Windows 8

[Tim]

some time in 2014. It'll still work after that, just no security updates

April 2014 I think Mark - so you are good for sometime yet
I still have XP Pro on one of my machines at work, but I do much prefer Windows 7. One thing I will say about 8 is that it boots very quickly and has a very small footprint, so it runs on current hardware very efficiently. So whats under the hood works well.

[Martinh]

Sorry, Martin, but this is the kind of thing that I'm talking about. Apparently? So you haven't tried it yourself?

I've been running it constantly on a test bed at work for the last three months and it really is rather good. On a tablet it'll be stunning. A thousand times better than the iPad walled-garden approach where apps can't talk to each other or easily share docs or info, with the file system not easily made use of.

No I haven't tried it for myself and I'd probably find it to be OK, as I'm a techie myself. Ive read a load of reviews and they nearly all say the same thing - that the desktop experience is not good. Even the "positive" PC PRO review said it will probably be vista mk 2.

Actually, my post above doesnt say that I think the product is crap. I just think that the average man or woman in the street may be alienated by the poor user experience that everyone is reporting. As you say Tim, the proof of the pudding...

And don't forget that it's not just the hardware and software that make a roaring success in the tablet market. It's the number and quality of applications, availability of content etc. that makes the difference IMHO. I don't think Microsoft is very good at that sort of thing.

Actually, I'd like to see other companies competing with alternatives to the market leader, but I think they have got their work cut out on that one.

[Tim]

If you believe the rumours, apple will have their iPad mini out before the end of the year, which will kill the nexus 7 and others stone dead overnight.

Sorry Martin, but I just flat out disagree with this. I think you'll find that most Android users are Android users for a reason, i.e. they don't want to be locked into an Apple product. I'm a classic example of this as I actually wanted to like the iPad - bought one in fact from John Lewis, but it went back 3 days later when I found out it wouldn't do what I wanted it too and I had no wish to jailbreak it. All the Android users I know share this same opinion. I agree we are in the minority and most Apple users wouldn't have a clue about tinkering with their gadgets, or want to, they just want them to work which Apple in the main do.

I have no doubt if they do produce a mini iPad it will prove to be very popular, but kill of Android 7" tablets? I would stake my no claims bonus on that being wrong. And by then MS will be in the mix too with their tablets, its going to be an interesting time.

[Alex_UK]

but kill off Android 7" tablets?

If a "mini iPad" is <£159 then it possibly would - but we all know that isn't going to happen! At least £100 more for an 8gb base version would be my guess.

[synsei]

I won't be moving to W8 unless there's an option to sidestep 'cloud' use and having to be beholden to an MS account just to use the damn thing. I like to have my data stored where it is least likely to fall into someone else's hands, ergo at home. IMO W7 is the best OS MS has produced to date. I have it installed on every machine bar one in our household (which runs XP out of necessity), and not one of the installations has ever thrown a wobbly. It just works.

Like some others here I have a natural aversion to the way Apple operates as a company. I've no problem with those who like Apple and their products, they are free to spend their money any way they wish, but these days, and IMO, Apple are what MS were at their height, overbearing and dictatorial. Their products are also extraordinarily expensive for what they are.

[Martinh]

Excuse me if I'm being thick here (it does happen) but what would you want to do with an iPad that you can't because it's "locked in" or walled in? I've never had a problem with mine or felt that I needed to do something that I couldn't.. I also have an android phone (samsung s2) running ICS and the user experience just isn't a patch on the iPad (even taking the screen size into account). I run pretty much the same apps on both and the iPad apps are much more developed, slicker and have updates out first. The eBay and spotify apps for iPad are true masterpieces. The android and windows ones: oh dear

Bear in mind what it was designed to do. Surf the net, email, play games, watch tv and movies, run apps etc and it's truly a great, great product. The iPad sales figures bear this out. I say it's the best product that I've ever bought ( and Ive got some nice stuff) and I was a true anti apple person before my dad convinced me to get it.

