Thanks - that's good, if sobering, information to have.
Thanks - that's good, if sobering, information to have.
See if Guido Tent has any suggestions he seems to be able to source a variety of do an tcxo's for his own tentlabs stuff.
Kuzma Stabi/S 12", (LP12-bastard) DC motor and optical tacho psu, Benz LP, Paradise (phonostage). MB-Pro, Brooklyn dac and psu, Bruno Putzeys balanced pre, mod86p dual mono amps, Yamaha NS1000m
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I'm Paul.
I will bear that in mind when sourcing my own crystals.
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High Performance Power Supply upgrades
http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16655
And that's exactly what pisses me off about audio these days: it's all about quantity over quality, driven by the bottom line!
Is it therefore any wonder why many of us build our systems around quality vintage equipment, designed in an era when overall standards were much higher? Whatever happened to striving for excellence, genuine innovation, and creating something that is truly unique and special??
To my huge disdain, we've largely become an undiscerning nation of mindless sheep, who are easily dictated to and satisfied with blandness and mediocrity. And they call this progress!!!
Marco.
Main System
Turntable: Heavily-modified Technics SL-1210MK5G [Mike New bearing/ETP platter/Paul Hynes SR7 PSU & reg mods]. Funk Firm APM Achromat/Nagaoka GL-601 Crystal Record Weight/Isonoe feet & boots/Ortofon RS-212D/Denon DL-103GL in Denon PCL-300 headshell with Funk Firm Houdini/Kondo SL-115 pure-silver cartridge leads.
Paul Hynes MC head amp/SR5 PSU. Also modded Lentek head amp/Denon AU-310 SUT.
Other Cartridges: Nippon Columbia (NOS 1987) Denon DL-103. USA-made Shure SC35C with NOS stylus. Goldring G820 with NOS stylus. Shure M55E with NOS stylus.
CD Player: Audiocom-modified Sony X-777ES/DAS-R1 DAC.
Tape Deck: Tandberg TCD 310, fully restored and recalibrated as new, by RDE, plus upgraded with heads from the TCD-420a. Also with matching TM4 Norway microphones.
Preamps: Heavily-modified Croft Charisma-X. LDR Stereo Coffee. Power Amps: Tube Distinctions Copper Amp fitted with Tungsol KT-150s. Quad 306.
Cables & Sundries: Mark Grant HDX1 interconnects and digital coaxial cable, plus Mark Grant 6mm UP-LCOFC Van Damme speaker cable. MCRU 'Ultimate' mains leads. Lehmann clone headphone amp with vintage Koss PRO-4AAA headphones.
Tube Distinctions digital noise filter. VPI HW16.5 record cleaning machine.
Speakers: Tannoy 15MGs in Lockwood cabinets with modified crossovers. 1967 Celestion Ditton 15.
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Ok guys, I have just had a thought
If getting an ovenized cystal is going to be problematic it might be worth considering simply keeping the standard crystal at precisely the right temperature to produce exactly the right frequency.
It wouldn't be too difficult to use a peltier cooler to maintain an exact temperature. They work both ways, with DC current fed one way one side heats up & the other cools, feed DC in the opposite polarity & the side that heated up previously cools & vice versa.
Shouldn't be difficult to make a control circuit to do the job
Bests, Mark
"We must believe in free will. We have no choice" Isaac Bashevis Singer
My thinking says that the exact frequency is not so important (certainly not the highest priority as it is for radio operators), it's the stability and jitter that are critical. Will any kind of temperature controlled enviroment improve that, or is it down to how optimally the flip-flop circuit uses the crystal? This I think is where the Superclock comes in.
Ok, the first thing you guys need to decide is what exactly it is that you want to accomplish, and why.
I know..........."I want it to sound better!"
Right. And what parameter(s) make it "better". Stability? Sort-term, or long-term? Phase noise?
Once you know the answer to those, and why, then you can think about making it "better".
If "better" is long-term stability, then what you have may be good enough. Short-term..........??? Phase noise.......I can promise you it isn't. (And I don't even know what you have, what it does, and how it is made.)
OK......someone said jitter, etc. Yes, if you divide down, the jitter gets better. But, the higher the reference, the harder it is to get a good crystal. And therefore, low jitter.
If whatever this thing is already has a divider chain, then it probably will not get any better. Eventually you hit the real-world noise floor, and that is as low as you can go. Divide any clock enough times, and that is what you get.
There is a divider chain on both the 1210 and the Hercules board I'll be using. To be honest I'm more interested in psu quality and splitting each stage than I am about the quality of the do reference. Crystal effects will be swamped by motor cogging in the 1210 and by cogging and belt incOnsistencies in my application.
It can't hurt though, can it? I think most of us just like fiddling with stuff. I actually give away far more stuff than I build for myself.
Kuzma Stabi/S 12", (LP12-bastard) DC motor and optical tacho psu, Benz LP, Paradise (phonostage). MB-Pro, Brooklyn dac and psu, Bruno Putzeys balanced pre, mod86p dual mono amps, Yamaha NS1000m
What I want is not long term stability (which will have precious little effect on sound quality), I want jitter reduction to give the cleanest clock possible. Some of that will come with the phase 3 regs I'm about to install, to give the AN6680 control IC a cleaner supply, and some of it could come from a Superclock circuit.
In the case of the Technics, jitter reduction could help reduce rotational noise amplified and fed into the motor by the AN6675 motor drive IC.
I think knowing what the time constant of the speed control loop is, in relation the the frequency used in the digital circuit would help to understand if jitter is a significant factor.
If for instance the crystal oscillates at 4 Mhz, but the control loop operates at 100hz, the jitter noise may not even be discernible to the control loop.
I'm a mech engineer, not an EE, but that is what comes to mind.
Hearing is believing
SL-1210 Mk5 w/Mike New Platter/bearing/armboard; Hynes SR5 DIY PSU;
Zyx Airy3X; SME V; Hashimoto HM7 SUT; CJ PR15MkII Phono w/teflon caps.
Modwright LS36.5 Dual Mono Preamp & KWA 150 amp > Paradigm Ref 100 v.4s