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Well surprisingly the Young is now working again this morning. :)
But I have some reservations as to whether it will keep playing or stay stable since I have no idea why it played up yesterday - so for the time being the review of the DigiOne is on hold.
For many months I've been using the usb output from the pi2 or analogue out from pi2/iquadio dac and both of these methods have never had this problem. The problem has only occurred since I started using the Kali/Piano combination so I'm 100% certain the problem lies with either the Kali or the Piano. For sake of elimination I will try piCorePlayer 3.2.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cycleallday
Regarding the skipping problem, are you up-sampling?
nope, no up-sampling.
No - in fact all is pretty much as loaded except selecting the DAC board.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
In a different test I did find some upsampling caused a different type of skip - very obvious rather than a second or two.
The Kalli/Piano can also occasionally just go into a repeat of the same second of music and even shutting down Moode does not stop it - only pulling the power on the Kalli does ; thats also why I consider the problem device related.
Hmm... it does sound device related to me. I've not had anything like that. Might be best to let Andre know.
To be honest Ive rather given up on Allo kit and now use Audiophonics kit which I find better and their help/support (company and forum) is excellent.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
Allo obviously has Andre to help them but have you ever tried the actual Allo site help and forum - you should it was quite an (-ve) experience for me.
..
I've been using Kali/Piano 2.1 with the current versions of Moode and Volumio with no skipping at all. Earlier versions of Moode did produce occasional very short skips, much less than a second duration.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cycleallday
I think Allo's support for their products is pretty good btw.
Sorry to hear this. The Kali + Piano worked faultlessly in my system using a local HDD connected by USB to a Pi2B. I did not try connecting it to my network, except for internet radio where again it worked without any glitches in wireless mode.Quote:
Originally Posted by killie99
Dave, it's not a problem, I suspect it'll be caused by some odd ball interaction between the rpi and the piano. I'm going to get a rasp3 and see how
It goes with it.
What do you think to the sound?Quote:
Originally Posted by killie99
I think you said you have an IQ Audio DAC+ as well. Am I the only one who prefers the sound of the IQ? :scratch:
In all honesty there isn't much between USB from the pi to MDAC, IQaudio and the Piano - not sure I could tell the difference between iqaudio and Piano. Rpi USB to MDAC sounds different, up for debate what is better though!
It is worth remembering the Allo devices were designed to interface with their own single board computer which copied some of the Pi IO connections and did not necessarily conform to Pi standards and approvals unlike many EU designed and built DACs. They also did not run the PI op systems so it is quite possible there are anomalies when trying to mate with another device.Quote:
Originally Posted by killie99
respectfully , we will like to point out that unlike "other EU designed and build DACs" we build not only DACs but also recloakers isolators, transporters , digiones ,amps, relay attenuators and more importantly our own SBCs. In regards to the approvals , please note that we have CE/FCC like all our competitors. It is wrong to suggest "and did not necessarily conform to Pi standards and approvals unlike many EU designed and built DACs"Quote:
Originally Posted by Cycleallday
In regards to RPI OS...I can say that OS has nothing to do with hardware itself. The standards that you refer to do not belong to RPI, they are open standards (like i2s, i2c etc) and we fully conform to them.
At last , if you have a problem with your hardware please send us an email and we will assist you like we assist all of our customers.
We understand the preference that some people might have for units designed and build in EU. Our hardware is proudly build in India with some of the managers and designers proudly from EU. In the end we think that customers are free to buy whatever they want , from whomever they want and hopefully the decision is not based only on the country of manufacturing...but on innovation , good pricing and most important good sound .
My 2 cents.
Well said, hear hear, +1 etc.
With respect Audiohdwr, your website states:
"The PurePath software from TI is available for download (registration required) and can be used to create specific filters and other audio functions."
"Registration required" reminds me of the old Haynes Workshop Manuals, where they said "Remove the flywheel nut whilst holding the flywheel still". Easier said that done!!
As somebody who is in the electronics industry I was not able to get approval from TI to download PurePath. They control who can have this software very carefully (confirmed by an ex TI employee who could have got me an old copy). I was never able to create my own specific filters and other audio functions, and since this was on of the main reasons I bought the KALI + Piano, I am disappointed!
I am sorry if my reply was misunderstood or misread.Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
To clarify I did not say the Allo Pi related products did not conform to EU build and quality standards;
I stated ..some.. did not necessarily conform to PI standards.
