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Thread: real music?

  1. #1
    Join Date: Oct 2011

    Location: Charente, France

    Posts: 3,531
    I'm Nodrog.

    Default real music?

    I spend my early sunday mornings, reading the papers on-line whilst enjoying some fresh croissants and black, very strong, very sweet coffee. My week's highlight.

    I also tend to put the headphones on and listen to some music at high level without disturbing Ronnie, who spends her sunday mornings wrapped up in the bedclothes without me to disturb her.

    Anyway, I'm sitting here listening to Nina Simone. This is an old cassette recording that has been imported into iTunes. The problems are obvious, a bit of hash, slight wow and a trace or two of distortion. So..... how come....... it sounds more like a real, living person singing to me than most of the wunnerful digital tracks in the collection.

    It doesn't matter how often people try and tell me that digital is where it's at, the evidence seems to point the other way. I enjoy it a lot, it is convenient and easy to organise but..... it's that 'but' that always rears its ugly head. I've been listening almost exclusively to records this week and haven't thought about the hi-fi, just bunged another one on the TT. (Apart from the morning discovering that the Quad33 is one of my favourite per-amps)

    When I listen to digital, I tend to become a hi-fi fan rather than music fan and worry about the reproduction etc.

  2. #2
    Join Date: May 2010

    Location: Weymouth

    Posts: 3,463
    I'm John.

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    Personally I use digital only as a background medium and analogue (vinyl) as my mains listening medium. I think that digital sounds unacceptable as a serious source, after listening to analogue, as it is a series of on/off pulse and our brain find it difficult to assimilate the digital information. Whereas analogue is continuously on as it is being played and our brain finds it much easier to folllow. Does that make sense?
    Last edited by prestonchipfryer; 15-02-2015 at 08:48. Reason: words

  3. #3
    Join Date: Apr 2012

    Location: United Kingdom

    Posts: 2,302
    I'm Richard.

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    Quote Originally Posted by prestonchipfryer View Post
    Personally I use digital only as a background medium and analogue (vinyl) as my mains listening medium. I think that digital sounds unacceptable as a serious source, after listening to analogue, as it is a series of on/off pulse and our brain find it difficult to assimilate the digital information. Whereas analogue is continuously on as it is being played and our brain finds it much easier to folllow. Does that make sense?
    No.
    I'm not disagreeing that analogue sounds "better"; that's a personal thing, but the sounds coming out of the speakers/headphones are analogue! The "on-off" only applies to the digital stream, so once your DAC has had it's grubby litle paws on that, it IS "continuously on". Whether or not the whole ADC/DAC process is adequate is where the argument rages.
    ABD.

  4. #4
    Join Date: Oct 2011

    Location: Charente, France

    Posts: 3,531
    I'm Nodrog.

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    Quote Originally Posted by awkwardbydesign View Post
    No.
    I'm not disagreeing that analogue sounds "better"; that's a personal thing, but the sounds coming out of the speakers/headphones are analogue! The "on-off" only applies to the digital stream, so once your DAC has had it's grubby litle paws on that, it IS "continuously on". Whether or not the whole ADC/DAC process is adequate is where the argument rages.
    This is what I don't understand. I am listening to Nina Simone on the Mac. It's been currupted by digits already but it still sounds better than files that started off digital. Why is this?? Or is it? Is the fact that I know its from a tape making my brain believe it's better?

    All very peculiar. Back to the main rig and the TT.

  5. #5
    Join Date: Feb 2011

    Location: Ramsbottom

    Posts: 638
    I'm Alan.

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    You will never get away from the fact we have analogue ears, my main source is vinyl, but to be be fair I have heard some stunning CD's and many years ago I had a Teac C3 cassette deck and the recordings were indistinguishable from the original IMO.
    I've never heard streaming or ripping whatever they are, I'm a dinosaur, but I still enjoy listening.

    Enjoy your music

    cheers Al
    My system,

    Cartridges Lyra Delos, Audio Technica AT33EVmc, AT 24 mm
    Turntable Thorens TD 124 Mk2, in a Jim Campbel plinth,Audio Technica 1503 Mk3 arm
    CD player Technics SL-PG490
    Cassette deck Yamaha KX 530
    Moving Coil Amp Albarry MCA 11
    Pre-amplifier Albarry AP 11 (battery powered)
    Power amps Albarry M1108 Mono-blocs
    Speakers Allison 3 Corner units, Allison 6 stand mounted cubes
    Interconnects AVT Matrix 6 and OFC short ones
    Mains distribution Music Works Recoil 6 gang and mains leads
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    Speaker cable Chord Rumour (Cryo'd)
    RCM Okki Nokki
    https://www.facebook.com/groups/1586...homepage_panel

  6. #6
    Join Date: Jul 2013

    Location: Kingsbury, NW London

    Posts: 1,232
    I'm Clive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gordon Steadman View Post
    I spend my early sunday mornings, reading the papers on-line whilst enjoying some fresh croissants and black, very strong, very sweet coffee. My week's highlight.

