After something relatively high end. I have pure sliver litz in at the moment. Not looking for £thousands.
Let me know what you have.
Cheers, Tim
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After something relatively high end. I have pure sliver litz in at the moment. Not looking for £thousands.
Let me know what you have.
Cheers, Tim
I have 2 options : pair LAT International I C 200 MK 11; or Audionote Copper Lexus 50 strand (AN factory terminated). £100 plus delivery either pair.
Looking for something higher end. Thanks for the offer!
Not wanting to set the cat among the pigeons and fly in the face of popular hifi thinking, but frankly it will make little difference to the sound so long as an XLR lead is of decent quality, and well made. XLR leads are usually used at line level and as such the low impedance feed to them will be totally unaffected by the lead's resistance and impedance. Paying a lot of money for a 1m XLR may appease the brain but - in my opinion - have little effect on the ears. No offence meant to anyone.
A few people have said this, could you explain the properties of a balanced connection compared to single ended that makes the cable have no impact on the sound?Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagesteve
Sent from my POT-LX1 using Tapatalk
You're missing the point. I was not comparing balanced with single ended ie types of connections. That is well known and documented. I learnt about it in the 70s. Balanced lines (as in XLR connectors) reject common-mode interference. The lines have the same impedance to ground, so the interfering fields or currents induce the same voltage in both wires. That's a big plus, regardless. My original reason for not paying a lot of money for an XLR lead is there to read.
If you can solder Steve, you should be able to make up a pair of balanced cables terminated with XLR connectors for about £30; that is using quality professional cable off-the-drum and quality connectors (such as Neutrik, Cannon or Switchcraft).
Apologies for this, but that's absolutely incorrect.Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagesteve
In balanced configuration, the differences may not be as pronounced as it is with unbalanced but in my experience it has less to do with the configuration and more to do with the plugs and sockets in use.
9 out of 10 balanced cables go via a phosphor bronze xlr connection with gold or silver plating.
Nearly every balanced cable has a neutrik plug, with brass pins on the end and nearly every xlr socket has brass pins.
When you get away from that nasty crap, and fit some copper/pure silver XLR plugs and sockets, the variation in cable performance become far more apparent.
This myth that balanced cables aren't as fussy or they are less susceptible to different quality of cable, is absolute 'Bro Science' stuff of myth.
I have repeated demonstrated this with balanced and unbalanced cables.
The op is right to look for quality but if his sockets are brass, then yes, it's a waste of time. You have to improve the connection material through the chain.
PS, if you don't believe me, try it for yourself. Xhadow plugs and silver sockets will change your opinion
The thing that confuses me is when you look at all the different factors that make a cable sound the way it does (I'm excluding plugs here, just the materials and configuration of the cable itself), dialectric, conductivity, solid strand, multi core, litz, silver plated, pure silver, ofc, purity etc, what it is about a balanced configuration that means these make no difference when they make so much difference in a single ended cable?
I can't believe all these things are done to get round the limitations of a single ended design. Far easier surely just to design all kit in a balanced topology and buy the most basic cables?
Another possibility is that some who say that XLR cables make no difference may also be cable sceptics in general, in which case the balanced argument is moot. I'm just trying to understand what's at the root of this concept.
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Using a balanced cable is by all means probably the best way to connect you system in terms of the protection the configuration offers to the signal, no argument there BUT the truth of the matter is, the design is aimed at 'pro audio' and isn't as good as Hi-End connections from a conductivity perspective .Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence001
It's the same as using Speakons. The conductivity of the Plugs and sockets, as the industry, just isn't as good as we have in the Audiophile world.
There is no reason that balanced cables can defy the physics of different metals.
The fact that the shit materials Int the connection interface is where this myth has come from. Honest;ly, if you change from the Neutrik rubbish (IMO) to something far better, you will hear that it makes a huge difference.
Heres a case in point:
https://gothicaudio.com/collections/...-interconnects
I like GA BTW so not bashing them but they have some really nice cable there. High purity and a decent total cross section of conductor (I prefer one wire over multiple wires) yet on the end is silver plated BRASS (Copper Alloy is Brass) Neutrik plugs. It's just a waste of good cable.
Anyway, Apologies to the OP.
If you want some proper Custom made cables, let me know.