This particular post discussion relates to the Kalli (Reclocker) /Piano 2.1 combination and the sound delivery issues which some of us experience when using it with the Pi.
Your website clearly states the Kalli "does not conform" to Pi standards as it is not HAT compliant.
https://www.allo.com/sparky/kali-reclocker.html
This standard attempts to ensure third party products will work well with the PI.
Quote from the Pi website relating to compliance:
"So yes it is more than the 40 pin connector it includes the size and location of the mounting holes, how the board and its capabilities are identified and software is configured..."
As the Kalli does not comply then the Kalli/Piano package does not comply and therefore I was stating the issue may be with the Pi/Allo interface.
As for your statement that the OS does not have anything to do with hardware then I respectfully suggest you discuss the subject with your designers to fully understand the reason why standards are put in place which are both hardware and software related. One is no good with out the other and hardware and software must interface correctly in order for orderly communication to happen.
Mel
I suggest you read posts carefully Luke - I am not attacking Allo in the way Andre has taken it and responded.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
I was attempting to add to the discussion the reason why I thought there may be problems.
My post was either misread or misunderstood so I have now clarified with links to sites or quotes which backup my statements.
Mel
I agree Dave, the Piano 2.1 was originally launched with promise of an app or similar to reconfigure the digital filters or amend the bass output channel to something else. This was all very vaguely worded and so was read in different ways by different people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Starterman
It never seemed to come to anything and seemed to be ignored in any question to Allo. If I remember correctly various posts can be found early on in this thread and in other Forums. This was one instance where my communication with Allo support was far from good.
However, let me state clearly I like the sound Allo products deliver and its just the issues I experience and the lack of support from Allo itself which is my issue.
My reason for not contuing with their products is only the support issues from the Allo site.
Anybody wanting an example try this recent one:
http://sparkyforum.allo.com/index.php?topic=1922.0
Surely a company who has designed a board using a third party dac chip to enable it to set its own filter settings could answer the question posted and not simply say go to somebody else?
Read others and see how many actually get a helpful solution.
Mel
Hi ,Quote:
Originally Posted by Starterman
We know of quite a few customers that have access to TI DSP file. http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/pc-ba...-volumio2.html
We are checking the exact steps to do so, but from what I remember you have to go to support forums and request access for it..and you will get it.
Hi,Quote:
Originally Posted by Cycleallday
Kali is not hat compliant ..that is correct. HAT compliance needs a specific size and , cutouts and some memory (for automated recognition still not fully implemented)
We have the memory but not the size and the cutout (PCB size)
So while Kali is not hat compliant , it certainly has nothing to do with i2s or i2c protocols. We assure you Kali is fully compatible with i2s , i2c and gpios .The fact that board is bigger...has nothing to do with technical compatibility
Now regarding help on software design of audio biquads, please understand that while we try our best to answer, we are not designers of audio DSPs. Surely TI forums or DIY forums are an appropriate way to get help for specific designs that suit your particular needs and equipment .
Are we being unreasonable ?
Thank you for agreeing the Kalli does not meet the published Pi standards for interface boards.Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
I note you avoid the comment on operating system and hardware interface importance.
About technical support - yes I consider it to be unreasonable that you cannot answer a technical question about a product you sell.
In this instance you selected a specific DAC from TI which allowed you to reconfigure the filters (rather than the preset version) and so you have the technical ability to set them yourselves.
Now why can you not help a customer to also reset them especially when one of your sales points was this ability.
Would you buy a car from a garage who sent you back to the engine manufacturer when you asked how to change the oil?
On the point of support I only see you as being the person who can communicate well on this and other forums.
However, looking back at your posts to members who have asked simple technical questions, and which you have then referred to your technical engineers, I see very few if any meaningful response being returned (refer to a range of posts in this thread from 153 to 167 as examples).
Finally, I started posting in this thread as being an enthusiastic user who answered questions or supported posts. From this recent debate with yourself (Andre) and the resulting replies which I then needed to support, I am probably now seen as an Allo beater which I am not.
My only issue with Allo is meaningfull post sales support. Your own website gives evidence to others on whether this can be viewed as good or bad - as can the responses from yourself in this thread for help, support.
I will make no further posts in this thread or any other in relation to Allo products
Mel
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cycleallday
""I note you avoid the comment on operating system and hardware interface importance.""
Our hardware is working with i2s and i2c protocols. Its fully compatible with those protocols . Not sure why we are talking about OS.
In any case , we apologies if you feel there is a problem with our software support on DSP files. We never intended to say that we will give support on the DSP custom designs.