    I also tend to put the headphones on and listen to some music at high level without disturbing Ronnie, who spends her sunday mornings wrapped up in the bedclothes without me to disturb her.

    Anyway, I'm sitting here listening to Nina Simone. This is an old cassette recording that has been imported into iTunes. The problems are obvious, a bit of hash, slight wow and a trace or two of distortion. So..... how come....... it sounds more like a real, living person singing to me than most of the wunnerful digital tracks in the collection.

    It doesn't matter how often people try and tell me that digital is where it's at, the evidence seems to point the other way. I enjoy it a lot, it is convenient and easy to organise but..... it's that 'but' that always rears its ugly head. I've been listening almost exclusively to records this week and haven't thought about the hi-fi, just bunged another one on the TT. (Apart from the morning discovering that the Quad33 is one of my favourite per-amps)

    When I listen to digital, I tend to become a hi-fi fan rather than music fan and worry about the reproduction etc.
    I couldn't put it more succinctly myself. The rise in vinyl sales is mainly (but obviously not exclusively) due to younger members of society discovering that digital has its moments but analogue adds the emotion.

    Clive
    SOURCE:OPPO UDP-205 BluRay, SkyQ, Technics SL1210M5G/HexMat Eclipse/MN Bearing/Origin Live Gravity One puck/Isonoes with Boots/Jelco TK-850S Tonearm/Hana Umami Blue, PS Audio Stellar Phonostage. I also have an AT-OC9XSH as a spare cartridge.
    AMPLIFIER: Bryston BR-20 Pre/DAC/Streamer & Bryston 4B3 Power Amplifier
    SPEAKERS: Spendor D7 on Iso-Acoustics Gaia III’s
    HEADPHONES: OPPO PM-1 with Atlas Zeno cable, B&W Pi7 S2 and B&W C5 v2.
    CABLES: Analogue: Speaker Atlas Mavros Grun. Interconnect - Atlas Mavros XLR x3, MCRU Silver Tonearm cable
    Digital:Audioquest Carbon Ethernet x 4, Audioquest Carbon digital, English Electric 8Switch, Chord Optichord, Atlas Optical.
    Mains: PS Audio Perfectwave AC-05 x 5, Isol-8 Powerline Extreme with Quantum Science yellow fuse on input cable, Sounds Fantastic 6way Mains Blocks.
    STORAGE: Synology DS216J NAS with 2 x 3Tb WD Red hard-drives. Samsung 500Gb SSD.
    TV LG55B7 OLED

  7. #7
    Join Date: Mar 2008

    Location: Halifax, UK

    Posts: 1,399
    I'm Nick.

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    You will never get away from the fact we have analogue ears
    Ironically, we dont.

    "The inner ear consists of the cochlea, which is a spiral-shaped, fluid-filled tube. It is divided lengthwise by the organ of Corti, which is the main organ of mechanical to neural transduction. Inside the organ of Corti is the basilar membrane, a structure that vibrates when waves from the middle ear propagate through the cochlear fluid – endolymph. The basilar membrane is tonotopic, so that each frequency has a characteristic place of resonance along it. Characteristic frequencies are high at the basal entrance to the cochlea, and low at the apex. Basilar membrane motion causes depolarization of the hair cells, specialized auditory receptors located within the organ of Corti.[5] While the hair cells do not produce action potentials themselves, they release neurotransmitter at synapses with the fibers of the auditory nerve, which does produce action potentials. In this way, the patterns of oscillations on the basilar membrane are converted to spatiotemporal patterns of firings which transmit information about the sound to the brainstem."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hearing
    Nick.

  8. #8
    Join Date: Mar 2013

    Location: London/Kent, UK

    Posts: 308
    I'm keith.

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    personally i put it down to people falling in love with what they grow up with. Ive no doubt in 30 yrs forums like these will be filed with people saying the newest medium doesnt sound as good as the digital stuff they grew up with.

    The small rise in vinyl sales i personally believe is down to a mixture of people going back to their youth or some younger people buying it as its pretty new to them. I dont see it being a long term thing myself.

  9. #9
    Join Date: Oct 2011

    Location: Charente, France

    Posts: 3,531
    I'm Nodrog.

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    Real music can be enjoyed on almost anything!!!

    I bet these Sony speakers (from a crap class D Sony AV system) have never had a signal like this upem before. I've just changed the mains out socket of the 33 to a modern one (sorry Andre) and am running a little test. Playing some jazz through the tape out socket on the 34 to the 33 and......OK, it might not be the highest of high fidelity but somehow the music still gets through. If I was in a small flat with neighbours a few feet away, I would listen to music on this in spite of (and because of) the fact that they probably cut off at about 200htz.


  10. #10
    Join Date: Oct 2012

    Location: The Black Country

    Posts: 6,089
    I'm Alan.

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    Never mind real music - real equipment

    Great having a play isn't it?
    I love Hendrix for so many reasons. He was so much more than just a blues guitarist - he played damn well any kind of guitar he wanted. In fact I'm not sure if he even played the guitar - he played music. - Stevie Ray Vaughan

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