I can't understand why people say that they don't like how apple operate and no one has been able or willing to explain why. Why do you call them dictatorial and overbearing? They don't tell me what to do or push things on me. I don't buy anything from the iTunes store and they don't harass me for that. They don't spam me with rubbish marketing emails. Best of all, they didn't load my machine with trial software and other sh!t before selling it to me. All they did was offer me a great product that does everything that I want it to do. No strings attached.

Cheers,

[NRG]

Amen Brother! Bought an iPad when they first came out...fan bloomin tastic...still going strong, switched my work laptop to a Mac Book Air last year at my own expense after soooo much frustration with Windows XP and then 7....never looked back...its a real revalation a very very positive one.

As for being 'locked in' do me a favour...buy an android phone and....errrr...your're locked in! Same as.

If you want to be a devil with Apple you can always jailbreak your iPhone or iPad

[synsei]

If you are happy with your Apple products Martin then that's great, they obviously do what you want them to do. IMO I find their products to be overpriced and lacking in functionality in comparison with their competitors (although I will admit they have taken strides to close the gap recently). My main bugbear is that their handheld products don't have user replaceable batteries and I believe the iPad has no usb or SD Card ports. This is an inexcusable omission in my book. As for the 'locked in' aspect, what if you want to download flash player? Regardless of whether you might want to or not, you can't because Apple dictate that you can't. In fact Apple decides which apps are made available for download without any input from the user base. Android app downloads are not restricted at all. If one is willing to put in a little effort there are some really good Android apps available. As for the official Android ebay app, it really is very good indeed. It's been updated recently and is now super-slick. I can't comment on the Android Spotify app as I don't have a premium Spotify account therefore I'm not entitled to use it.

[NRG]

...at first the lack of flash on the iPad really got to me but now a few years on with so much more HTML 5 stuff available it only gets my goat occasionally. I can watch youtube and I can watch BBC iPlayer fine, my MacBook Air of course has no such issues. Sometime when visiting a web site the lack of flash support on the iPad is a real blessing!

[Martinh]

If you are happy with your Apple products Martin then that's great, they obviously do what you want them to do. IMO I find their products to be overpriced and lacking in functionality in comparison with their competitors (although I will admit they have taken strides to close the gap recently). My main bugbear is that their handheld products don't have user replaceable batteries and I believe the iPad has no usb or SD Card ports. This is an inexcusable omission in my book. As for the 'locked in' aspect, what if you want to download flash player? Regardless of whether you might want to or not, you can't because Apple dictate that you can't. In fact Apple decides which apps are made available for download without any input from the user base. Android app downloads are not restricted at all. If one is willing to put in a little effort there are some really good Android apps available. As for the official Android ebay app, it really is very good indeed. It's been updated recently and is now super-slick. I can't comment on the Android Spotify app as I don't have a premium Spotify account therefore I'm not entitled to use it.

Hi Dave,

Some good points there - I've not had to replace a battery yet but it cost £85 for the service, which I think is acceptable.

I have the camera connection kit (£4 from amazon) which gives USB and SD connection, although you need a powered USB hub for some devices, as the power available is quite low. When I first got he thing, I wanted to move some files around between SD cards and found that there was no file explorer. As a windows veteran, I thought this was crazy. But actually, it's no big deal. Now I just email stuff to and from it and it's actually easier. Printing is a no-no, unless you've got a compatible printer, but again it's not a big issue.

The flash player thing was the one thing that I thought would be the deal breaker and there are some sites that still use flash. Hand on heart, it's never been an issue in reality. Apparently apple won't allow it because its so resource hungry and because of stability and security issues and now that adobe are dropping it, it's not a problem for the future.

I think the philosophy behind the app store scrutineering is to ensure that dodgy apps are filtered out. I think that a lot of people think they are controlling and overbearing when actually they do things to ensure that the user experience is top notch.

Anyway, I've got my iPad, 4 windows PCs and an android phone and they are all great at what they were designed for. I still think the iPad is the best though