In any case, this forums is about audio , so lets go back to the music...
It's a bit late for me. i have sold my Piano 2.1 etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Audiohdwr
Anyway, thanks for replying and hopefully it will help those with more staying power then me :-)
Fair enough Mel. Thanks for clarifying: you've made yourself much clearer in what you meant. The original post seemed a bit vague in exactly what you were criticising, more of a generalised dig at Allo not doing things by the book, so to speak, as compared to "many EU designed and made DACs", as if one minor problem experienced by a few users was symptomatic of wider issues in the quality of their products or approach. I see now that this isn't what you meant to imply :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Cycleallday
Hi guys.
Just to let you know. I'm currently running the Allo Isolator with the Boss Dac.
It's early days but so far it's really very very good indeed. So, watch this space for a full review very soon :)
Josie :)
Tease!Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
I'm good at that.Quote:
Originally Posted by LC1979
Sent from my 9001X using Tapatalk
The Also Boss (+ case) came yesterday and I have left it on all night to 'burn-in'. Initial impressions are very good with a more extended bass but still a little muddled I think when compared to my RPi3+ Audiophonics sabre. Mind you, the Boss is on a Rpi 2 with original PS whilst the Audiophonoics is served by a Linear PS...and different interconnects. The Boss is on Volumio and the Sabre on MoOde...so lots of little differences in set-up that may, or may not, influence the sq. I'll leave it for longer to burn-in. I have a 12v Anker battery somewhere so may try that.
Yours,
Richard.
I have another 12v battery with spade terminals. Can anyone recommend a dedicated lead that will allow connection to this and the Rpi?
Thanks.
Richard
Richard, I hope you remembered that the Rpi works off 5V?Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonky
Yikes! confuseddotcom here; so sorry; yes of course!
(although I have a 6.3V supply at present into my Rpi3 + Sabre DAC - I must have read somewhere that upping the voltage into a unit comprising two modules each of which would cause a voltage drop - is a Good Thing) (?)
Thanks,
Richard.
I'd seriously consider disconnecting the 6.3v supply ASAP. RPi supply is recommended at 4.75 to 5.25v, with a suggested top limit of ~5.8v. You may be getting away with it, but it could possibly catch up with you...
Hi, thanks. I believe the 6.3V powers the sabre DAC first (capable of a 9V + feed I believe) and the Rpi is fed a lower voltage from the DAC...but I could be wrong...(?)
Thanks again,
Richard
System
Roon Server
Raspberry Pi 2 running Ropieee as Roon Endpoint with HifiBerry Digi+ Pro
Raspberry Pi 3 running Ropieee as Roon Endpoint with Allo DigiOne
M2Tech Young DAC
Temple Audio Bantam One
Wilmslow Audio Gemini Speakers
Well it's been a while since I volunteered to review the Allo DigiOne (June - sorry for the delay but read on) but at last I can report my thoughts.
The Allo DigOne is an S/PDIF transport rather than a DAC - it provides the connection between your stored music files and your DAC.
Bit more background info here - https://www.allo.com/sparky/digione.html
Unfortunately the first Allo DigiOne that BlackAdder (Josie) forwarded to me was DOA (which was a shame) but Andre from Allo quickly organised a replacement unit so the testing/listening could start.
And all was going well - the Allo DigiOne when compared to the HifiBerry Dig+ Pro I was running at the time provided more detail and presence.
I have been trying the upsampling capability of Roon and was running at 24/192 quite happily and enjoying the experience.
However when running the Allo DigiOne whilst upsampling I experienced problems after pausing playback. Sometimes the Allo DigiOne appeared to lose 'control' of the connection between Roon/itself and the Young DAC.
And when this happened it was quite difficult to get the system to play properly again - to the extent of re-starting Roon, the Pi endpoints and the DAC.
So there then followed a number of emails between myself and Andre of Allo - who has been extremely helpful and responsive in all my dealings with him.
To the extent that he spent some time with his development team, sourced an older DAC and managed to reproduce the problem. And then produced a solution which resulted in him sending me another updated Allo DigiOne to test.
And I'm glad that Andre and his team went to this trouble because the Allo DigiOne has proved a more than capable device - which is staying in my system. :)
I had been running a HifiBerry Digi+ Pro as a Roon endpoint and was very happy with what I was hearing/experiencing with that unit.
However after running the Allo DigiOne for a few days and trying some A/B testing I have to say the Allo DigiOne edges the HifiBerry Digi+ Pro in terms of musical enjoyment and sonic reproduction.
