and sweet focus. The bass is taut and firm, just right. Overall a nicer tone, not muddled. Crisp sounding, as if Kate was performing in the room, just right. I did not think the difference would be like this. Other changes I've made produced a stunning improvement. The change here is in tone. Little things all around improved that tighten up the sound reproduction. An overall sweeter tone. Detail across the audio frequency spectrum was just better. Quite relaxed. Just sweet.

Then I put on a jazz record that I know well and have been playing lately, Music Matters SRX release of Horace Silver's Song of My Father. The difference here was pronounced. Particularly on the drums and hi-hats. The change just jumped out at me in literally a head-turning, can-you-believe-that moment. Here the bass response was unreal, just so much better. I had commented a month or so ago on the Steve Hoffman Forum in a Music Matters thread that the drum kit was polite in this pressing, a bit subdued. I did not necessarily hear that so pronounced on the mostly acoustic guitar Kate Wolf album. But on this jazz title, it was more than obvious. As I listened to more and more records, I was pleasantly surprised at what I was hearing.

I told my friend that I believe the changes we’ve just made have moved this turntable to a new, better and higher level. The cost for this upgrade is relatively minimal, particularly in relation to the entire turntable cost. A local audiophile friend who knows my system well was over on Friday afternoon. He said this: “Your turntable before sounded awesome. Now that I hear some of the same titles again, what I hear is the muddiness is gone. I would never have described your turntable as muddy. But now I hear a new clarity and all of its attendant impacts on imaging and soundstage. The biggest impact is in the bass because it’s not muddy. Instead it’s more defined, refined and louder." We played some five or six records, selected cuts.

The turntable sounded really good to me before I installed Peter's suspension. For me it was hard to imagine a leap in performance. Given what I have done prior, I was thinking I would hear an incremental improvement. The improvement, however, is one of immediate refinement and it is quite obvious. This suspension makes the GyroDec just better overall in hard-to-articulate ways. The hotness or stridency or metallic sounding as in the upper registers is tamed. The bass is super clear and powerful. Best of all is a beautiful soundstage and imaging. Nice note decay in imaging and soundspace is extended. Just lots of refinement. The best way to describe what I now hear is refinement to every aspect of sound reproduction. And that is sweet.

One more change that I made here. Now under each of the three "orbital lander" footers on the Michell, I have place a Grungebuster disc inside one of these lamp check rings (https://www.grandbrass.com/item/crt1...ckrings-18ips/). The 1/8" thick Grungebuster has an adhesive on one side and in this application, it is up, and in contact with the Michell footer. This Grungebuster is several thousands of an inch proud of the lamp check ring, so the ring does not touch the maple base or the turntable for that matter. I did not want to install skateboard wheels on the turntable, so these pads are my solution to the movement of the table on my maple blocks.

I told my friend who introduced me to Peter's suspension system that I was really glad he found this upgrade and that shared it with me.

And to you Peter. Thank you! Well done.

I'm the other Gyro SE owner mentioned in the post above.

I agree 100% with BendBound's observations. While we both have Gyro SE's, we have different tonearms and still we both heard the same improvements.

I can't really add anything more meaningful to BendBound's review/impressions, except to mention that during the two decades that I've owned my Gyro SE that I've had 3 different phono cartridges, 3 different armboard isolation systems, and tried 4 different phono preamps. I always struggled with a metal sounding sheen that seemed to affect the upper highs, especially with Rock or Female Opera singers. For awhile I was saving my Gyro for Jazz & Classical, and playing Rock on my other turntable.

Pete's Pylons made a bigger change to my Gyro than all the other changes that came before.

That metal sounding sheen has now vanished, and my Gyro is happy playing all genres! It took me awhile longer to get around to writing this than I intended, because after I first installed Pete's Pylons all I wanted to do was sit and listen to music on my improved machine.

There were times in the past that I thought about selling my Gyro and trying something else. After Pete's improvements to my Gyro, I can now say that my Michell is a keeper!

