The Great Denon DL103 Debate...

[David Price]

Good evening ladies and gentlemen!

This strand has been started in honour of Marco, who is hellbent on exposing the sinister truth behind Hi-Fi World's ritual slating of the aforementioned moving coil pickup...

So - I'll start the ball rolling. The reason I don't like it is that, ermm, I don't think it sounds very good!

:-)

Ermm... will this do?

David

ps - now Marco, you tell me what it is about it that you like?

[Primalsea]

Oh please stop it.

I will make a suggestion soon but first I have to say this: A while ago a member received some moderation for disagreeing (which is fine) and re-enforcing his view by making personal remarks and also saying that anyone who was not of like mind were not capable of making sound judgments (pun, haha,.... moving on).

I hate to say it but a similar thing has been done again, although not as blatant personal remarks, as well as remarks regarding the capacity to make judgements were made.

What I will be as bold to suggest is that if something is said anywhere, even if it a bit OTT, considered to be a bit rude, etc, etc we invite that person to explain what it is that they don't like about the item, forums, etc.

This (for items) could be done as a mini review with some guidlines that steer away from anything that can be considered rude or personal.

Possible outline could be:

When was it heard
Where
What was it used with
What music
What was liked and why
What was disliked and why

Any technical points or facts that support the opinion which must also be backed up by references to test data, white papers, articles etc.

I'm hoping that this would lead to constructive threads that stay well away from the personal side of things. To use a cliche or 2, 2 wrongs dont make a right and sometimes you just have to turn the other cheek. Retaliation just leads to Polarisation (that word again).

[Steve Toy]

I think that pretty well sums up our ethos Paul!

[Marco]

I hate to say it but a similar thing has been done again, although not as blatant personal remarks, as well as remarks regarding the capacity to make judgements were made.

Hi Paul,

Can you expand on this please? I'm not really sure what you're referring to.

David, very good! Perhaps you could just answer the post (and the questions, very clearly expressed, therein) I directed you to earlier?

This one here (#160) just to make it easy for you: http://theartofsound.net/forum/showt...t=1538&page=16

If you don't feel like doing it, then there really isn't any point taking this discussion further as I'm not going to repeat myself

Marco.

[Primalsea]

So in that case David (or Noel or any 103 detractor), would you be kind enough to state what it is about the 103 that you don't like using the admittedly rough outline above. Feel free to copy and paste any things from previous articles from the mag or where ever.

Also Marco (or any other 103 fan) could you do the same and then we can take it from there, discussing any particular points in detail.

(Biting and nipple pinching is not allowed, testicle pulling allowed with consent from the target).

[Primalsea]

I'm sure I saw the word "Grumpy", the hint that someone doesn't do the reviews because they can't and shouldn't.

I know not really insulting but still not exactly healing words.

[Marco]

Paul, nice idea, but I don't see the point in repeating myself again. David knows the questions I'd like him to answer so it's up to him if he wishes to do so or not. If not, then I'm afraid this thread is dead in the water...

Marco.

[Marco]

I'm sure I saw the word "Grumpy", the hint that someone doesn't do the reviews because they can't and shouldn't.

I know not really insulting but still not exactly healing words.

Yes, I think that I may have referred to Mr Keywood rather tongue-in-cheek as "Ol grumpy", after him referring to the 103 as "tat" - healing words indeed!

Marco.

[Neil McCauley]

In the March Heathrow show this year I demonstrated the Harbeth 40.1 monitors using an LFD linestage 3 and 2 mono LFD PA3 power amps. Primary signal source was the Funk sapphire, Arthur K modified Ittok and …….. the cheapest 103D we could find. This went into the most musically engaging UK-built phono stage I know, the LFD MCT. The MCT is devoid of adjustment.

Adam Smith of Hi-Fi World wrote that this entire Stereonow combo was the best sound at the show.

Thank you ........ and goodnight.

[sastusbulbas]

What a sad state of events..


Due to this I vow never to use a Denon 103 cartridge.