We've got a 1m Transparent MusicLink Super not being used if you're interested. Also a very little used pair of Altlas Asimi Mk1
I think my original post is being mis interpreted. Regardless of comparisons between balanced and unbalanced - and as has been said - balanced can offer improvements over unbalanced, my point, that i occasionally pop up with, is to say that the whole expensive cable thing is a waste of time. I could write reams about how your signal has passed and been processed through metres and metres of plain old copper cable and through standard connectors. If people want to spend hundreds or even thousands on expensive cables and it makes them happy, then mission accomplished, it is all about happiness at the end of the day. I can't knock that. As has been said, using decent quality materials you can make up perfectly good leads for around £30. Any more, and in my opinion, you're kidding yourself. ABX testing, that's what proves what I'm saying.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vintagesteve
ABX testing doesn't prove anything other than one's inability to make a confident decision, when kept in the dark. Other studies have proved that humans are less likely to make a definite decision if they fear they are wrong, preferring to sit on the fence.
In ABX testing, the subject is required to identify X as either A or B. If X cannot be identified reliably with a low p-value in a predetermined number of trials, then the null hypothesis cannot be rejected and it cannot be proven that there is a perceptible difference between A and B. So regardless of whether the test subject can hear a difference or not, if they get the answer wrong, its determined as there is no perceptible difference.
What ABX testing doesn't test for is ANY difference in sound. In my opinion, it's a flawed argument for this reason.
The other fact is that you are relying on the listeners ability to actually know what to listen for. I've participated in and conducted blind tests, double blind tests and inflicted those tests on others without them knowing, and every time i do, they recognise that something is different, although they don't know what it is. That's the only result I am interested in. Whichever sound they preferred is up to them.
I don't buy into other people's opinions, I prefer to find out for myself. Maybe that's why our POV is so different.
All these cables discussions make me wonder if it is worth using anything much different than the “hook up” wire fitted inside the components. Sure a bit of shielding will help, but do we need anything too exotic?
No, you don't need exotic but you might like it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibster_2000
High quality metal of sufficient purity is all that's necessary and no, it needn't cost the earth.
I've made up various XLR (balanced) cables and every time I've spent more on better plugs and cable..........I can definately hear a difference. I've made one up with Neotech plugs and Neotech cable and is stunning. Cost me just over £200 for the plugs and cable, well worth every penny. I will try the Xhadow plugs at some point as they are widely regarded as the best in the world.
If you can hear no difference with a good balanced cable against a cheapie, thats up to you. I know I can, very easily.
Agreed. 100%Quote:
Originally Posted by Vince
It was advice and opinions offered to the OP to help Inform him on his next cable purchase.Quote:
Originally Posted by mac72
Apologies if the drift has not been beneficial
FFS ...here we go again...The OP is looking for a high end pair of XLR interconnects...If you want to start another cable discussion...don't do it here on Tim's wanted post...THREAD CRAPPING AT IT'S BEST....mods please tidy this thread up..and remove the crap...including my post...please!!
I agree that the point has been somewhat lost by some that this is a wanted ad for an XLR cable, posted in the classifieds section, and therefore not grounds for an in-depth cable discussion - or indeed one on ABX testing! Therefore guys, could we please restrict the input here now to solely offering appropriate cable recommendations to the OP?:)
That said though, a lot of what Oliver has stated is good advice and mirrors my own experiences with cables, where I've found that poor connectors can hobble an otherwise good cable. However, I wouldn't lump Neutriks into that category, although they can undoubtedly be bettered, simply because being constructed from brass is, IME, a limiting factor.
Anyway, let's leave that one there, folks, and get back on topic!:cool:
Marco.
There's a difference between poor quality, wobbly connectors and conductor purity. The first falls into the category of 'common sense', 'good quality' components and the other, the subject of great debate. Conductor purity will simply affect conductivity by ridiculously minuscule, immaterial amounts. It's easy for anyone to think and then state that they can hear a difference. ABX testing proves otherwise. There will always be audio 'psychiatrists' who like to debunk ABX testing citing nebulous aural/cerebral issues, I get that. No matter, at the end of the day you can either demonstrably hear the difference or you can't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
Apologies for distracting a straightforward, well meant request for advice into a debate. In my defence, I maintain that I gave advice, honest advice. Anyway, I'm out now.
Sorry, Steve, I know your heart's in the right place, but which part of this message didn't you understand:
:hmm:Quote:
Originally Posted by Marco
Please understand that the only person who gets the last word here is me, and when I say 'let's leave that one there, folks, and get back on topic', I mean it. Therefore once you've read this post, I'll be deleting yours above.
The next person to thread-crap this wanted ad will be out for a week.
Marco.
Tim, did you see this for sale thread?Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim F
https://theartofsound.net/forum/show...terconnects-1M
Thanks all for the advice. I have some hand made ones on the way from Vince, but will consider another set. I did see that advert. I already have some expensive silver litz stuff and was hoping to try something else.
Cheers, Tim
Hi Tim,Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim F
I have a rather brilliant idea (Modest) for a rather special set of cables. If you want to finance the experiment and keep them once built, I'll make them.
All I'm willing to mention is "Graphene"