For example I used Fools Gold by the Stone Roses to compare the two units. In this track there is a snare drum that is quite prominent in the mix - on the HifiBerry Digi+ Pro this sounded fine.
But when playing through the Allo DigiOne the snare became more 'lifelike' - it went from 'oh that's good' to 'blimey - that REALLY sounds good'.
There's just more of a 'crack' to the snare - almost as if you can hear the rattle of the wires on the snare rather than just the striking of the snare skin.
On other tracks cymbals have more life to them, more ring and sparkle/decay, piano sounds more lifelike - that's the best way I can describe the difference between the two units - the Allo DigiOne sounds more lifelike/open.
There's more clarity, detail and seperation to the music when compared to the HifiBerry Digi+ Pro.
So for me anyway the Allo DigiOne is an excellent piece of kit as an S/PDIF transport and I have to say a big thank you to Andre of Allo for all his help and advice.
Hiya guys.
First of all, sorry for the delay in reviewing this. Life is hectic at the moment.
A while ago I was given the Allo Isolator to try.
The isolator sandwiches between the RPI 3 and the Allo Boss DAC. See pic below.
Installation is quick and dead easy. It does however need a separate power supply. This I bought from CPC. (thanks Jez).
It can also be powered by rechargeable batteries to which I've not tried yet. This option is however recommended by Allo. So this is something I would like to try later on.
Once fitted the isolator needs to be powered up first before the Pi.
Once powered up there is no difference to the boot-up time using Moode.
I've been using the BOSS DAC for some time now and I personally prefer it to the Piano 2.1 and certainly find it a good leap forward over the IQ DAC+.
The BOSS DAC is lovely sounding. It's realism and speed is simply superb. So what can be improved on? Well I would have said nothing much but once the isolator was in place I found a very nice step up in clarity and definition.
The timing is also more engaging. Everything snapping in to place and with an impressive bass improvement.
When I first switched on the bass was the most noticeable aspect which I really noticed but after a week, then after two weeks the sound just got more and more lively, more stable and more balanced.
Right now it's opened up so much. It's a much different thing to how it sounded initially so if you purchase one I'd suggest a few weeks burn-in for true lovelyness. [emoji3] [emoji173]️[emoji3]
For now I've had it running with 16bit/*.khz as I always believe in native sampling rates.
Saying that it plays all native bit/sample rates including DSF (SACD) files perfectly which is cool.
So my conclusion with this combo is you have to hear it... It's a magical sound. It's not forced in any way, it's balanced [emoji3], powerful [emoji48] yet delicate [emoji22] and therefore brings out emotion in music.
If you are lacking any of these aspects then I recommend it wholeheartedly.
With all of my reviews I make sure I play my benchmark albums throughout and I also never try to read anyone else's reviews beforehand as I find it can sometimes cloud my judgement. Any equipment that is changed between reviews will be noted for you.
I hope this is helpful to you and as always I'm open to questions. [emoji3]
Btw.. I'm running the latest moode software with the advanced kernel.
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/201...ec30fd8399.jpg
Sent from my 9001X using Tapatalk
Josie, thanks for the Isolator update. I was looking to get one but I read some folks having trouble with the Isolator when resampling is in use. You reported no issues with higher native sampling rates. Can you confirm if your isolator works with resampling turned on in Moode?
hi Daru,Quote:
Originally Posted by Daru
Any isolators introduce a delay in the system in order of ns. In the case of slave DACs , all i2s signals are delayed so overall there is no impact . However in the case of master DACs the i2s signal has to travel one way (to RPI) and second time from RPI to DACs (second delay). Master DACs will then play up to 192Khz. Even then its possible to make a small change in the driver (that takes in account the extra delay) so it can play up to 384Khz.
regards
Andre
Sorcery! :eek:
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Black Adder
Richard, the Audiophonics Sabre REQUIRES 6-9V for operation as it regulates this down to both 5V for the Pi and 3.3 for the Sabre DAC. You can even run it on up to 12V but it will become warm and it wont be able to scrub enough voltage off of those 12v for the Pi and USB power. So you could overload any USB units attached to the Pi.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonky
Oh, and you should NOT supply any 5V via the Micro USB connector on the Pi!
Thanks; I'm along way from home at present, but as far as I can recall there is only one ps lead and that's to the Sabre. When I get back I need to compare that configuration with my RPi and ALLO DAC.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlfaGTV
Thanks again.