Hi-Fi Plus issue 62

[Primalsea]

I think the nail was hit on the head when someone said that the forum stopped them from bothering to buy magazines.

The question you have to ask is do some magazine editors feel threatened by forums who they feel might draw away their customer base.

The the Hifi+ article was recent it's not the first time they have made noises about forums and non accountability of posters.

Yet the vast majority of posters have nothing gain from giving advice which they do freely purely from love of their hobby. Even many of posters who are in the trade do the same as well.

[aquapiranha]

I find it hard to see how most magazines can remain impartial when they have advertisers to please. For example, if a reviewer doubted that say changing cables makes a difference, how would any cable manufacturers paying for space in that mag feel? even if they were not mentioned by name? i do not buy magazines now, though I have in the past, mostly to look at the pretty pictures...

[Steve Toy]

Not all magazines feel threatened by all forums. I know one magazine, Hi-fi World that was very supportive of AOS in this month's issue on page 8.

[jandl100]

And who holds the magazines and journalists accountable?

Absolutely.

As mentioned in Harry Pearson's article in the same issue of HiFi+, you don't even have to be corrupt (that is the correct word, I think) .... you just have to have someone who is sympathetic to your brand doing the reviewing.

Give Paul Messenger a Naim component to review, and very likely you will get a positive outcome. Not always true - but pretty darn reliable - certainly a 'low risk' strategy on the part of the manufacturer! I am sure this is not because PM is on Naim's payroll - he just likes Naim equipment, is fully briefed on the company's new equipment roll-out plans and gets in quick with requests for kit or is directly offered things to review by a canny manufacturer.

Similarly for Roy Gregory and Nordost, among others.

[jandl100]

.... and another thing ..... what RG fails to acknowledge (or perhaps even to realise) is that on Forums like this many of us aren't 'nameless & unaccountable', many of the posters get together for Bake Offs or just to swap kit ..... many of us know each other and help each other out as well as provide advice based on our own hifi experiences.

Most forum inmates can quickly identify and allow for posters with a particular agenda - it ain't rocket science!

But acknowledging that sort of thing doesn't suit RG's anti-forum agenda, sadly. He really needs to get out a bit Perhaps someone should invite him to join our community here.

[Togil]

One problem with forums is that you can't easily get advice on recent equipment.

Example :I'd love to hear from someone who has the new Meridian 7200 speakers. All I would get on forums is comments how people liked or didn't like this or that old speaker from Meridian, pretty useless.

So sometimes a magazine article gives the first impression.

[Beechwoods]

All I would get on forums is comments how people liked or didn't like this or that old speaker from Meridian, pretty useless

[Primalsea]

Just thought people would want to read this article while we are on this subject. Its sort of related. You must read ot to the end though to understand why.

http://www.tnt-audio.com/sorgenti/vta_e.html

I was told that "The Call" was a particulary scaving one with a full broadside of insults to boot.

[Spectral Morn]

Very interesting article. I for one have always set an arm/cart up to the best of my ability and then left it at that. I have never been able to hear those type of miniscule changes my self, so I am with Geoff Husband on that. I think if the errors in set up are high you will here an improvement in sound if you correct for it. For one I would never let a TT not be set up to the best of my ability, either in a personnel or professional basis. My Phantom has a VTA adjuster but I have never fiddled with it and I don't intend to any time soon. If you feel the need to fiddle every time before listening to vinyl, go ahead but for me this is to anal and I would rather enjoy the music than worry about any possible issues; that may or may not exist. I have met some guys over the years who take this all to extreme and the result has been that they stop enjoying music and get sucked into a never ending spiral of what if''s and buts. This is not a good place to be. That way you will find madness IMHO.

However, I still think that MR G has some valid points about Forums. Lets be honest about it the biggest challenge to the printed press is the free on line mags such as 6 Moons, Positive Feedback, TNT, Tone Magazine, Stereo Times etc all of which do fairly good work and are free to read. These are the hi-fi press of todays biggest problem,not Forums.

But there are some on line and in print that perhaps aren't as accountable for what they say. But if you are in print and a named and identifiable author you are legally very much held to account. On line in a Forum not so, if you are a here to day gone tomorrow invisible and unknown. The main thrust of Mr G's article is this I feel. He has a fair point on this issue I feel. By the way I don't know Mr G at all but do enjoy reading his magazine. It is a throwback to the way The Absolute Sound and Stereophile used to be 13 years ago and not the many photos and no editorial of many printed mags today. If you want just pictures there is always porn to look at. Hi-fi news a few years ago was heading that way nice big M&S style pictures of audio(like M&S has done for food in their adds.) and very little of the written word, heck mags are for reading IMHO and to inform and educate(something some have not done in a very long time IMHO).

Regards D S D L --- Neil

[sastusbulbas]

Personally,

Magazines have dropped in quality. Most of the reviewers have been seen for what they are, no more than hobbyists with an opinion, that due to magazine fame became fact.

Now any sensible adult would be able to see that just about every "fact" on forums and magazines not to mention every technical debate regarding audio ancillaries is utterly flawed, all of it no more than opinion and theory based on the claimants opinion and preference.

NO audio equipment is anything more than someone else's ideal, and as we can see from each reviewer if you care to take teh time and investigate and study teh aptitude and changes of opinion and equipment through their years, it becomes obvious that there is no absolutes, as no reviewer has progressed beyond preference, regardless of technical debate.

Some examples of evidence against this would be strong brand loyalty changes as homes were changes and strong factual evidence of claims made by audio manufacturers, but as we can see it's all new emporers clothes.

Forums are like this but even more damaging. The FACT is that more now less than they care to admit, and most opinion is based on assumption. All audio equipment will always be variable because there is no absolute, no one can have an identical absolute, as rooms, hearing acuity, furniture, mains, ancillaries, music taste, preferences, listening habits, different listening preferences and the way one listens to music, music quantity, frequency capability, ambient noise levels, experiences etc will never be the same.

All that can be achieved is an imaginary goal based on imaginitive deduction of a reviewers or forum members opinion based on our own experiences which may be tainted but seem to us correct.

Enjoy the music, forget equipment and it's status! ALL opinion is corrupt...