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Thread: Cheap upgrade for michell gyro

  1. #291
    Join Date: Jan 2009

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    Quote Originally Posted by gwernaffield View Post
    i am sorry for my short comings in English and the way i was taught in the education system ,

    i am sorry you have problems with my grammar ,it is not meant to upset any one, ,, the meaning of them being rubbished ,, some one will come up with a reason on not to use them ,,, so far every thing has been personal , like the grammar comment

    which is fine by me, The i hope bit ,,, was to explain the back ground in engineering , ok it may not be in this industry,,
    I’m not saying you have anything to apologise for, I’m saying I don’t understand what point you are trying to make with regard to the ‘Solidair’ mods - you do mention them. Can you please explain again what you are saying as I don’t see any relevance between them and your work experience?
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  2. #292
    Join Date: May 2016

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    well how can i put this read the 100% feed back , on the pylons, end of conversation ,

  3. #293
    Join Date: Nov 2011

    Location: Seaton, Devon, UK

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    The vibration that gets into the chassis I was referring to is through the metal feet. These are directly coupled the the pylons, which I’m turn are connected to the chassis through the springs. By placing a Gyrodec on a make shift isolation platform made from marble and sorbothane feet I measure a drop of around 50% vibrations reaching the platter when playing music at 85db. Bear in mind my TT sits on a suspended shelf attached to solid wall already and sit 4 feet behind loudspeakers. After I replaced the feet as in the previous post and removed the temporary isolation platform I measured a +50% reduction vibration. I should add that the accelerometer measured most vibration in the vertical axis (up and down) very little in the x and y axis, side to side and back to front.

    There are quite a few TT’s out there with out rigger motors, how good or bad they are on the wow or flutter front I have not looked out. However it is well known that careful design needs to be done to avoid platter wobble and bearing issues when out-rigging a motor.


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    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs: Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm, Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges, Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

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  4. #294
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    If I am interpreting post #291 correctly, Peter is complaining about an email response that the company ‘Solidair’ made about him. This response was made in a private email with another forum member who appeared to be trying to understand the technical differences between Peter’s ‘Pylon’ mod and the one that Solidaire make.

    Looking at both mods it looks to me that the end result of both is more similar than dissimilar. The biggest difference is that the Solidair breaks the suspension down into two specific elements (both are needed or the suspension isolation will be severely compromised) - a magnetic one in the vertical (using opposing magnets) and the lateral makes use of gravity acting on the chassis mass and the rotational moment around the chassis points (this part has no vertical compliance). Peter’s mod effectively combines both of these aspects into one component (a conceptually more elegant solution I feel). Both mods seem to seek to increase suspension damping and limit lateral deflection whilst maintaing some isolation.

    I see that post #291 has been post edited to include some reference to myself (though to what end is not clear).
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  5. #295
    Join Date: Nov 2011

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    Quote Originally Posted by YNWaN View Post

    Looking at both mods it looks to me that the end result of both is more similar than dissimilar. The biggest difference is that the Solidair breaks the suspension down into two specific elements (both are needed or the suspension isolation will be severely compromised) - a magnetic one in the vertical (using opposing magnets) and the lateral makes use of gravity acting on the chassis mass and the rotational moment around the chassis points (this part has no vertical compliance). Peter’s mod effectively combines both of these aspects into one component (a conceptually more elegant solution I feel). Both mods seem to seek to increase suspension damping and limit lateral deflection whilst maintaing some isolation.
    From looking at the Solidair design of their pylon suspension I would say IMO this would be unlikely to stop or restrict rotational movement of the chassis as the chassis at the bottom of the replacement supports I believe are free to move. Although it probably does decouple that chassis from the pylons, from a vibrational point of view, to some extent as the springs are removed. How effective this solution as a whole is I cannot say as I have not tried it out.
    Listening is the act of aural discrimination and dissemination of sound, and accepting you get it wrong sometimes.

    Analog Inputs: Pro-Ject Signature 10 TT & arm, Benz Micro LP-S, Michel Cusis MC, Goldring 2500 and Ortofon Rondo Blue cartridges, Hitachi FT5500 mk2 Tuner

    Digital:- Marantz SA-KI Pearl CD player, RaspberryPi/HifiBerry Digi+ Pro, Buffalo NAS Drive

    Amplification:- AudioValve Sunilda phono stage, Krell KSP-7B pre-amp, Krell KSA-80 power amp

    Output: Wilson Benesch Vector speakers, KLH Ultimate One Headphones

    Cables: Tellurium Q Ultra Black II RCA & Chord Epic 2 RCA, various speaker leads, & links


    I think I am nearing audio nirvana, but don’t tell anyone.

  6. #296
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    Ah, apologies to all and particularly Peter, I think I now understand. Peter was simply stating his experience. I, on the other hand, have waded in with an attempt to discuss turntable isolation (because this is more my own area of interest).

    As Peter points out, irrespective of the technicalities, actual owner feedback has been 100% positive so they must be ‘working’. For many the reasons they work is less interesting, but to me this is precisely the bit that interests me .
    Last edited by struth; 09-05-2019 at 10:19. Reason: re solidair
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  7. #297
    Join Date: May 2016

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    Perhaps you have seen a pendulum bob vibrating back and forth about its equilibrium position. While a pendulum does not produce a sound when it oscillates, it does illustrate an important principle. A pendulum consisting of a longer string vibrates with a longer period and thus a lower frequency. Once more, there is an inverse relationship between the length of the vibrating object and the natural frequency at which the object vibrates. This very relationship carries over to any vibrating instrument - whether it is a guitar string, a xylophone, a pop bottle instrument, or a kettledrum.or turntable chassis ,objects have a natural frequency or set of frequencies at which they vibrate when struck, plucked, strummed or somehow disturbed. The actual frequency is dependent upon the properties of the material the object is made of (this affects the speed of the wave) and the length of the material (this affects the wavelength of the wave). It is the goal of musicians to find instruments that possess the ability to vibrate with sets of frequencies that are musically sounding (i.e., mathematically related by simple whole number ratios) and to vary the lengths and (if possible) properties to create the desired sound

  8. #298
    Join Date: May 2016

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    I'm peter.

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    mmmm

  9. #299
    Join Date: May 2016

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    i was waiting for you to reply , resonance occurs when two interconnected objects share the same vibrational frequency. When one of the objects is vibrating, it forces the second object into vibrational motion. The result is a large vibration. And if a sound wave within the audible range of human hearing is produced, a loud sound is heard.

  10. #300
    Join Date: Jan 2018

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    I'm Mike.

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    You got it. Your comments I interpreted on vibration control in and around a turntable are spot on. Peter has developed in my opinion the most elegant and effective solution to decoupling the chassis from all that is below it, and addressed the rotational issues between the spinning platter and the chassis. The addition of skateboard feet or in my case another solution deals with some wandering the whole table can do on certain surfaces.

    I looked at both Gert Perdersen's set up and that of SolidAir. At the end of the day, I went with Peter's solution. To me it just seemed right from an engineering standpoint. Since I did not try the other options, however, I am really not in a position to comment. I like what I have done. No drilling. No sand. No strings.

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