Thank you Pete!

[Whitesnake]

After reading all the positive reviews, went or ordered the kit with the pylons, rubber pads and the bearings. It arrived to Canada in less than 2 weeks. The installation took an hour and I’ve been living with these for a month now.

These mods do work and here’s what they did to my sound:

The separation of instruments became real apparent from the first needle drop and everything snapped in focus. Most of the time it felt like listening to unfamiliar mixes. Suddenly I heard instruments, which were previously buried, comes to life.

Spoken words became more articulated and therefore clearer than they ever been.

High and low frequencies are not extended. What I got instead is more definition all across the board. Although bass lines are now easier to follow and cymbals are quite distinguishable, I found the biggest impact in the mids where the information is more refined.

Isolation wise, I will only say that tapping on the turntable shelf is still amplified. This did not make any neither positive nor negative effect for that matter.

That said, I believe that the sum of all these changes do bring the table to another level. This will not change how the cartridge sounds but it will definitely change how it sings. Expect a third dimensionality to your listening experience. The space between and beyond the speakers will be filled with floating information. It will become real apparent what’s been recorded in and out of phase and what the engineers at the mixing console intended to achieve. The 3 d effect is just mind blowing.

Of course not all vinyl records are created equally (sadly) but these mods will bring out the best of what’s in the grooves.

Good job Pete!

Michel

[BendBound]

I agree that isolation from all vibration is paramount. Some manufacturers, Rega for example, goes with light, and low resonant materials. Other manufacturers go with massive platters and other suspension cures. I could simply sell my Michell and try one of the other options. Instead, I've been working for some time to figure out how to isolate my TT from external vibration and to minimize the effects of resonant frequencies within the the TT itself. Removing the spring and using the lattice bridgework castlenut system Peter designed helped immensely on the internal sources of vibration.

In addition to that replaced suspension, I use an acyrlic toroid under my armboard, separated by 1/16" large washer of Herbie's Audio Grungebuster, a platinum curried silicone material that is terrific at absorbing vibration. The entire armboard-toroid system is mounted on hard rubber spacers too, to isolate the tonearm from the chassis, using also a 1/16" small washer of Grungebuster to interface with the toroid. The turntable sits on a 4" thick maple block. But under each of the three Michell feet I have a 1" diameter turned brass lamp shade ring (LSR) into which is a 1" diameter disc of 1/8" thick Grungebuster. I use Grungebuster with an adhesive side and that side is up into the LSR so that the finished side would be down on the shelf. Since the LSR has a hole in the center, the adhesive side of the Grungebuster is exposed. The Michell sits on that adhesive bit, finished side of Grungebuster on the shelf, and the Michell feet do not touch the LSR, making the TT completely stable from movement on the maple block.

For outside of the TT, I have my turntable mounted on a 4" thick Mapleshade Samson maple block. That block is supported by three particle dampers. All of that is on yet another thick maple shelf. I can tap on the lower shelf and nothing comes through my TT. I can rap on the 4" thick maple block and it does not pass through.

All of this has incrementally added to a very low external and internal vibration control of the TT. While still not perfect, folks who hear it in my house say they have never heard a system that sounded that good. When I play vinyl, folks are astonished that I'm playing a vinyl record because it is so quite, the detail is awesome and the soundstage is terrific.

So Peter in my humble opinion has advanced the discussion on how to solve a rather serious design flaw built into the Michell GryoDec. SME uses a somewhat similar approach to thwart vibration issues in their products. SolidAir has a completing product, and I would expect them to attack Peter's design simply to protect their own niche. Michell is not going to adopt Peter's solution because of "not-invented-here" syndrome, and the fact that to do so now, means that they have no better ideas but to adopt what someone else has done. Gert Petersen has a solution too.

So I applaud Peter for his tireless work toward making the GyroDec a better turntable. And I look forward to seeing what the next generation of designers come up with for the final cure.